[number1sixerfan]

Last night with the Aperio and Valkyria was tough. Listening to each it's just so clear the faults that each have. This also makes each of them stand out as special in their own way. The Valk is more open with better spacing, and its timbre (vocals and instruments) just feels more right--this is easily its greatest strength. But the bass deficiency is also pretty clear against the Aperio, which has a really great bass presentation.

The Aperio's only flaw is that its presentation is intimate and somewhat closed in similarly to the Utopia IME. What it does in the space it does have however is pretty spectacular. It's more detailed than the Valkyria (which already is pretty great at detail resolution), and the speed/imaging within the space is pretty amazing as well. I do really like both of them a lot*, and I had similar experiences auditioning them--I knew very quickly that I wanted both after hearing them at shows, which is a rarity for me.

Randomly, I actually feel like the 007 properly powered is a good in between for both of them. Strong bass response although a bit less controlled, good spacing, great imaging and clarity while also being warmer.. it checks a lot of boxes. But for the life of me I just can't get it to sit on my head right at all. I know it's not an issue for a lot of other people, but I have a somewhat smallish peanut head (lol) and it just doesn't fit comfortably.

 

[Schelp san]

Last night with the Aperio and Valkyria was tough. Listening to each it's just so clear the faults that each have. This also makes each of them stand out as special in their own way. The Valk is more open with better spacing, and its timbre (vocals and instruments) just feels more right--this is easily its greatest strength. But the bass deficiency is also pretty clear against the Aperio, which has a really great bass presentation.

The Aperio's only flaw is that its presentation is intimate and somewhat closed in similarly to the Utopia IME. What it does in the space it does have however is pretty spectacular. It's more detailed than the Valkyria (which already is pretty great at detail resolution), and the speed/imaging within the space is pretty amazing as well. I do really like both of them a lot*, and I had similar experiences auditioning them--I knew very quickly that I wanted both after hearing them at shows, which is a rarity for me.

Randomly, I actually feel like the 007 properly powered is a good in between for both of them. Strong bass response although a bit less controlled, good spacing, great imaging and clarity while also being warmer.. it checks a lot of boxes. But for the life of me I just can't get it to sit on my head right at all. I know it's not an issue for a lot of other people, but I have a somewhat smallish peanut head (lol) and it just doesn't fit comfortably.

Listening to my properly powered 007 since few hours and enjoy it so much while now reading your last post. For me not every day is a 007 day, but if there is a 007 day (like today) it is still hard to beat.

I visited a small headphone exhibition (WOH) in Essen/Germany last Saturday, listened also to Aperio, Immanis, Susvaras etc.
I have to say that after listening to my own Stax chain at that evening for comparing, the Staxes are still strong and competitive in their overall qualities.
However, I do not deny e.g. the firm and punchy bass of the Aperio or this complete "authority" and resolution of an Immanis though. But in the end I was kind of happy that these short listening sessions (including background noises) were not awakening the big "itch"
When listening to the X9000 at the exhibition out of T8000 and a mediocre source, I thought OMG, how boring can this headphone sound. Even not considering the very different tuning and presentation, Aperio was many miles ahead. X9000 is IMO at least as difficult to drive as a 007, not talking of sheer power only.

 

[number1sixerfan]

Listening to my properly powered 007 since few hours and enjoy it so much while now reading your last post. For me not every day is a 007 day, but if there is a 007 day (like today) it is still hard to beat.

It is. I think very highly of it actually, despite my many contributions to the 009 vs. 007 debate over the years lol. When well powered it is just really really good.

I visited a small headphone exhibition (WOH) in Essen/Germany last Saturday, listened also to Aperio, Immanis, Susvaras etc.
I have to say that after listening to my own Stax chain at that evening for comparing, the Staxes are still strong and competitive in their overall qualities.
However, I do not deny e.g. the firm and punchy bass of the Aperio or this complete "authority" and resolution of an Immanis though. But in the end I was kind of happy that these short listening sessions (including background noises) were not awakening the big "itch"

That's the thing, no matter the advances in tech and the hobby overall, great is still great. The 009 in example, still hangs with anything made today, just with quirks that some ppl may not love. Even the best of the best is still only marginally better and you're going to pay a hefty premium. I have a lot of respect for people that choose more of a middle ground and stick to it. At the same time, like you say, the advantages of the Immanis, Aperio etc. are undeniable. But again, come at a premium for sure.

When listening to the X9000 at the exhibition out of T8000 and a mediocre source, I thought OMG, how boring can this headphone sound. Even not considering the very different tuning and presentation, Aperio was many miles ahead. X9000 is IMO at least as difficult to drive as a 007, not talking of sheer power only.

I don't think it's really about powering the x9000. For me, I knew since day one (literally, go back and check my initial impressions), that the x9k wasn't going to resonate with everyone. It's really laid back and polite, and just not what stats are typically known for. I had several great amps with it and its presentation just isn't for me ultimately. When I heard it just a week or so ago, I immediately thought, "this would be great to fall asleep to lol". Still, technically what it does is only really equalled by the Shang Sr. and to some degree the Imannis... it's just the presentation isn't for everyone.

 

[Hiker816]

The Valk is more open with better spacing

Really? I think the Valk is the most intimate sounding headphone I've ever heard. I'm trying to imagine what more intimate than the Valk would sound like, and I'm struggling. It's boggles my mind that the Aperio is even more intimate!

 

[Exekuhtor]

Really? I think the Valk is the most intimate sounding headphone I've ever heard. I'm trying to imagine what more intimate than the Valk would sound like, and I'm struggling. It's boggles my mind that the Aperio is even more intimate!

Seems like you never listened to the OG Utopia...
I'm actually thinking of trying out the Nutopia, haven't heard it, i read some people vastly prefer one version over the other. Maybe i'll get a nice deal on it.

 

[Spawn300Z]

How

Returned the B-21 Raider this morning. I'm honestly a bit sad, I really enjoyed having it. I have to give @Ray Samuels a major thanks for the opportunity! And when I returned it, he lured me into trying his Darkstar amp (incredibly powerful) with the Sennheiser HD600 just for a bit, and even that was an cool, really quick experience. It also reminded me just how much we jump off the deep end in this hobby, as the HD600 sounded amazing. It's always been a favorite of mine for it's balanced presentation and tonality. I have said over and over that the HE60 "Baby Orpheus" reminds me of it, but somewhat on steroids--the speed, clarity, staging, all a bit upped. But the HD600 for a few hundred bucks probably gets 80% of the way there. And through the Darkstar it sounded really amazing; really makes you question things lol.

I spent most of last night with the Shang Sr., Immanis and Valkyria. These are the headphones I enjoyed the most with the B-21 even though it was consistently great with everything. I really wish I took the Valkyria on my first visit to get Ray's reaction and impression. I have a lot of notes on synergy across all of my headphones, in comparison to my amps, so I'll share that eventually.

Today I'm continuing on with listening, and I have a tough task ahead... I need to figure out which to keep between the Valk and Aperio.. and right now I'm leaning heavily towards the Valkyria. But it's really tough. I cannot and will not keep both, but I may hang onto them both as long as I can lol

How does the Ray Samuels B-21 Raider compare to the Wells Audio Headtrip?

 

[number1sixerfan]

Really? I think the Valk is the most intimate sounding headphone I've ever heard. I'm trying to imagine what more intimate than the Valk would sound like, and I'm struggling. It's boggles my mind that the Aperio is even more intimate!

Yea, for sure. The Valkyria is more open than the Aperio. Mainly from a front to back perspective and depth. Width, left to right, isn't that much of a difference. Despite that the Aperio is still a bit more resolving.

 

[number1sixerfan]

Seems like you never listened to the OG Utopia...
I'm actually thinking of trying out the Nutopia, haven't heard it, i read some people vastly prefer one version over the other. Maybe i'll get a nice deal on it.

The Nutopia and OG Utopia aren't much different at all. The former has a rolloff in the highs that makes the midrange and overall tone a bit warmer and that's about it (which effectively addresses the brightness issues in the OG for many). Both are pretty good overall.

How

How does the Ray Samuels B-21 Raider compare to the Wells Audio Headtrip?

I haven't heard the Wells Audio Headtrip so unfortunately I can't compare the two.

 

[chesebert]

Last night with the Aperio and Valkyria was tough. Listening to each it's just so clear the faults that each have. This also makes each of them stand out as special in their own way. The Valk is more open with better spacing, and its timbre (vocals and instruments) just feels more right--this is easily its greatest strength. But the bass deficiency is also pretty clear against the Aperio, which has a really great bass presentation.

The Aperio's only flaw is that its presentation is intimate and somewhat closed in similarly to the Utopia IME. What it does in the space it does have however is pretty spectacular. It's more detailed than the Valkyria (which already is pretty great at detail resolution), and the speed/imaging within the space is pretty amazing as well. I do really like both of them a lot*, and I had similar experiences auditioning them--I knew very quickly that I wanted both after hearing them at shows, which is a rarity for me.

Randomly, I actually feel like the 007 properly powered is a good in between for both of them. Strong bass response although a bit less controlled, good spacing, great imaging and clarity while also being warmer.. it checks a lot of boxes. But for the life of me I just can't get it to sit on my head right at all. I know it's not an issue for a lot of other people, but I have a somewhat smallish peanut head (lol) and it just doesn't fit comfortably.

“properly powered” in the case of 007 means a $20k T2

 

[draytonklammer]

“properly powered” in the case of 007 means a $20k T2

10k if you hit it at the right time.
https://www.head-fi.org/classifieds/george-parris-stax-diy-t2-electrostatic-amp-the-ultimate.74069/

Good time to get into 580V estats.

If the X9000 didn't have channel balance issues, I'd have considered heading back into them.

 

[catscratch]

Randomly, I actually feel like the 007 properly powered is a good in between for both of them. Strong bass response although a bit less controlled, good spacing, great imaging and clarity while also being warmer.. it checks a lot of boxes. But for the life of me I just can't get it to sit on my head right at all. I know it's not an issue for a lot of other people, but I have a somewhat smallish peanut head (lol) and it just doesn't fit comfortably.

I have the opposite problem. I have a huge dome and the only way to get the 007 to fit properly is to either take off the suspension strap entirely or replace the elastic with something longer. Otherwise I kinda have to hold them in place and it's mega annoying.

If Stax releases a successor, they need to give them full swivel and articulation and a manually adjustable suspension headband like the rest of them have. The sound they can TBH keep the same. It's good enough. Though I'd like a bit more linear tuning with no weird resonances in the mids.

 

[number1sixerfan]

“properly powered” in the case of 007 means a $20k T2

I paid nowhere near $20k for mine, but that's not what I was insisting. Rather that the 007 is really hard to power and there is a pretty sizable difference going from something like the BHSE to (in my case) the T2. I would assume that could also be the case with other higher powered amps. The 007 and Shang Sr. are really the only two e-stats that I've seen the type of jump in performance.

I have the opposite problem. I have a huge dome and the only way to get the 007 to fit properly is to either take off the suspension strap entirely or replace the elastic with something longer. Otherwise I kinda have to hold them in place and it's mega annoying.

If Stax releases a successor, they need to give them full swivel and articulation and a manually adjustable suspension headband like the rest of them have. The sound they can TBH keep the same. It's good enough. Though I'd like a bit more linear tuning with no weird resonances in the mids.

Idk what they were thinking when they designed it. It's just such a poor design. Someone suggested modding it in various ways, but I just can't bring myself to do that to a vintage headphone.

 

[normie610]

Yea, for sure. The Valkyria is more open than the Aperio. Mainly from a front to back perspective and depth. Width, left to right, isn't that much of a difference. Despite that the Aperio is still a bit more resolving.

I concur in terms of openness and a front to back perspective and depth (though not in relation to Aperio since I've never heard it). But I think it depends on the amp as well, as I didn't have that experience when using my CFA3 with attenuator cable. Primavera is a match made in heaven for Valkyria.

 

[goldwerger]

Rather that the 007 is really hard to power and there is a pretty sizable difference going from something like the BHSE to (in my case) the T2

I love the my Mjolnir Carbon with the 007mk1, drives it very well. I’m not sure if the 007 will ve a long term keeper but this amp has the power and dynamics it needs to sour.

As does the T2 but different price bracket..

 

[dleblanc343]

I really had no clue that all of these variations existed. Every HD650 I heard, including mine, was definitely dark with similar character. This is all interesting to know. Also, reading all of this is really saddening because Sennheiser was once the epitome of a high end headphone brand (not saying they're chopped liver now or anything lol). I really hate that they were sold.

Oh the HD6XX is quite the rabbit hole.

As @mulveling stated, HD580 Jubilee is a special one and I am glad to own a pair.

Here's a bunch of my sets measured:

HD580's: @antdroid's Silk baffle 580 (green), White Paper baffle Flatplate (yellow), common silk baffle (red), Black Paper baffle Flatplate (purple).

Paper baffle 580's are the oldies from the 90's and generally sound more midrange-focused with more technicality and speed, but a bit of a light-footedness in dynamics.

HD580's (more): 580 Jubilee (orange), Raised Plate Black Paper (left and right channels) which I got signed by Axel Grell at NYC CJ 22.

These are my favorite sets and keepers. The white baffle is also a favorite but sadly has a small tear in it so it has channel imbalance in the upper mids a bit, so it's not as special as these two. The HD580 Jubilee is very reminiscent of HE60, but with a better tone and less technical ability.

HD650's & HD600: HD650 Black Silk baffle (Red), HD650 Double Magnet mod (Purple), HD650 Silver mesh baffle (Green), HD600 Silver mesh baffle (Blue)

My favorite of these sets is the Black Silk HD650 - that's one special headphone. Super organic and natural, but near perfect timbre across the board. It's the ultimate HD650 I've had the pleasure to hear and I've tried 50+ lol (it's a disease).

HD800's: HD800 ~2018 model (bright green), HD800 Low S.N w/ old style Brushed mesh baffle (purple), HD800S 75th Anniversary (Left/ yellow; Right/ forest green)

Despite the nasty 5.5-6kHz peak of the OG HD800, it still retains some magic that the HD800S does not capture in my opinion. The original (sub 15K Serial #) set is the best sounding of the lot.

That being said, none of the HD800's compare favorably to the previous generation HD6xx family when it comes to accuracy and musicality. It's definitely a headphone that was developed more so as a technical marvel rather than a natural listen.