[bcowen]

Many thanks for your guidance. bgrant.ru does not open. I will not pay a $100 for a tube for vali, anyway.

There's also this version of the Melz. Solid plates, metal base, early 50's manufacture. These are very good sounding tubes. Not to the level of the true 1578, but not priced that way either. I have a couple pairs and would rate them in the same ballpark as the ribbed plate Fotons. A little different in presentation, but overall at the same level. I have a pair of the later manufacture black base ones as well, and they're not worth spending money on even though they're comparatively cheap -- the new TungSol that Schiit sells is better (to my ears).

https://www.ebay.com/itm/2-x-RARE-6...743463?hash=item2617b8c9a7:g:uB8AAOSwsIFckjL7

 

[Paladin79]

Those even go for similar money as some of the ribbed plate Fotons so they are worth trying.

Here is a listing for metal can 6j5's, these are not my favorite but they are decent and readily available at low prices. https://www.ebay.com/itm/6-6J5-Vacu...m287ae9b98c:g:lHMAAOSw5apcaKfr&frcectupt=true

Then if you want to spend a bit more, go for Sylvania matched set black plate bottom D getters. I just bought some military version VT94D's, they are 6j5GT's.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Matched-Pa...hkAAOSwoX5avFt5:sc:USPSFirstClass!47403!US!-1

They look like this when you can find them but they are not readily available to my knowledge.

 

[Old Deaf Donkey]

There's also this version of the Melz. Solid plates, metal base, early 50's manufacture. These are very good sounding tubes. Not to the level of the true 1578, but not priced that way either. I have a couple pairs and would rate them in the same ballpark as the ribbed plate Fotons. A little different in presentation, but overall at the same level. I have a pair of the later manufacture black base ones as well, and they're not worth spending money on even though they're comparatively cheap -- the new TungSol that Schiit sells is better (to my ears).

https://www.ebay.com/itm/2-x-RARE-6...743463?hash=item2617b8c9a7:g:uB8AAOSwsIFckjL7

Thank you. These are available in Russia on Russian-language websites at very reasonable prices (say, $20 and less). However, the hemorrhoids of asking my Russian friends to pay, receive and resend are not worth it if one can be procured at ebay for $45. On the other hand, $100 is not a big deal to me if those 1578 are really good, I have spent many times more on tubes I probably won't stick in my Vali 2 again. Now i shall try the dual tubes and then see. Anyone with Melz 1578 in Vali 2, listening on AKG 702? Another reason for doubt is that as I wrote before the Russian audiophile fora seem to have a consensus that while MELZ 1578 is a decent tube, Sylvania's are better. May be the same bias for "foreign" tubes that we have this side of the curtain...

 

[Paladin79]

The Russians are paying shipping in some cases, EBAY fees, and possibly customs fees. I have friends from Russia trying to locate large quantities of new old stock but so far no luck. Later today I will try to post a couple photos of reflowing solder on tube pins, my technique may be different from others but I play it very safe, I even have practice tubes to employ before I mess around with expensive tubes.

 

[bcowen]

Later today I will try to post a couple photos of reflowing solder on tube pins, my technique may be different from others but I play it very safe, I even have practice tubes to employ before I mess around with expensive tubes.

Be very interested in seeing that, Tom. You've probably forgotten more about soldering than I've ever learned.

 

[Paladin79]

You are too kind Bill. If you gentlemen get serious about 6j5's, these are the tubes to watch for: On the right hand side are a pair of three hole black plate, bottom D getter tubes that are my favorites to date. The Naughty Girls, not to be confused with the 6sn7 Bad Boys.

 

[Old Deaf Donkey]

You are too kind Bill. If you gentlemen get serious about 6j5's, these are the tubes to watch for: On the right hand side are a pair of three hole black plate, bottom D getter tubes that are my favorites to date. The Naughty Girls, not to be confused with the 6sn7 Bad Boys.

Thank you once more for sharing. I will start my dual 65J quest from a pair of Philco and Super Silverstone (look the same), a matched pair of RCA, and a pair of 6S2S mabe by Novosibirsk factory in 1979. Then I shall see (or not...).

 

[Paladin79]

Here is the method I use for re-flowing solder on vacuum tubes. Some tips:

Use liquid rosin solder flux as well as rosin core solder 60/40 tin, lead is fine
Have isopropyl and a small file or emery board for cleanup
Use a flat tip soldering iron tip if you own one, otherwise try for a medium to large tip. I use 800 degree F Weller or similar in Hakko.
Use a heat sink clip, a device that will take away heat from the portion of the pin near the glass, a small alligator clip or hemostat can work.
Do not put the glass portion of a tube in a vise or holding device, hold by the base when possible.

 

[Paladin79]

I start by applying liquid rosin to the tip each pin, and putting the heat sink on the pin I am working on. Make sure the solder iron tip is kept clean and without excess solder on it. You are applying heat to the joint, you should not apply fresh solder to the tip of the iron, only to the tip of the tube pin you are working on. Make sure the rosin bubbles then apply solder and be sure the solder is melting and flowing inside the tube pin. When complete all tube pins should be shiny and bright without excess solder. Clean up any excess rosin from pins with alcohol, then use a file or emery board to remove any excess solder from tube pin shaft. I only apply the iron to the outside of the pins and not directly onto the very end where you are soldering, this will keep clean up simple and maintain that the solder is mainly on the inside of each pin. You also run less risk of the iron melting your pin tube guide if you stay on the outside of each pin. Rotate the tube in the vise as needed. I keep the tube parallel to the work surface and just keep rotating it to reach each pin as it comes toward the top. The solder should only be applied to each tube pin tip, you will see the old solder start to flow there as the rosin bubbles. The heat sink keeps the inside portion of the pin cooler so you run less risk of having solder flow back up into the tube and or cracking the tube glass. You can buy a bunch of old tubes for very little money to practice on, I would not start by soldering a $100 tube.

Capillary action will draw a bit of the fresh solder into the pin, using two layers of rosin helps clean the inside of the pin so that the tube elements make better contact. Rosin cleans the metal so that solder will adhere. Please let me know if any steps are unclear and I will post more photos. I prefer the heat sink method to assure I am not affecting getting solder back into the tube, you can try with the tube pins angled down a bit more as well.

 

[bcowen]

I start by applying liquid rosin to the tip each pin, and putting the heat sink on the pin I am working on. Make sure the solder iron tip is kept clean and without excess solder on it. You are applying heat to the joint, you should not apply fresh solder to the tip of the iron, only to the tip of the tube pin you are working on. Make sure the rosin bubbles then apply solder and be sure the solder is melting and flowing inside the tube pin. When complete all tube pins should be shiny and bright without excess solder. Clean up any excess rosin from pins with alcohol, then use a file or emery board to remove any excess solder from tube pin shaft. I only apply the iron to the outside of the pins and not directly onto the very end where you are soldering, this will keep clean up simple and maintain that the solder is mainly on the inside of each pin. You also run less risk of the iron melting your pin tube guide if you stay on the outside of each pin. Rotate the tube in the vise as needed. I keep the tube parallel to the work surface and just keep rotating it to reach each pin as it comes toward the top. The solder should only be applied to each tube pin tip, you will see the old solder start to flow there as the rosin bubbles. The heat sink keeps the inside portion of the pin cooler so you run less risk of having solder flow back up into the tube and or cracking the tube glass. You can buy a bunch of old tubes for very little money to practice on, I would not start by soldering a $100 tube.

Capillary action will draw a bit of the fresh solder into the pin, using two layers of rosin helps clean the inside of the pin so that the tube elements make better contact. Rosin cleans the metal so that solder will adhere. Please let me know if any steps are unclear and I will post more photos.

Thanks Tom! What are you using for a heat sink? Pic? (edit: nevermind...your pics just came through on the previous post)

I have some GE's to practice on if anybody needs some. They're about as crap as you can get. LOL!!

 

[Paladin79]

Look in the first two photos, the first photo has a tiny hemostat attached to the pin, the second photo has an alligator clip, look for the red handles. Those are acting as heat sinks.

If this method does not work, I have gone as far as removing the old solder from the inside of the pins, and applying fresh solder but this is not for beginners and you need more equipment.

 

[ilikepooters]

Thanks Tom! What are you using for a heat sink? Pic? (edit: nevermind...your pics just came through on the previous post)

I have some GE's to practice on if anybody needs some. They're about as crap as you can get. LOL!!

That would be a waste of even the cheapest lead free chinese solder

 

[bcowen]

That would be a waste of even the cheapest lead free chinese solder

ROFL!

 

[Paladin79]

I removed the solder from the inside of the top four pins, you will see the wire inside some of them, and some are hollow, not in use. This is the size solder I use for such an application on the lower left, it is .031 diameter Kester. You do not want to use large diameter solder if you can help it. This goes easily inside the pins without getting all over the outside. This is just a demonstration, were I to solder, I would be working with the pin with the hemostat on it.

I doubt I have many tubes from the 20's but I certainly have tubes from the 30's; some of those solder joints have been around a long, long time so the solder joints are pretty ancient. The Russians may have used poorer techniques or lower quality solder for the Melz tubes from the 80's to need re-flowing as well.

One last thing, I have many pairs of hemostats but the ones I use for this application do not have a huge amount of grip strength, I would not run the risk of flattening out the inside portion of a tube pin so be careful if you buy brand new ones and keep the pin toward the end where there is less force applied.

 

[Robert Padgett]

www.ebay.com/itm/1x-6S2S-6J5GT-6J5-VT94-Metal-base-Very-rare-USSR-12-1955/163618437406

A Melzonian single triode, but she will need a good comrade to work together...

www.ebay.com/itm/1pc-Dual-6J5G-6C5G-VT-94-L63-CV1932-VR67-VT154-TO-6SN7GT-CV181-B65-tube-adapter/201563928382

and this is a better price...