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using WAV files

Discussion in 'Sound Science' started by Anthony Campbell, Oct 2, 2017.
  1. bigshot
    I've done very careful testing and I've found at 256 and above AAC becomes completely transparent with all music. MP3 LAME is transparent at 320. I set up a test with three different codecs Frauenhofer MP3, LAME MP3 and AAC) and three different bitrates (192, 256 and 320) and gave it out to a lot of people. No one could tell the difference between 320 and lossless. Most couldn't tell 256. Some couldn't even tell 192.

    If you would like to put your observations to the test, I would be happy to give you a blind test to try and see how you do.
  2. Anthony Campbell
    Dbpoweramp looks good, but £51, bit too much.
    The only reason I use mp3 or wav is because, I use windows media player, and didn't really think about what else is out there. Until I joined here.......
  3. Roseval
  4. Strangelove424
    Exact Audio Copy is popular since it's free and checks the ripped data for accuracy. To be perfectly honest, I get the same amount of usefulness from VLC or Foobar, and the music sounds just as good after ripping but EAC will satisfy the neurotic. EAC can also be a pain sometimes due to what imo are overly complex setup options. On the other hand, it's free and does what it intends in providing precision assurance. As mentioned, I would think about switching to FLAC just to save storage space. There's no downsides to it I can think of, especially since you're on Windows.

    ABX please. Bigshot offered the files. I can give you some too.
    Last edited: Oct 3, 2017
  5. Redcarmoose
    This statement may seem redundant for some here but ..........

    Your end sound is also fully dependent on the other equipment.

    So it can actually be the case where your headphones, amp and decoder DAC provide together the optimal listening experiences. Regardless if trying to milk sonic juice from a format choice.
    Last edited: Oct 3, 2017
  6. Redcarmoose
    image.png I have found prejudgment to truly cause confusion. Hence I really thought FLAC sounded better than 320 before my tests.

    My latest issue has been thinking I could hear jitter from any USB implementation used. I have now gone computer-less. I found one of my TVs had great FLAC and MP3 decoding optically to an off-board DAC. Though my reference is now always original 44.1/16 store purchased CDs.
    Last edited: Oct 3, 2017
  7. Anthony Campbell
    Thank you for all the advice folks. I never knew there was more/better options than using windows media. Oh Roseval, you were right to check, error correction wasn't selected
  8. Anthony Campbell
    I downloaded the trial version of dbpoweramp, ripped Dave Gilmour's live in Gdansk, and played fat old sun, and there was no obvious crackling noise evident. So I'm going to copy as much as I can in the 21 days, then install it on my works pc. Once again, thank you guys for opening my eyes, and ears.
  9. bigshot

    Not likely at all.
    Redcarmoose likes this.
  10. Redcarmoose
    That's what I thought 7 years ago. Now there is a multitude of products making up a million dollar industry to clean jitter from USB.
  11. bigshot
    I wouldn't judge the importance of a problem by how much people pay to fix it. Jitter is inaudible in just about every home audio product from the humblest to the most expensive. Jitter is a bugaboo created with the specific purpose of parting people with OCD from their money. It's a new inaudible number to throw money at improving. It just doesn't matter.
    Brooko likes this.
  12. pinnahertz
    Not a chance. In fact, most people (and I wouldn't be very wrong to say "all") wouldn't even know what audible jitter sounds like anyway. It has to be rediculously huge to be audible, and even then the result is nothing like what most people even think of or imagine jitter sounds like.
    No you haven't.....:wink:
    people seem to like analog tape and the vinyl pressed from it, but that medium has 100x as much "jitter" as even the worst digital audio system. And nobody's trying to fix that.
  13. Strangelove424
    I have never heard jitter, and have no idea what it actually sounds like, but if I did I think it would sound like wow and flutter. I look at those kilobuck systems with reel to reels and it makes me wonder what they're thinking. Even a new tape for ~$400, inferior from the start, won't end up standing the test of time. Files don't age. No wow or flutter, and jitter that I've heard... whatever that sounds like. Perhaps like an el chupacabra howling into the wind.
  14. pinnahertz
    You've never heard digital jitter because it's inaudible unless it gets really, really bad. Which it doesn't. It doesn't sound like wow and flutter because while it too is essentially a frequency modulation component, the modulating frequency is very high and often random, unlike flutter and wow which are relative low modulating frequencies and cyclical. The analog version of jitter in tape is a high frequency longitudinal vibration that happens when tape is pass over stationary tape path components with large unsupported lengths of tape between them. It's called "scrape flutter". It shows up as a sort of modulated noise component heard around signals with relatively low harmonic content to mask it, piano for instance. It's a factor in pretty much all analog tape recorders, though is minimized below audibility in the best of the best transports with the use of roller guides.

    I really think comparison of analog and digital from the standpoint of long term preservation is a separate discussion, though. Digital does not have a good record so far when compared to anything analog, with the exception of the analog tape binder-breakdown problem of the late 1970s and 1980s. Otherwise old recordable digital media hasn't done well by comparison.

    I agree that a new tape will be inferior to any digital recording of the same master.

    And that chupacabra howl would be the last sound you ever hear....
  15. Redcarmoose
    This is SS and I am the first to admit I'm on a wild goose chase. It's like a reverse Chupacabra placebo effect. Probibly a mental issue like agoraphobic fears, thus based on unknown fears.

    It started back in 2010 before I added Wasapi to Foobar. It was a timing issue and going Wasapi fixed it. Finally I simply spent years listening and started to think original CDs played in a high quality transport sounded like they had more natural timing?

    In the next year I'm planning on making some pretty substantial equipment upgrades, and of course I'll always be going back to listen to computer USB audio. At some point I will try and have my wife do a blind test switching between USB and CD.
    Last edited: Oct 4, 2017

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