Upgrading from HD650: AD2000 or D7000?
Sep 6, 2009 at 4:41 AM Post #16 of 63

shellylh

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The D7000 is not in the same league as the HD800 except in the price tag (at least in my opinion).

If you want to upgrade to another tube amp in the future, stay away from SP. One amp which I can recommend is the Woo Audio 6SE (well built, good customer service, sounds great, good price and made in the USA). It is transformer coupled so it can be used with high and low impedance cans. There are other options as well, just stay away from SP.

Quote:

Originally Posted by MikoLayer /img/forum/go_quote.gif
Sorry I wasn't being clear. Maybe they are like antithesis of each other even, what I meant was some consider them being so good that they belong in that 'tier' or bracket if you know what I mean. As for me, I have no idea, never heard anything that bass heavy anyway
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If anything, I am a bit worried I might get a slight headache from it if bass is too strong for me to handle.

Now you bring up something interesting there! Since I am the OP, I will take a liberty of digressing at will. I intend to hang on to my HD650s till the end, so I am already upgrading some other bits of it (ordered new cables, new DAC, etc). The thing is, I am not looking to spend more than $1k on the new amp
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I have read some other threads, exchanged PMs with some individuals to look for my next amp for HD650. MPX3 is what I had in mind, extreme being another alternative. Care to add some food for thought?
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Sep 6, 2009 at 4:50 AM Post #17 of 63

mrarroyo

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It has been a while since I listened to the AD2000, they were a very nice sounding can. I have never cared for the Senn HD580/600/650 even with various aftermarket cables and a bunch of amps. They just do not sound right to me, thus I prefer by a large margin the Denon D2000 or the D5000 w/ the MarkL mods and a pair of bubinga wood cups.
 
Sep 6, 2009 at 4:53 AM Post #18 of 63

MikoLayer

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Quote:

Originally Posted by shellylh /img/forum/go_quote.gif
The D7000 is not in the same league as the HD800 except in the price tag (at least in my opinion).

If you want to upgrade to another tube amp in the future, stay away from SP. One amp which I can recommend is the Woo Audio 6SE (well built, good customer service, sounds great, good price and made in the USA). It is transformer coupled so it can be used with high and low impedance cans. There are other options as well, just stay away from SP.



I am well aware of the ongoing and current issues with SP amps. The only ones I am considering are those that have already been properly modified for safe operation, or cheap enough to get that done myself. They are undervalued atm, which is precisely why I find them attractive
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WA6 is of course another one I am interested in, except they seem so popular it is nearly impossible to find a used (and thus discounted) one. SE is probably bit out of my budget anyway. I did some reading/PM'ing on that too, and found out I am more likely to be drawn into more euphoric, laid-back presentation SP amps are known for. Finally, I will be semi-permanently moving out of the states sometime next year, so I am afraid woo amps are no better should a need for repair arise (granted, they are MUCH better built to begin with it appears)
 
Sep 6, 2009 at 5:01 AM Post #19 of 63

El_Doug

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Quote:

Originally Posted by MikoLayer /img/forum/go_quote.gif
granted, they are better built to begin with it appears


understatement of the century
 
Sep 6, 2009 at 5:51 AM Post #20 of 63

TheAudioDude

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Well here's my opinion... it's just opinion so take it for what it is.

My vote is for the D7000. To be honest, I think that a headphone with little bass would be very fatiguing. I'm not heavily into audio yet but I can imagine a headphone that doesn't 'complete' the spectrum as being pretty hard to listen to; whether the highs are veiled or the low-end is lacking. Just imagine listening to a speaker setup with no subwoofer, say a bunch of bookshelf speakers. Sure, they can have decent bass but you just won't get the experience as if you had a good subwoofer that reached down low. Then imagine listening to a speaker system with veiled highs. Same thing there: the sound just doesn't invite you in to listen.

I know that some open headphones give you great bass, but I don't know if you will get that extra oomph with them that draws you into the music.

I don't want to start a flame war, but I don't understand people who say that the D7000 has too much bass. I feel that the bass is just about perfect. On music like Pink Floyd, the music as a whole just sings to you. The bass is so rich, the midrange is smooth and the highs are well-defined; it's as if I'm listening to a high-end speaker system. The Wall (my favorite album of all-time) is an experience with these headphones. The Dark Side of The Moon is incredible; the song 'Brain Damage' is nothing short of spectacular. Even with Dave Matthews, everything is as you expect it to sound. The low-end draws you in but the rest of the music just carries you along.

I definitely wouldn't call these headphones bottom-heavy; they just cover the low end extremely well, and people coming from open headphones just aren't used to that. Again, not trying to start an argument but I feel that if you're listening to headphones that accentuate or veil certain ranges, you're going to immediately have an opinion against headphones that do the opposite. I'll admit I already have an opinion against headphones that do not have deep rich bass, so just take this for what it is. But I also know when too much is too much, and the Denons definitely do not have too much.
 
Sep 6, 2009 at 5:53 AM Post #21 of 63

El_Doug

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Quote:

Originally Posted by TheAudioDude /img/forum/go_quote.gif
Well here's my opinion... it's just opinion so take it for what it is.

My vote is for the D7000. To be honest, I think that a headphone with little bass would be very fatiguing. I'm not heavily into audio yet but I can imagine a headphone that doesn't 'complete' the spectrum as being pretty hard to listen to; whether the highs are veiled or the low-end is lacking.



The AD2K really arent lacking in any meaning of the word - they simply do not have overpowering bass like the Denons
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but in all honesty, when compared to most open headphones, the AD2K's have 4.5/5 star bass - imho, only the HD800 can successfully trump it
 
Sep 6, 2009 at 5:59 AM Post #22 of 63

TheAudioDude

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Quote:

Originally Posted by El_Doug /img/forum/go_quote.gif
The AD2K really arent lacking in any meaning of the word - they simply do not have overpowering bass like the Denons
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but in all honesty, when compared to most open headphones, the AD2K's have 4.5/5 star bass - imho, only the HD800 can successfully trump it



Exactly what I mean! To say that the Denons are overpowering is truly an over-statement. But to each his own! I guess this is just the way different people hear and interpret music. I respect your opinion but I wholeheartedly disagree.
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Sep 6, 2009 at 6:01 AM Post #23 of 63

El_Doug

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And I respect your right to disagree.... even though youre wrong
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I owned the L3000's, and found their bass exquisite. The D7000's, on the other hand, have the same bass quantity, but without nearly as much finesse as the leatherheads. imo, of course
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Sep 6, 2009 at 6:07 AM Post #24 of 63

TheAudioDude

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Quote:

Originally Posted by El_Doug /img/forum/go_quote.gif
And I respect your right to disagree.... even though youre wrong
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I owned the L3000's, and found their bass exquisite. The D7000's, on the other hand, have the same bass quantity, but without nearly as much finesse as the leatherheads. imo, of course
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Yeah I probably am wrong, actually. Perhaps one day I'll be able to afford something like the L3000s.
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Sep 6, 2009 at 6:22 AM Post #25 of 63

MikoLayer

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This is great guys, thanks for keeping it civil. I do happen to be quite sensitive to fatiguing sound, and have a thing for smooth, lush sound. This is why I was thinking D7000 might be what I have been missing. Damn, why can't there be just one perfect type of headphones
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Sep 6, 2009 at 6:30 AM Post #26 of 63

myk7000

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If its any consolation to you, I had in my possession the hd650 and the d7000 at the same time and tried to decide between the two. I ended up choosing the d7000 after long deliberation.

I tried the ad2000 at a meet though and can say I wasn't impressed. Just my opinion about these headphones though.
 
Sep 6, 2009 at 7:01 AM Post #27 of 63

hifidk

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I had owned HD580/600/650, AD700/900/2000 and D2000/7000, so maybe I can say a word on this thread. First of all, as mentioned already, AD700/900 sound nothing like AD2000. Even though they share the same name, they are totally different phones. Lower models have much wider soundstage than AD2000 (more airy) but lack bass impact/quantity. I actually preferred AD900 over AD2000 but it was because I liked HD600 + AD900 combo better than AD2000 and couldn't afford to keep all three.

Now for the D7000, I don't think they have overpowering bass. I am not bass-head at all since I really enjoyed AD900 (which lack bass), stock W5000 and many other phones that are considered to have light bass. D7000 has tight, controlled bass in my opinion (I even thought they had less bass quantity than HD650 but I didn't have both phones at the same time so I can't do A/B comparison). On the other hand, I didn't really like D2000 or DT770 because of their "overpowering" bass. So, I believe that D7000 have quality bass and does not sacrificing mid/high.

1. Amping: I thought both headphones were fairly easy to drive but many people say both greatly scale up with 'proper' amping.

2. Open vs. Closed: I think AD2000 soundstage is just okay for open-design and D7000 soundstage is pretty good for closed-headphone. I didn't have both headphones at the same time, so I don't know how they compare but certainly AD2000 is more airy and D7000 is more intimate, exciting.

3. Comfort: Both are pretty comfy, but I think D7000 is more comfortable. A lot of members didn't like how AD2000 fit (vice grip).

4. HD580/600: I think both AD2000 and D7000 do not sound like HD580/600 but if I have to choose one, I think AD2000 is closer in sound.

I actually loved both D7000 and AD2000 and think that both of them are very musical and enjoyable. If I were to choose more all-around headphone, I would choose D7000. It doesn't sound like closed-phone and airy enough for me. It has plenty of detail and speed also, and is very smooth and non-fatiguing. D7000 is very good for rock, electronic, and acoustic in my opinion.

Of course, this is all IMO and I think there will be plenty of other members who would disagree with me.

Hope this helps.

EDIT: Oh, by the way, I would choose D7000 and/or AD2000 over HD650 but I have to confess that I didn't have $1000 amp to pair with HD650.
 
Sep 6, 2009 at 8:46 AM Post #29 of 63

hifidk

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Quote:

Originally Posted by moonboy403 /img/forum/go_quote.gif
Your F5005 deserves better upstream equipment!
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Haha, yes. I am actually looking for Glite or WA3/6.
 
Sep 6, 2009 at 9:01 AM Post #30 of 63

moonboy403

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Quote:

Originally Posted by hifidk /img/forum/go_quote.gif
Haha, yes. I am actually looking for Glite or WA3/6.


I personally liked the maxxed out WA2 better than the maxxed WA6 SE for the W5000. The WA2 matches the W5000 beautifully in terms of its midrange and wide open soundstage.
 

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