Ultrasone HFI 580 or 780 with unamped iPod?
Nov 28, 2008 at 9:14 PM Post #16 of 39

Antony L

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Quote:

Originally Posted by Peter Pinna /img/forum/go_quote.gif
Nat King Cole and Dianna Krall are (were) Jazz performers. Nat Cole performed, in his day, what was considered popular music (he was a very popular performer in his lifetime especially considering that he was a black man during a time when prejudices were stronger from white people against black people) but the arrangements written for him were rooted in Jazz harmonies and rhythms and Nat Cole's interpretations and phrasing were rooted in what you might call a "Jazz feel". Nat Cole, in addition to his popular singing career was also a superb Jazz pianist, in case you didn't know.


Thats what i meen that i wasnt into jazz ect but am now(always liked rat pack ,swing sort of music) btw it was reading alot of your posts that made me think about ultrasone ,very pleased i did
 
Nov 28, 2008 at 11:16 PM Post #17 of 39

Peter Pinna

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Quote:

Originally Posted by Antony L /img/forum/go_quote.gif
Thats what i meen that i wasnt into jazz ect but am now(always liked rat pack ,swing sort of music) btw it was reading alot of your posts that made me think about ultrasone ,very pleased i did


I'm glad I could be of help to you. As you probably know from reading my posts and some of the reactions to my post, not everyone agrees on headphone preferences. That is why I always try to tell people that yes, I really enjoy the Pro 750 but they may not (either at all or as much as I do).
In the final analysis, it is entirely up to each individual as to what headphone they prefer.
On to the subject of music, since you enjoy the swing type of Jazz and the vocalists, there are two albums I suggest you buy:
Sinatra at The Sands with Count Basie and His Orchestra and
Count Basie Live at the Sands (before Frank)

Here are Amazon.com links for these albums:

Amazon.com: Sinatra at the Sands: Frank Sinatra with Count Basie & the Orchestra: Music

Amazon.com: count basie live at the sands

There is a special sale at Amazon.com right now and the Sinatra at the Sands album is about half price.

Since you like this type of music, as I do, I am sure you will enjoy these recordings.

You should hear them through the Pro 750! Wow! I would imagine they sound great through the other Ultrasone's too. With the Pro 750, it sounds like you're right in the middle of the orchestra with Sinatra singing right in front of you. BTW, there's a point of disagreement to use as an example. Some people do not like this type of sound stage (where it seems as though you are in the middle of the orchestra) but, instead, they prefer the sound stage to seem as though the Orchestra is in front of you. And, others prefer the "in your head" sound stage. There's no accounting for tastes. As I said before, preferences are very different at times and very individualistic.

Edit: I just read something in one of your posts that caused me to write this edit. If your 780 is sounding a little too high pitched or shrill, and you have to use an EQ adjustment, chances are very high that, if there's nothing wrong with your audio chain, your 780 needs more burn in time. With the 750, I was still noticing changes in the sound even after 250 hours. When you first start a burn in with a new pair of Ultrasone headphones, play music through them at a softer than "normal" volume for about the first 50 hours, then increase the volume to what most people with "normal" hearing would consider to be a "normal" listening volume for about the next 100 hours. After this they will start being more listener friendly. There will still be more changes in the sound up to around 300 hours but after 250 hours those changes will be less noticeable.
I'm not sure about the HFI 780 in this regard, but the Pro 750 definitely sounds best with a completely flat EQ adjustment or not using a graphic equalizer at all, IMO. As you said about the 780, similarly the 750 exposes what ever is on the recording. However, with an improperly recorded recording, I also understand, as unforgiving as these headphones are, why you would want to make an EQ adjustment to suit your listening preferences.
 
Nov 29, 2008 at 1:10 AM Post #18 of 39

1Time

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Quote:

Originally Posted by toxic888 /img/forum/go_quote.gif
Unfortunately the 750 is out of my price range and the Impedance is a bit high. :/
And those should definitely be used with an amp, right?



IMO, all headphones "should" be used with an amp. I owned the Proline 650 and used it from my PC, and although it was awesome with bass heavy music at high volumes, if owning it again I definitely would amp and mod it. However, the Prolines are geared more for critical listening, whereas I think the HFI models are geared more for fun. Without an amp and from an ipod, I'd go with the HFI580. If amping, even with only a Fiio, then it would be a tougher choice for me between the HFI580 and HFI780.
 
Nov 29, 2008 at 2:11 AM Post #19 of 39

toxic888

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Hmm interesting
k701smile.gif


I guess I'll get an HFI 780 with a FiiO E3 and Senn. PXC 300 or 250's on the side
ksc75smile.gif


Denon's would really be nice though... how about this:

Denon AH D2000's with a FiiO, HFI 780 with a FiiO, or PRO 550 (or 650? tell me which one is centered more towards bass response) with a FiiO? Which one would you take?

Unfortunately I don't have the funds to get an iBasso D:
 
Nov 29, 2008 at 2:42 AM Post #20 of 39

1Time

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Quote:

Originally Posted by toxic888 /img/forum/go_quote.gif
Hmm interesting
k701smile.gif


I guess I'll get an HFI 780 with a FiiO E3 and Senn. PXC 300 or 250's on the side
ksc75smile.gif


Denon's would really be nice though... how about this:

Denon AH D2000's with a FiiO, HFI 780 with a FiiO, or PRO 550 (or 650? tell me which one is centered more towards bass response) with a FiiO? Which one would you take?

Unfortunately I don't have the funds to get an iBasso D:



This thread might help. From those with the Fiio, I'd probably buy the HFI780.
 
Nov 29, 2008 at 3:18 AM Post #22 of 39

toxic888

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mrarroyo you're killin me D;

I will be living on the streets if I purchase the 750's...

Are you absolutely sure these are hands-down the best option for me? Is there a sufficient amount of bass response on these (of course, very well defined i presume ;D...)? Remember I do not listen to classical but rather rock/techno/bass-y music. I am not worried about a very analytical, flat sound however.

I just don't want to purchase headphones that I will not be using to full potential (or do I? ;D...). Like I said before, I will probably only be amp-ing these headphones with a cheap amp for now. Let's hope I get the answer I'm hoping for :p
 
Nov 29, 2008 at 3:24 AM Post #23 of 39

mrarroyo

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No, only you can determine what is best for you. My point was that instead of getting two "almost ran" get one that won!

I also strongly suggest you buy used. You will get a much better value for your money. For example an used 750 will go for about $200 not far from the cost of a new HFI-780.

I should mention that the ear cup on the 750 or the 2500 is a bit larger and thus more confortable than the HFI-780.

Is there going to be a meet close to you? You can audition a lot of gear at a meet.

I have an HFI-780 and did not care much for them in stock form. I ended spending well over $290 in getting the APureSound V3 re-cable. Now they are very nice sounding.
 
Nov 29, 2008 at 3:39 AM Post #24 of 39

toxic888

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Where would you suggest I buy a used PRO750? I don't see them around anywhere. Link me to a site, or forum site where used headphones are sold?

Wouldn't you recommend I buy a new pair instead... I have no problem burning them in for two weeks straight -_-

$290 sounds to me like an insane amount of money for a cable... on the other hand, some guy I knew dished out over 50 grand on audio equipment; thousands on cables alone...
I just don't get it ;P
 
Nov 29, 2008 at 5:21 AM Post #25 of 39

Peter Pinna

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Quote:

Originally Posted by toxic888 /img/forum/go_quote.gif
Where would you suggest I buy a used PRO750? I don't see them around anywhere. Link me to a site, or forum site where used headphones are sold?

Wouldn't you recommend I buy a new pair instead... I have no problem burning them in for two weeks straight -_-

$290 sounds to me like an insane amount of money for a cable... on the other hand, some guy I knew dished out over 50 grand on audio equipment; thousands on cables alone...
I just don't get it ;P



There are a few things I want to write to avoid any confusion.
First, there are people who are completely satisfied with the HFI 780 in it's original form (with it's original cable).
Regarding the bass frequency sound of the Pro 750, what you will hear (as long as there is no graphic equalizer adjustment that would alter the sound of the original recording) is what the sound engineer intended for you to hear. If the original recording has a "boomy" bass, that is what you will hear through the 750. If the original recording has a bass that you can hardly hear, that is what you will hear through the 750. If the recording is recorded correctly, and the bass is "right on", that is what you will hear with the 750.
I think you should hear both the HFI 780 and the Pro 750 before you decide.
If you want my personal opinion, I've written this before, I'm writing it again, I truly like the way bass as well as the full frequency range sounds on the Pro 750. Since your question is specifically about bass, I will make a point of writing that bass, when properly recorded, sounds beautiful on the Pro 750.
About where you might be able to buy a Pro 750 used, you could look in the gear for sale / trade section of Head-Fi. However, I would suggest to you that you don't buy used because when you buy the Pro 750 from an authorized Ultrasone dealer, the headphones have a 2 year warranty. When you buy it used, there is no warranty. The same is true for modifying the headphones. After being modified (for example, re-cabled) the warranty is voided.
If you want to re-cable a Pro 750, because it has a detachable cable, the best option, IMO, is a custom cable that has the same screw type plug that the stock cable has. This way you can just screw it in as you would the stock cable. And, if ever the headphones need repair, you just unscrew the custom cable and send the headphones to Ultrasone. If memory serves correctly, Moon Audio offers such a cable specifically designed for the Pro 750.
Places on line for you to look for the Pro 750 would be Northern Sound and Lights, B & H Pro Audio and Amazon.com. Northern Sound and Lights sometimes offers a substantial discount on their merchandise, if you request an E-mail from them with a discounted price. This is done through their web page and there is a notation next to the product description saying whether there is a better (discounted) price available.
As far as buying an amp is concerned, why don't you wait on that? Yes, it is true that all headphones sound better with a good amp. I have heard the Pro 750 attached to an iPod shuffle. While I admit I am not a fan of mp3 players, generally, I was surprised at how strong the volume was coming from the Pro 750 when it was plugged into the iPod shuffle with no dedicated amp.
Since you have more than indicated that you are on a budget, if you want to buy an amp, I suggest you look into the Behringer Amp 800. This particular dedicated headphone amp, while not the "world's greatest" headphone amp, has a very nice neutral sound. A sound better than you would probably expect from an amp that has a retail cost of about $80. Here's even better news: this amp sells for less than retail on Amazon.com where the price is approximately $40. I use this amp myself attached to my office computer's sound card for listening to music while I'm working. While I would not recommend this amp as a "main" headphone amp for a sound professional or a true audiophile, for such an inexpensive amp, I think you will be surprised at how basically good the sound is from it.
Since you are on a budget, my suggestion to you is that you buy these components over time if you want a cable that is supposedly better than the stock cable. I wrote "supposedly" because there is another area of disagreement: whether or not these custom cables sound better than the stock cables. AFAIK, I have never heard a custom cable so I can not give a personal opinion on this matter.
You may be able to find a special price on a new Pro 750 from an authorized dealer. You could buy that first if the price is right for you. Then, in a month or so, you could purchase the Behringer Amp 800 for only $40. Then, you could live with that for awhile. Don't worry, the stock cable does not, in any way, sound bad. The stock Pro 750 headphones with the stock cable sound great, IMO.
I'll put it this way, I may, at some point purchase a custom cable (more out of curiosity than any other reason) but I am definitely not in a hurry to do so. I am very happy with the way the Pro 750 sounds with the stock cable.
If you don't have quite enough money, even with a discount, remember the old saying, "Good things come to those who wait."
I want to regress to an idea I expressed at the beginning of this post: There are people who are completely satisfied with the sound of the HFI 780 (with it's stock cable) and you may find that you might be one of them and it would be less expensive for you. On the other hand, you could wait a little while longer, save up more money and buy the Pro 750 or an even more expensive headphone such as the Edition 9 if you are willing to extend that wait even more.
 
Nov 29, 2008 at 7:57 AM Post #26 of 39

toxic888

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Wow. Thanks. That cleared a few things up.

I did get the northern sound and lights best price a few days ago, they really have some nice prices. Have you heard either the PRO series 550 or 650? If so, I'm guessing the 750 is a big step up. I will go check out the SQ and sound signature on all of these. If I somehow manage to find all of them, in my area, in the same store, right next to each other, hopefully I'll be able to make up my mind myself :p
 
Nov 29, 2008 at 8:24 AM Post #27 of 39

Peter Pinna

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Quote:

Originally Posted by toxic888 /img/forum/go_quote.gif
Wow. Thanks. That cleared a few things up.

I did get the northern sound and lights best price a few days ago, they really have some nice prices. Have you heard either the PRO series 550 or 650? If so, I'm guessing the 750 is a big step up. I will go check out the SQ and sound signature on all of these. If I somehow manage to find all of them, in my area, in the same store, right next to each other, hopefully I'll be able to make up my mind myself :p



I have heard the Pro 450 (that is not a misprint, I do mean the 450) and the Pro 650. For a $100 headphone, the 450 has a nice full bodied sound. In sound quality, the 650 is a significant improvement in sound quality over the 450. The sound of the Pro 750 is better, IMO, than the 650. The Pro 750 is my favorite headphone of not only the Pro series but also compared to other headphones that I've heard so far. I have not heard the Pro 550, 900 or the Edition 9 among others.
You mentioned the idea of investigating a couple of models of Dennon headphones. I suggest you definitely also do this. As I've said before the decision is all yours.
 
Nov 29, 2008 at 9:49 AM Post #28 of 39

Antony L

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Quote:

Originally Posted by Peter Pinna /img/forum/go_quote.gif
I'm glad I could be of help to you. As you probably know from reading my posts and some of the reactions to my post, not everyone agrees on headphone preferences. That is why I always try to tell people that yes, I really enjoy the Pro 750 but they may not (either at all or as much as I do).
In the final analysis, it is entirely up to each individual as to what headphone they prefer.
On to the subject of music, since you enjoy the swing type of Jazz and the vocalists, there are two albums I suggest you buy:
Sinatra at The Sands with Count Basie and His Orchestra and
Count Basie Live at the Sands (before Frank)

Here are Amazon.com links for these albums:


Amazon.com: Sinatra at the Sands: Frank Sinatra with Count Basie & the Orchestra: Music


Amazon.com: count basie live at the sands

There is a special sale at Amazon.com right now and the Sinatra at the Sands album is about half price.

Since you like this type of music, as I do, I am sure you will enjoy these recordings.

You should hear them through the Pro 750! Wow! I would imagine they sound great through the other Ultrasone's too. With the Pro 750, it sounds like you're right in the middle of the orchestra with Sinatra singing right in front of you. BTW, there's a point of disagreement to use as an example. Some people do not like this type of sound stage (where it seems as though you are in the middle of the orchestra) but, instead, they prefer the sound stage to seem as though the Orchestra is in front of you. And, others prefer the "in your head" sound stage. There's no accounting for tastes. As I said before, preferences are very different at times and very individualistic.

Edit: I just read something in one of your posts that caused me to write this edit. If your 780 is sounding a little too high pitched or shrill, and you have to use an EQ adjustment, chances are very high that, if there's nothing wrong with your audio chain, your 780 needs more burn in time. With the 750, I was still noticing changes in the sound even after 250 hours. When you first start a burn in with a new pair of Ultrasone headphones, play music through them at a softer than "normal" volume for about the first 50 hours, then increase the volume to what most people with "normal" hearing would consider to be a "normal" listening volume for about the next 100 hours. After this they will start being more listener friendly. There will still be more changes in the sound up to around 300 hours but after 250 hours those changes will be less noticeable.
I'm not sure about the HFI 780 in this regard, but the Pro 750 definitely sounds best with a completely flat EQ adjustment or not using a graphic equalizer at all, IMO. As you said about the 780, similarly the 750 exposes what ever is on the recording. However, with an improperly recorded recording, I also understand, as unforgiving as these headphones are, why you would want to make an EQ adjustment to suit your listening preferences.



Thanks for music the suggestions i go to the library on a saturday where cds are 25p a week to rent ,they have a very big selection so i will have a look for these or maybe buy. I have a cd called swing when your winning by robbie Williams and i know you cant compare him to the greats but it sounds amazing on the ultrasones (he duets with Sinatra on "it was a very good year") I also have a readers digest violin collection that sounds mind blowing just the texture and the seperation , with some of the rasspy notes its like you can feel them as well as hear them.
The reason a didnt go for the pro 750 was the price at the time and wasnt sure if my cowon would drive them , I think your right about the burn in ,the soundstage is still expanding and out of the box the demo cd track 1 didnt sound as wide as it does now.
source wise the cowon is great but budget allowing(we are trying to pay off the mortgage in the next 2 years ) i may get a dac/amp set up
 
Nov 29, 2008 at 2:31 PM Post #29 of 39

genclaymore

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Also the HFI-780 i seen for 161 at northernsound.net incase your still thinking about them. But yea it always best to hear something your self. TO see if you enjoy it or not.

Peter is right about people liking the standard cord.I like mine to the point of not wanting to get the cord change. Well other then wishing it wasnt long that is.
 

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