[pawlowski6132]

How much amp is TOO mucha amp (in wpc) for these phones??

 

[bozebuttons]

I have driven them with my Conrad Johnson Premier 12 monoblocks 140wpc &
hovland hp100 preamp with no problems.

 

[pawlowski6132]

Quote:

Originally Posted by bozebuttons I have driven them with my Conrad Johnson Premier 12 monoblocks 140wpc & hovland hp100 preamp with no problems.

Oh that's too funny. The reason for my post was that I was considering some CJ gear!!

Please tell me...what do you like AND not like about that combo? Also, what are you comparing it to, if anything?

thanx

 

[SteveM324]

I've owned the K1000 for almost a year now but I had not heard it anywhere near its full potential until just this morning after reading some threads about amplification for the K1000's. For the last year I've been using either a Grace 901 or my RS Raptor to drive them. Most of the time I had been using the Raptor. My complaint with either of those amps with the K1000 was that it sounded too lean, sibilant and not enough bass. I tried many different tubes with the Raptor, the the Tungsol's were the warmest, but I was not completely satisfied. Well this morning I connected the K1000 (using the stock cable) to one of my speaker based amps, the Mark Levinson No. 383 integrated amp. This amp is 100 W/Ch into 8 ohms and 200 W/Ch into 4 ohms and its MSRP is $6500. Way, way too much amp, right? Wrong! The leaness and lack of bass is completely gone. These headphones take a lot of power to drive them well. The sound is full, warm, open and effortless. The bass is deeper than I imagined these phones were capable of. Those are adjectives I would never have used to describe the sound of the K1000's before I heard them through the Mark Levinson amp. The reason I say they take a lot of power is because I have to set the volume control on the ML amp to the same level as I do when driving my speakers (Revel M20's 87 dB efficiency). Up until this morning I was considering selling the K1000's but now that I've really heard them, no way would I sell them. Until this morning I would have ranked the K1000's behind my 650's and my K340's (both driven extremely well by the Raptor) but now the K1000's may become my favorite (only long term listening will tell). I'm not recommending that anyone go spend $6500 on an amp for the K1000's, my point is that it really takes a powerful high quality amp (tube or SS) to bring out the best in them. I may even try my Classe' CA400 power amp (400w/Ch into 8 ohms & 800 w/Ch into 4 ohms) with my CAT SL1 Ultimate preamp to drive them

 

[pawlowski6132]

Fascinating! Thank you for posting.

If anyone remember's Ohms law; at, I think 220ohms, how much power (watts) will a 100wpc (at 8Ohm) be delivering into the K100s?

 

[kartik]

Quote:

Originally Posted by bozebuttons I have driven them with my Conrad Johnson Premier 12 monoblocks 140wpc & hovland hp100 preamp with no problems.

I've driven a pair of GRado SR-325s through a Unison Research Unico Teatro (>400Wpc) speaker outputs. Sounds really good I might add.

 

[pawlowski6132]

How can a powerful amp not destroy a little pair of headphones??

First of all, is this analysis correct??

SpkK1000

Power 100100Watts
Resistnce 8220Ohms
Voltage 28148Volts
Current 3.50.7Amps

If so, can the answer be that because of the high restance of the K1ks, there is not much current reaching the phones???

 

[Canman]

The only headphone jack that I've found to provide enough power is the Audio Valve RKV. Most headphone jacks can drive the K1000 to satisfactory volume levels but you really need a lot of current to get these headphones going and fill out the bass response. A 100w / channel amp is not required, but good clean current is.

The K1000 is a tough headphone to build a system around but once you do it sounds great.

Quote:

Originally Posted by SteveM324 I've owned the K1000 for almost a year now but I had not heard it anywhere near its full potential until just this morning after reading some threads about amplification for the K1000's. For the last year I've been using either a Grace 901 or my RS Raptor to drive them. Most of the time I had been using the Raptor. My complaint with either of those amps with the K1000 was that it sounded too lean, sibilant and not enough bass. I tried many different tubes with the Raptor, the the Tungsol's were the warmest, but I was not completely satisfied. Well this morning I connected the K1000 (using the stock cable) to one of my speaker based amps, the Mark Levinson No. 383 integrated amp. This amp is 100 W/Ch into 8 ohms and 200 W/Ch into 4 ohms and its MSRP is $6500. Way, way too much amp, right? Wrong! The leaness and lack of bass is completely gone. These headphones take a lot of power to drive them well. The sound is full, warm, open and effortless. The bass is deeper than I imagined these phones were capable of. Those are adjectives I would never have used to describe the sound of the K1000's before I heard them through the Mark Levinson amp. The reason I say they take a lot of power is because I have to set the volume control on the ML amp to the same level as I do when driving my speakers (Revel M20's 87 dB efficiency). Up until this morning I was considering selling the K1000's but now that I've really heard them, no way would I sell them. Until this morning I would have ranked the K1000's behind my 650's and my K340's (both driven extremely well by the Raptor) but now the K1000's may become my favorite (only long term listening will tell). I'm not recommending that anyone go spend $6500 on an amp for the K1000's, my point is that it really takes a powerful high quality amp (tube or SS) to bring out the best in them. I may even try my Classe' CA400 power amp (400w/Ch into 8 ohms & 800 w/Ch into 4 ohms) with my CAT SL1 Ultimate preamp to drive them

 

[Michael G.]

Quote:

Originally Posted by SteveM324 I'm not recommending that anyone go spend $6500 on an amp for the K1000's, my point is that it really takes a powerful high quality amp (tube or SS) to bring out the best in them. I may even try my Classe' CA400 power amp (400w/Ch into 8 ohms & 800 w/Ch into 4 ohms) with my CAT SL1 Ultimate preamp to drive them

You may be right about this. AKG probably intended for us to go ahead and use the stereo amp we use for our loudspeakers. I went through some interesting trials with low-powered amps myself, and it was not until I found the 60 watt per channel Bryston 2BLP that audio nirvana finally washed over my ears and into my brain. Previously, I had always heard some degree of that "leanness" in the the tonal balance that you always hear people attributing to the K-1000 drivers and cables. No more! Now, the sound is as rich, full, and musical as I could hope for. I can listen for hours on end with zero ear fatigue. There's no need to waste money on a low powered amp that will never drive anything else but headphones. I say kill two birds with one stone, and go buy a good, powerful amp that will not only drive your K-1000's but also anything else you might eventually acquire. You'll feel better.

 

[JzzMaTzz]

http://www.6moons.com/audioreviews/f...irstwatt3.html

 

[SteveM324]

Quote:

Originally Posted by pawlowski6132 How can a powerful amp not destroy a little pair of headphones?? First of all, is this analysis correct?? SpkK1000 Power 100100Watts Resistnce 8220Ohms Voltage 28148Volts Current 3.50.7Amps If so, can the answer be that because of the high restance of the K1ks, there is not much current reaching the phones???

I don't think you need to worry about overpowering the K1Ks as long as you listen at reasonable levels and use common sense. I think I saw a thread where some Headfier said that AKG recommended amps in the range of 40-50 W/ch. As others have stated, I think a high quality amp capable of delivering a lot of current is best. With my Mark Levinson amp, the K1Ks have a full body sound that is not fatiguing at all. I never achieved this full body sound with either my Grace 901 or the Raptor (both of which I currently own). My recommendation to K1K users that are experiencing leaness, sibilance or lack of bass is try a speaker based amp of high quality and high current capability. The one exception may be the RKV which I have not heard. However, I doubt whether the RKV can match the speed, bass and soundstaging capabilities of my ML amp (yes, I know that this is not a fair comparison).

 

[SteveM324]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Michael G. AKG probably intended for us to go ahead and use the stereo amp we use for our loudspeakers.

Michael,
I think you are absolutely right about this. That is why AKG doesn't even bother to supply a 1/4" headphone plug with the stock cord. The AKG engineers probably know that almost no regular headphone amp can deliver the current required for the K1K to reach their full potential.

 

[bozebuttons]

Quote:

Originally Posted by pawlowski6132 Oh that's too funny. The reason for my post was that I was considering some CJ gear!! Please tell me...what do you like AND not like about that combo? Also, what are you comparing it to, if anything? thanx

I have not listened to the K1000s in a while,but will break them out this week
& try them with my Dared300b amps & Cj amps.
I also noticed when using the Cj & k1000s volume setting was the same as my speakers 88db.

 

[SteveM324]

I also want to add that achieving high volume levels with the Raptor or Grace 901 driving the K1ks was never a problem. That maybe why some headfiers, including myself, had written off the K1ks as being lean, having no bass and sibilant. Since I was able to drive them to high volume levels, I thought I had all the amp that was needed. I know now that I was wrong. I'm glad I tried my speaker amp this morning because now I'm achieving the sound many K1k lovers have been enjoying all along. Now I also know why there is such a love/hate response from headfiers who have tried them. The K1K truly deserves its reputation as the headphone most difficult to drive well.

 

[kartik]

Quote:

Originally Posted by pawlowski6132 How can a powerful amp not destroy a little pair of headphones?? First of all, is this analysis correct?? SpkK1000 Power 100100Watts Resistnce 8220Ohms Voltage 28148Volts Current 3.50.7Amps If so, can the answer be that because of the high restance of the K1ks, there is not much current reaching the phones???

I don't know if this question is directed at my previous post, but I've never had much problems with the headphones despite subjecting them to these big amps. FWIW, they sound really lively and not as shrill when powered by the monsters. In fact there is a whole review on the grados powered out of the Unison as well as my own Sharp integrated amp.