[ironmine]

Any of you guys hear of this one ....HPL2 Processor.....I like it, but curious how you folks would.

https://www.hpl-musicsource.com/software

I will try it, thanks.

By the way, there is a software called DDMF Plugin Doctor, allowing you to check the behavior of a VST plugin and see which effects does it produce on various parameters of sound.

I have checked almost all crossfeed plugins I have and so far I have found that the only crossfeed plugin that do not change the amplitude-frequency response are the 112dB Redline Monitor and Meier. All other crossfeed VSTs increase the lows by several dB.

 

[dwinnert]

I will try it, thanks.

By the way, there is a software called DDMF Plugin Doctor, allowing you to check the behavior of a VST plugin and see which effects does it produce on various parameters of sound.

I have checked almost all crossfeed plugins I have and so far I have found that the only crossfeed plugin that does not change the amplitude-frequency response is the 112dB Redline Monitor. All others crossfeed VSTs increase the lows by several dB.

I am curious how HPL2 behaves....

I tried 112db Redline Monitor in JRiver 24 and I couldn't get it to function. It would load in the DSP manager, but I was unable to adjust anything.

Edit...I got Redline Monitor working.

 

[ironmine]

I am curious how HPL2 behaves....
I tried 112db Redline Monitor in JRiver 24 and I couldn't get it to function. It would load in the DSP manager, but I was unable to adjust anything.
Edit...I got Redline Monitor working.

I am sorry, Redline Monitor is not the only crossfeed that gives a flat frequency response. Meier VST crossfeed also shows a flat line.

But HPL2 shows weird fluctuations:

To my ears, HPL2 sounds muffled, the sound resolution is not on the same level as others...

 

[dwinnert]

I am sorry, Redline Monitor is not the only crossfeed that gives a flat frequency response. Meier VST crossfeed also shows a flat line.

But HPL2 shows weird fluctuations:

To my ears, HPL2 sounds muffled, the sound resolution is not on the same level as others...

For me HPL2 does not sound muffled, just the gain drops. If I raise the volume up to the same level it was before, I just notice the crossfeed. Redline for me, get a lot brighter and tinny sounding.

 

[castleofargh]

hpl2 seems to apply some HRTF setting at a fixed angle instead of the more typical low pass stuff on crossfeeds.
personally I feel the center is at a decent distance. but on several tracks the sound just feels wrong to me, and rapidly gives me a headache(from what I imagine must be really conflicting audio cues my brain tries to make sense of in vain). and of course as soon as HRTF or even basic crossfeed is involved, I require some means of customization. ready made universal solutions are usually no good for my head, and this one isn't the exception.

to be clear I'm not saying it's bad, I'm saying it's bad for me and my head. with a fixed setting, hit or miss is what will always happen.


@ironmine in real life the result should not be flat. I can get the practical appeal, but a really immersive 3D simulation on headphones wouldn't maintain the same response as the input.

 

[dwinnert]

OK, I am digging the Redline Monitor plugin. Weird issue is, I get pops between tracks where the sample rate changes...and to a lesser extent, same sample rate files. Running JRiver 24 64 bit. Does not happen with MusicBee, which is 32 bit.

 

[ironmine]

OK, I am digging the Redline Monitor plugin. Weird issue is, I get pops between tracks where the sample rate changes...and to a lesser extent, same sample rate files. Running JRiver 24 64 bit. Does not happen with MusicBee, which is 32 bit.

I have similar issues.

As soon as I start upsampling the audio data (in Foobar, on-the-fly) before the Redline (e.g., from 44.1 to 88.2), it starts stuttering. But if the audio is initially in 88.2 format, or if I resample it first before playback, the Redline can process it just fine.

 

[ironmine]

hpl2 seems to apply some HRTF setting at a fixed angle instead of the more typical low pass stuff on crossfeeds.
personally I feel the center is at a decent distance. but on several tracks the sound just feels wrong to me, and rapidly gives me a headache(from what I imagine must be really conflicting audio cues my brain tries to make sense of in vain). and of course as soon as HRTF or even basic crossfeed is involved, I require some means of customization. ready made universal solutions are usually no good for my head, and this one isn't the exception.

to be clear I'm not saying it's bad, I'm saying it's bad for me and my head. with a fixed setting, hit or miss is what will always happen.

@ironmine in real life the result should not be flat. I can get the practical appeal, but a really immersive 3D simulation on headphones wouldn't maintain the same response as the input.

For me, currently the most immersive crossfeed is the Redline. And it's flat. So, I don't care about theoretical "should bes" and "shouldnt bes".

Why simulate the non-perfect speakers' frequency response in an acoustically crappy room, if you can simulate the perfect speakers in the perfect room?

When it comes to crossfeed, I want my simulation to be better than reality.

For the same reason why people play computer shooter games. You don't come to gamers and say: "You know guys, I can get the practical appeal, but a really immersive 3D simulation in the shooter game wouldn't maintain the same level of body intactness as in real life. You are supposed to get dirty and take shots and bleed and feel horrible pain and some of you should even die to make it real". Do you?

 

[dwinnert]

For me, currently the most immersive crossfeed is the Redline. And it's flat. So, I don't care about theoretical "should bes" and "shouldnt bes".

Why simulate the non-perfect speakers' frequency response in an acoustically ****ty room, if you can simulate the perfect speakers in the perfect room?

When it comes to crossfeed, I want my simulation to be better than reality.

For the same reason why people play computer shooter games. You don't come to gamers and say: "You know guys, I can get the practical appeal, but a really immersive 3D simulation in the shooter game wouldn't maintain the same level of body intactness as in real life. You are supposed to get dirty and take shots and bleed and feel horrible pain and some of you should even die to make it real". Do you?

I found the Meier 64 bit VST this afternoon. Going to give that a try. Did not see if it works in JRiver or....comp is shutdown for the night....so tomorrow.

 

[castleofargh]

For me, currently the most immersive crossfeed is the Redline. And it's flat. So, I don't care about theoretical "should bes" and "shouldnt bes".

Why simulate the non-perfect speakers' frequency response in an acoustically ****ty room, if you can simulate the perfect speakers in the perfect room?

When it comes to crossfeed, I want my simulation to be better than reality.

For the same reason why people play computer shooter games. You don't come to gamers and say: "You know guys, I can get the practical appeal, but a really immersive 3D simulation in the shooter game wouldn't maintain the same level of body intactness as in real life. You are supposed to get dirty and take shots and bleed and feel horrible pain and some of you should even die to make it real". Do you?

say that you like the EQ you're already using( although that's bringing controversy on why EQ is fine only outside crossfeed). or say that you don't think those corrections should belong inside a crossfeed plugin because Xfeed should stick to just sending the delayed signal to the other channel, with a low pass filter over it. I'll be fine with opinions like those. but calling that choice "better than reality" is fundamentally wrong. even if we forget speaker distortions, and room reflections, our brain still works by referencing sound to a lifetime of stuff bouncing and being masked by the head. a Headphone removes/alters some of those cues including FR. without those we lack some of our means to locate sound sources properly, so I don't see how that would be better than reality.

 

[dwinnert]

Well...the Meier 64 bit does not work in JRiver 24 64 bit.

 

[Erik Garci]

Lately I have been trying crossfeed methods as a remedy for this issue. I still want to avoid comb-filtering artifacts, thus I prefer methods such as BS2B and Meier, and I think they sound much better than the Realiser's mix block.

Here is my latest setup:

Stereo source ==> miniDSP 2x4 (Linkwitz-like crossfeed) ==> Realiser A8 (crosstalk-free PRIR) ==> headphones

Basically I hear stereo audio coming from the front but with headphone crossfeed instead of speaker crosstalk.

 

[bigshot]

I've never heard anything coming from a distance in front of me using headphones, only with speakers.

 

[Erik Garci]

I've never heard anything coming from a distance in front of me using headphones, only with speakers.

That's why I'm using the Realiser. It does a great job of making sound seem to come from a distance in front.

 

[bigshot]

Can it do 5.1 or Atmos convincingly?