[bgtip]

...
You tried comparing those cables to the stock ones in terms of SQ? (even though 1 is balanced and the other is SE).

I listened to the stock 3.5mm cable vs 4.4mm balanced. Personal impressions only so take it with a grain of salt.
Stock 3.5mm impressions:
- Requires more power. On FiiO Q5s 1h vs 12h for balanced. Q5s 100% volume is at 3h. No gain boost applied. No bass boost also.
- Overall sound - lifeless.
- Sound imaging - not so precise. Narrower. Details blurred.
- Bass - lacking not only sub ext but all over.
- Mids - recessed. Female vocals suffered most. I couldn't believe how mediocre Bjork sounds. No visceral impact.
- Highs - rolled-off. No sparkle. Unpleasant and unnatural.
Conclusion - differences are subtle but noticeable from the onset. Probably intended for phone use only. Overall less than agreeable to me. I'll stick to the balanced output. It's fun to listen to.

 

[aliquis]

I listened to the stock 3.5mm cable vs 4.4mm balanced. Personal impressions only so take it with a grain of salt.
Stock 3.5mm impressions:
- Requires more power. On FiiO Q5s 1h vs 12h for balanced. Q5s 100% volume is at 3h. No gain boost applied. No bass boost also.
- Overall sound - lifeless.
- Sound imaging - not so precise. Narrower. Details blurred.
- Bass - lacking not only sub ext but all over.
- Mids - recessed. Female vocals suffered most. I couldn't believe how mediocre Bjork sounds. No visceral impact.
- Highs - rolled-off. No sparkle. Unpleasant and unnatural.
Conclusion - differences are subtle but noticeable from the onset. Probably intended for phone use only. Overall less than agreeable to me. I'll stick to the balanced output. It's fun to listen to.

As for the first one as balanced provide twice the voltage of course it will be louder.

As for all the rest wouldn't we need to know how it also sound with the balanced cable to get a comparision? Sounds like you don't like them there but we'd need to know how you like them with balanced to get the comparision.

I personally have some trouble understanding why there would be a massive improvement though. When I've read about the possible advantages it has seemed like there shouldn't be much, on the other hand I have some basic electronics knowledge and I don't know if the signal traveling into the ground pin bounce back to some degree and then bounce back on the other side and so on because if so that will of course have some impact and with the balanced cable that lower reflected signal won't at-least not be applied to both channels but rather one for each meaning both less interference from that and less mixing between the channels so as such cleaner and with better stereo separation.
Also for the three pin balanced setups interference into the cable will be removed but I don't know if these headphone balanced cables work like that because they seem to have 4 pins 2 for each side and hence no room for ground + signal + inverted signal but rather two separate amp stages?
... Seem your balanced cable have enough splits for 5 wires so maybe it is L signal + inverted L signal + R signal + inverted R signal + ground and then it should work as the 3 wire balanced cables and hence remove interference from other electromagnetic fields (as for the bouncing would the situation for the ground there be the same then?)

 

[bgtip]

As for the first one as balanced provide twice the voltage of course it will be louder.

As for all the rest wouldn't we need to know how it also sound with the balanced cable to get a comparision? Sounds like you don't like them there but we'd need to know how you like them with balanced to get the comparision.

...

Fair enough. Here is my comparison 3.5mm single ended vs 4.4mm balanced sound:
Stock 3.5mm impressions are first:
- Requires more power. On FiiO Q5s 1h vs 12h for balanced. Q5s 100% volume is at 3h. No gain boost applied. No bass boost also.
- Overall sound - lifeless vs energetic, lively, effortless, sophisticated and neutral
- Sound imaging - not so precise. Narrower. Details blurred vs wide, extreme pinpoint precision, air between instruments, crispiness, multiple layers
- Bass - lacking not only sub ext but all over vs deep, textured, effortless, natural bass with good sub bass extension, never overbearing, no mids bleed, fast planar bass
- Mids - recessed. Female vocals suffered most. I couldn't believe how mediocre Bjork sounded. No visceral impact vs rich, detailed and textured mids, quite capable to convey emotion
- Highs - rolled-off. No sparkle. Unpleasant and unnatural vs stunningly realistic and natural, pleasant, not fatiguing
- - Timbre - didn't mention it because nothing to write home about vs Good representation of instruments, natural timbre
Conclusion - differences are subtle but noticeable from the onset. 3.5 mm probably intended for phone use only. Overall less than agreeable to me. I'll stick to the balanced output. It's fun to listen to.

tl;dr: go for 4.4mm balanced, it's rich, sophisticated sound.

 

[aliquis]

I can't imagine how changing cable even with actual different technical solutions can achieve that though =P

Of course I wouldn't trust it whatsoever for simply changing cable with the same connectivity but this isn't with the same connectivity but it seem weird.

Also as for all this EQ talk I do understand that if you say lower everything by 10 dB in EQ and then just raise it for the bass then you will have to use more gain but for other frequencies the signal will be much lower and hence the output signal can remain the same regardless. BUT as the gain/volume knob is changed to achieve that the bass part of course will definitely get a stronger signal out and I think they claimed max power out was it 10 or 50 mW before? 10? And what I would like to know there is if one is feeding like 200 mW or 300-400 or whatever once it play deep bass notes, as far as loudness goes maybe the diaphragm doesn't move all too far (or maybe it does ... and if so what do that cause?) but also shouldn't the cable traces on that 1 micron diaphragm not be ridiculusly thin? Sure it's over a short distance but how much can both the wire and the diaphragm handle as far as heat goes? I can understand how one can increase bass response by increasing (relatively or absolutely) the signal for the bass but I have no idea how to know how much they can actually withstand. And since they mention a max I feel like they may not be very interested in replacing it if you ruin it. As such I would had preferred if it could sound nice without EQ. All the talk about extra power make me also kinda worried for longevity but also for loudness as I know higher loudness raise the experience of bass more and hence it's hard to know (well maybe it's not, maybe I can simply assume that what people actually experience when they say "more bass" simply _IS_ more loudness with a stronger impact of the bass because of that, alternatively that weaker gear clip with weaker bass and junk harmonics higher up ruining everything.)

Maybe "autism" doesn't go well with "audiophilia" =P, I want to know WHY and HOW and FACT =P, but the audiophile / hifi field are so full with what possibly are feelings, placebo, trust / knowing you've spent more so it should be better, ..

 

[dogears]

@Fatdoi, very interesting iems lineup. How would you rate P1 against the rest of your iems? tia

 

[dogears]

tl;dr: go for 4.4mm balanced, it's rich, sophisticated sound.

or the stock cable simply sucks
if you can get a single ended adapter for your fiio - i’d like to hear you comparison again. it will be a better comparison since you’ll be using the same cable.
tia

 

[bgtip]

I can't imagine how changing cable even with actual different technical solutions can achieve that though =P

Of course I wouldn't trust it whatsoever for simply changing cable with the same connectivity but this isn't with the same connectivity but it seem weird.

Also as for all this EQ talk I do understand that if you say lower everything by 10 dB in EQ and then just raise it for the bass then you will have to use more gain but for other frequencies the signal will be much lower and hence the output signal can remain the same regardless. BUT as the gain/volume knob is changed to achieve that the bass part of course will definitely get a stronger signal out and I think they claimed max power out was it 10 or 50 mW before? 10? And what I would like to know there is if one is feeding like 200 mW or 300-400 or whatever once it play deep bass notes, as far as loudness goes maybe the diaphragm doesn't move all too far (or maybe it does ... and if so what do that cause?) but also shouldn't the cable traces on that 1 micron diaphragm not be ridiculusly thin? Sure it's over a short distance but how much can both the wire and the diaphragm handle as far as heat goes? I can understand how one can increase bass response by increasing (relatively or absolutely) the signal for the bass but I have no idea how to know how much they can actually withstand. And since they mention a max I feel like they may not be very interested in replacing it if you ruin it. As such I would had preferred if it could sound nice without EQ. All the talk about extra power make me also kinda worried for longevity but also for loudness as I know higher loudness raise the experience of bass more and hence it's hard to know (well maybe it's not, maybe I can simply assume that what people actually experience when they say "more bass" simply _IS_ more loudness with a stronger impact of the bass because of that, alternatively that weaker gear clip with weaker bass and junk harmonics higher up ruining everything.)

Maybe "autism" doesn't go well with "audiophilia" =P, I want to know WHY and HOW and FACT =P, but the audiophile / hifi field are so full with what possibly are feelings, placebo, trust / knowing you've spent more so it should be better, ..

I suppose you frequent audio science review forum and their section titled Psychoacoustics. I do.

 

[dogears]

asr \m/

 

[Nailzs]

Fair enough. Here is my comparison 3.5mm single ended vs 4.4mm balanced sound:
Stock 3.5mm impressions are first:
- Requires more power.

I haven't found that true. Using my Hiby R6 Pro with 4.4mm balanced draws more power and gets hotter than using 3.5mm for an equal amount of time.

 

[cenix]

Got some jvc spiral dots to compare to symbio w and my hybridized spinfits. Shorter tube length doesn't work great with comfort, less bass due to less than ideal seal for me. Spinfits with some mack's extra soft foam plug material around still by FAR sounds and feels best for me. You guys should try it, won't be disappointed.

https://www.amazon.com/Macks-Ultra-...=1567208335&s=gateway&sprefix=mack+ear&sr=8-4

I have ordered the Spiral Dots as well, a few weeks ago. They should arrive by next week or so. Regarding your mod, I am about to try it out myself, with both the Sony Hybrids and Spinfits. Though, the hybrids provide for plenty of bass already, at the moment. I am somewhat surprised why so many people are complaining about the bass. I figure that people who have ordered these, probably have some other tips to try out. Even though I am using them unbalanced, it still sounds fantastic, with just enough bass for myself (I mostly listen to trance and progressive house). Though, without an amp, I wouldn't recommend them in a million years. Unless your current DAP has a ridiculous amount of power by itself.

Fair enough. Here is my comparison 3.5mm single ended vs 4.4mm balanced sound:
Stock 3.5mm impressions are first:
- Requires more power. On FiiO Q5s 1h vs 12h for balanced. Q5s 100% volume is at 3h. No gain boost applied. No bass boost also.
- Overall sound - lifeless vs energetic, lively, effortless, sophisticated and neutral
- Sound imaging - not so precise. Narrower. Details blurred vs wide, extreme pinpoint precision, air between instruments, crispiness, multiple layers
- Bass - lacking not only sub ext but all over vs deep, textured, effortless, natural bass with good sub bass extension, never overbearing, no mids bleed, fast planar bass
- Mids - recessed. Female vocals suffered most. I couldn't believe how mediocre Bjork sounded. No visceral impact vs rich, detailed and textured mids, quite capable to convey emotion
- Highs - rolled-off. No sparkle. Unpleasant and unnatural vs stunningly realistic and natural, pleasant, not fatiguing
- - Timbre - didn't mention it because nothing to write home about vs Good representation of instruments, natural timbre
Conclusion - differences are subtle but noticeable from the onset. 3.5 mm probably intended for phone use only. Overall less than agreeable to me. I'll stick to the balanced output. It's fun to listen to.

tl;dr: go for 4.4mm balanced, it's rich, sophisticated sound.

Thanks for the comparison, but I cannot agree with your assessment at this point. Of course, people have different preferences, not to mention, the difference in equipment we use. I am using them with a LG V30 + Fiio E11 at the moment, and they sound great. I do agree that without an amp, they are pretty hopeless and isn't worth the money. But, once you amp it up for a bit, they are great. All of the things you mentioned under 4.4mm balanced, that's pretty much how I experience them now, but in SE. A bit surprised about our differences in experience, even though your equipment should be vastly more superior (E11 is nothing compared to the Q5s).

 

[capnjack]

I’ve found that my AskewLabs cMoy BB design amp works really well with my Shanling M1 and the P1.
https://www.askewlabs.co.uk/products/the-classic-black-plus-portable-headphone-amplifier

 

[K0r3Uptd]

Most all dynamic, ba and hybrids (dynamic/ba) will probably be sufficient especially if you run them balanced. There are few planar IEMs as of now. The P1 is rather unique. Check over at the M11 thread and see what everyone is using or suggesting there.

Thanks for the advice. I typed in M11 and got so many results, which thread is the best one for me to be checking out?

 

[rayliam80]

Thanks for the advice. I typed in M11 and got so many results, which thread is the best one for me to be checking out?

https://www.head-fi.org/threads/fii...3-dac-chips-3gb-ram-wifi-two-way-ldac.902622/ <- I would consider that to be the main thread. Search inside the thread if you're curious about an IEM or if anyone else has mentioned or asked about it.

 

[bgtip]

...
Thanks for the comparison, but I cannot agree with your assessment at this point. Of course, people have different preferences, not to mention, the difference in equipment we use. I am using them with a LG V30 + Fiio E11 at the moment, and they sound great. I do agree that without an amp, they are pretty hopeless and isn't worth the money. But, once you amp it up for a bit, they are great. All of the things you mentioned under 4.4mm balanced, that's pretty much how I experience them now, but in SE. A bit surprised about our differences in experience, even though your equipment should be vastly more superior (E11 is nothing compared to the Q5s).

You are absolutely right and that because I usually give a warning that those are my personal and subjective opinions, unmeasurable objectively and therefore shouldn't be taken as pure truth. The only common denominator between us is that both of us have P1. Both of us believe that P1 sounds excellent providing you use a proper amp.
For the people on the fence - if you intend to use P1 with your phone, better buy Tin T2, you'll never regret it. For those with portable amp - go for P1, you'll never regret it.

 

[Lohb]

Anyone in UK thinking of selling their P1, please send me a PM.