[Rockcoon]

Hi Rackcoon,

Why do you have to say so? Is he reliable or not? I might make  deal with him. He gives like 30$ off on the stuff. But I doubt that there will be any warranty on his products, I asked him twice and he was saying in his Russian-English that this gear is good, no problem. 

I read through this forum, and found some people very unpleased with that Audio GD dealer.

http://forum.doctorhead.ru/index.php?s=0d377ddd0ec6b5a56b5b7d955f67e221&showtopic=5456&view=&hl=&fromsearch=1

 

[Lord Raven]

I read through this forum, and found some people very unpleased with that Audio GD dealer.

http://forum.doctorhead.ru/index.php?s=0d377ddd0ec6b5a56b5b7d955f67e221&showtopic=5456&view=&hl=&fromsearch=1

Dear Rockcoon,
 
Thanks for the caution, I tried to read 5-6 pages of this Russian forum and could not find a bad review about this dealer. I guess I will not make a deal with him. He pissed me off already, I don't understand his language and I would not recommend him. You can buy from the company directly and have 10 years of warranty and free repair, just have to pay shipment cost. This guy is weird, he opens up the package and tests it in Russia, even though Audio-GD does 100 hour burn in and testing at their facility, why would he open up the packages? It will not be a BNIB stuff, rather an Open Box stuff. I cannot trust this guy for a 30$ drop.
 
Regards
LR

 

[LancerFIN]

@Lord Raven Magnahifi sells audio-gd gear and ships worldwide from Netherlands

 

[LancerFIN]

You can't draw that conclusion that it is D-S DACs, perhaps they didn't sound different enough to detect, or maybe your hearing acuity isn't that good. The difference between my Schiit Gungnir and my NAD M51 were very clear, and they are both D-S DACs so why would D-S DACs be a waste of money?  

Like everything on this site it was just a personal opinion. I have only owned two different D-S DACs. NFB-15 and X12. Sure that's not many. But It's wolfson vs sabre. Honestly couldn't hear any difference. Even when tried really hard. There has been so much talk about how DACs sound the same lately. I am starting to buy into that. Except for Master 7. Everything should of course be taken with a grain of salt. Heck full salt shaker of it when talking about audio.

 

[Lord Raven]

I wanted to thank your KeithEmo, I read a great review on Wolfson vs ESS Sabree here at http://www.computeraudiophile.com/f6-dac-digital-analog-conversion/ess-sabre-9018-vs-wolfson-wm8741-8976/ Clears all the conceptions about the endless discussinon between DAC comparisons (Post #10).
 
Unfortunately, I cannot audition any DAC in my area and totally have to rely on the reviews. I am checking out the DACs suggested (Emotiva's new Little Ego and Big Ego), they're very handy and convenient, what are the reviews on sound quality. I will mostly use my laptop and phone with the DAC via USB input.
 
I was only considering the Oppo mainly cause I watch movies, I did mention that I will occasionally watch video on it. Its headphone amplifier will also be a waste since I have a tube amplifier. I think I shouldn't buy Oppo 105D, as it will not be cost effective. 103 is a good option but it does not have Ess Sabre DAC. 105 is a good option but it is discontinued and only available in used.
 
I am seriously looking into Audio-GD DACs these days, NFB-15 and NFB-11, if you can say a word about these, I would be really grateful. Thanks once again!
 
Quote:

   
The Oppo 105D is a really great Blu-Ray player, and I highly recommend it as such. However, it would be silly to buy the Oppo 105D to use strictly as a DAC, because you're paying for a whole lot of functionality you're not going to use. (In terms of parts count, cost, and complexity, the DAC is probably about 20% of the Oppo 105D; so why pay for all the other stuff if you really aren't going to use it?)
 
As far as finding a low-cost DAC that still performs well, the first thing you need to know is what you plan to use as an audio source. (If you plan to use a computer, and USB, then there are a huge number of small USB DACs in the $100 to $200 range that are very good - and I'll take the opportunity to suggest that you check out Emotiva's new Little Ego and Big Ego  there. If you plan to connect it to a CD or Blu-Ray player, as well as or instead of a computer, then you'll also need a Coax or Toslink input, which cuts down the huge list of available options by about 2/3 - since the majority of low-coast USB DACs have ONLY a USB input - which won't work with a CD player.)
 
You also need to get your head around the "whole Sabre DAC thing". The Oppo 103D has perfectly nice DACs in it. The Oppo 105D uses Sabre DACs, which, as well as being good DACs in general, have their own distinct "flavor" (sound signature). People generally buy the Oppo 105 because they specifically like the sound of Sabre DACs - but that preference is highly personal and subjective. (They measure very good, and at least as good as other high end DACs, but whether you actually like their distinctive sound signature or not is a matter of personal preference.) It would probably be a good idea to find someplace where you can listen to something with a Sabre DAC in it, and decide if you actually like it or not, before you buy one. (There are plenty of low-cost DACs that use a Sabre chip, like the DragonFly, and the 0DAC, and plenty that don't, including the new Emotiva ones, so it makes sense to listen to one so you can decide which group you should be considering.)
 
(You should also note that, with the Oppo 105D, you're paying an extra $100 for Darbee video processing (that's what the "D" stands for). If you're not planning to use the video at all, then that extra $100 would be a complete and total waste of money for you.)

 

[Lord Raven]

NFB10.33 is balanced DAC, which I don't need. I am considering NFB-15, maybe used if new is not available anymore.
 
Thanks for your comments I am also trying to find a deal on Oppo 105, nothing is available. Only option is to buy direct from Oppo.
 
Quote:

   
Worth noting that Audio-GD is out of the Wolfson business now.  They've updated their web site to read... The NFB-15 and NFB-10.33 last for sale ,no successor .
 
In your price range the Oppo will best everything.  That said, for pure DACs in that price range you're looking at portables, dongles and some Schiit.

 

[Lord Raven]

  Some great advice there from @KeithEmo. For the kind of cash you would shell out for an Oppo 105D you could buy an Oppo HA-1 which uses Sabre DACs and gets very good reviews.  You don't need to spend that much though and you already have an amp; the HA-1 is stuffed with other goodies you don't need like the 105D.  As  KeithEmo pointed out you don't buy DVD player to use as a DAC and you would be better off listening to gear using the Sabre and other DACS and decide which you like.
 
This is a very crowed market sector.  Do some homework.  Read the forums here and elsewhere. Trust your ears.
 
Finally, many stores and manufacturers will let you return gear in 15 or 30 days at no cost, or very minimal cost.
 
It's also fair to say your tube amp will have a lot more impact on the sound signature than will most DACs.

Thank you AudioBear, I never thought of HA-1 since it is also a HP amplifier and I don't need it as I already have my tube amp sitting next to me
 
What do you think about the HA-2? I thought to buy a used HA-2 to test it before I make expensive purchase but nothing is available in the market. Thanks again!

 

[wahsmoh]

  Thank you AudioBear, I never thought of HA-1 since it is also a HP amplifier and I don't need it as I already have my tube amp sitting next to me
 
What do you think about the HA-2? I thought to buy a used HA-2 to test it before I make expensive purchase but nothing is available in the market. Thanks again!

I heard the HA-1 at Can Jam 2015 for 15 minutes and while that may seem like not a lot of time, it gave me enough time to make a decision that it was something I am not buying.
 
Why? It had a tinge of glare to it, soundstage wasn't the biggest I've ever heard, but the bass and low end was much like the Bifrost Uber. I would buy the HA-1 for amp and skip the DAC section. Oh ya and like always, YMMV

 

[KeithEmo]

Like everything on this site it was just a personal opinion. I have only owned two different D-S DACs. NFB-15 and X12. Sure that's not many. But It's wolfson vs sabre. Honestly couldn't hear any difference. Even when tried really hard. There has been so much talk about how DACs sound the same lately. I am starting to buy into that. Except for Master 7. Everything should of course be taken with a grain of salt. Heck full salt shaker of it when talking about audio.

 
I'm kind of surprised that you didn't hear any difference there - although it depends a lot on your source, and what you're listening through (I find it difficult to tell the difference between DACs with AKG headphones) - but not with many others. The NFB-15 also lets you pick which filter you use in the Wolfie (there are a bunch of choices)... and, while many of them do sound very similar, at least a few of the choices are noticeably different (several have a -3 dB roll off at 20 kHz or so). I had one of their models where you could switch filters with a front-panel switch, and they did sound distinctly different (with the NFB-15 you have to switch jumpers - which introduces a significant delay - and so makes it harder to tell).
 
AudioGD is also known to voice their individual products somewhat differently - even products using the same chip sometimes sound somewhat different with them - and they also seem to sometimes change the way a product sounds, but keep the same or similar "model number" sometimes. (I would go as far as to suggest that, at least sometimes, with some of their products, their "voicing" makes more of a difference than the DAC chip.)
 
Also, someone commented that the NFB-15 is discontinued.... but I don't see any mention of that at the moment (although I could have missed it).
 
http://www.audio-gd.com/Pro/Headphoneamp/NFB1532/NFB15.32EN_Use.htm

 

[KeithEmo]

 

I wanted to thank your KeithEmo, I read a great review on Wolfson vs ESS Sabree here at http://www.computeraudiophile.com/f6-dac-digital-analog-conversion/ess-sabre-9018-vs-wolfson-wm8741-8976/ Clears all the conceptions about the endless discussinon between DAC comparisons (Post #10).
 
Unfortunately, I cannot audition any DAC in my area and totally have to rely on the reviews. I am checking out the DACs suggested (Emotiva's new Little Ego and Big Ego), they're very handy and convenient, what are the reviews on sound quality. I will mostly use my laptop and phone with the DAC via USB input.
 
I was only considering the Oppo mainly cause I watch movies, I did mention that I will occasionally watch video on it. Its headphone amplifier will also be a waste since I have a tube amplifier. I think I shouldn't buy Oppo 105D, as it will not be cost effective. 103 is a good option but it does not have Ess Sabre DAC. 105 is a good option but it is discontinued and only available in used.
 
I am seriously looking into Audio-GD DACs these days, NFB-15 and NFB-11, if you can say a word about these, I would be really grateful. Thanks once again!

 
We've literally just started shipping the Ego DACs this week, so you should expect to start seeing some user reviews shortly. I'm sure you'll start hearing about them here, or you could drop by Emotiva's forums (we welcome both customers and everyone else).
 
I've owned several of AudioGD's lower end DACs, and they do tend to sound rather different from each other - to the point where it's pretty obvious that AudioGD is NOT "trying to make them sound as close as possible except for the differences between the DAC chips". (AudioGD used to sell "discrete op-amp modules - and maybe still do. Whereas I would be inclined to suggest that all op-amps should sound the same - neutral - and would design such a device to be as neutral as possible, AudioGD offered a variety of models, with rather lyrical names, and each claimed to sound distinctly different - and therefore not neutral.)

 

[LancerFIN]

   
I'm kind of surprised that you didn't hear any difference there - although it depends a lot on your source, and what you're listening through (I find it difficult to tell the difference between DACs with AKG headphones) - but not with many others. The NFB-15 also lets you pick which filter you use in the Wolfie (there are a bunch of choices)... and, while many of them do sound very similar, at least a few of the choices are noticeably different (several have a -3 dB roll off at 20 kHz or so). I had one of their models where you could switch filters with a front-panel switch, and they did sound distinctly different (with the NFB-15 you have to switch jumpers - which introduces a significant delay - and so makes it harder to tell).
 
AudioGD is also known to voice their individual products somewhat differently - even products using the same chip sometimes sound somewhat different with them - and they also seem to sometimes change the way a product sounds, but keep the same or similar "model number" sometimes. (I would go as far as to suggest that, at least sometimes, with some of their products, their "voicing" makes more of a difference than the DAC chip.)
 
Also, someone commented that the NFB-15 is discontinued.... but I don't see any mention of that at the moment (although I could have missed it).
 
http://www.audio-gd.com/Pro/Headphoneamp/NFB1532/NFB15.32EN_Use.htm

It says so on the front page. They are discontinuing all the WM8071 products.

 The NFB-15 and NFB-10.33 last for sale ,no successor .

 
My chain in the AB test was NFB-15 RCA-> H10 -> LCD-2F and X12 XLR-> H10 -> LCD-2F. It was optimal AB test as there was practically no pause in sound. No need to play with cables. I had so high expectations for the X12. Even with all my "expectation bias" I just couldn't hear any difference at all. I was quite mad about it too. At the time X12 was my second biggest audio purchase only dwarfed by the LCD-2. Not even a single component in my speaker system was as expensive. NFB-15 was newest version at stock settings. I didn't open it to play with the filters.
 
Because of my experience with X12 I had very mixed feelings about the Master 7 but I decided it was something I had to experience. I thought chances were 50/50 I wouldn't hear any difference. Luckily Master 7 didn't let me down. From the first track I played I knew this was a sound I had never heard before. Now I am confident that Master 7 is bigger upgrade than going from NFB-15 to Gustard X12+H10. I am still using H10 with the Master 7.

 

[lukeap69]

@LancerFIN

I can relate because with all the DACs I've heard, DAC-19 gave me that moment where I thought the difference was very apparent. The difference between other DACs I've heard is, to me, very subtle. Perhaps because ears are not as good as others. Yet.

 

[Rockcoon]

Dear Rockcoon,

Thanks for the caution, I tried to read 5-6 pages of this Russian forum and could not find a bad review about this dealer. I guess I will not make a deal with him. He pissed me off already, I don't understand his language and I would not recommend him. You can buy from the company directly and have 10 years of warranty and free repair, just have to pay shipment cost. This guy is weird, he opens up the package and tests it in Russia, even though Audio-GD does 100 hour burn in and testing at their facility, why would he open up the packages? It will not be a BNIB stuff, rather an Open Box stuff. I cannot trust this guy for a 30$ drop.

Regards
LR

Buy direct from Kingwa is the best decission. He is a good fellow. We tried together find a way, how organize shipment of nfb 10.33 to my cursed land. We failed. But from this experience i can say, Kingwa and his team, are those, with whoom you can make a deal.

P.S
About Russian dealer. Direct link on one of the raging posts

http://forum.doctorhead.ru/index.php?showtopic=5456&st=3275#entry565377

Translate (with mine and google help )

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!

Better don't mess with audiogd.ru, There sits a redneck . He can't explain nothing . No sese to ask him about devices. He sells them only and as a private person . A typical huckster , who curry favor to Kingwa .
A month ago, i ordered the unit , he have agreed on the price. As a result, when unit arrived from China to AudioGD.ru , the price has jumped to 3000 . Month lost in the shuffle !
And he generally speaks in a boorish way : plain text tells me that I should hang myself for 3000 .
Draw conclusions , gentlemen !

 

[KeithEmo]

 
It says so on the front page. They are discontinuing all the WM8071 products.
 

 
You're right - my bad - I went straight to the product page and didn't read the news

 

[Lord Raven]

Rockcoon Bro, you just saved my life Why Russia is a waste land, you have a dealer sitting over there haha
 
Thanks for the direct link, otherwise I would have spent a night reading entire forum. I will continue my DAC hunt, since I am still not sure what to get. 
 
Quote:

Buy direct from Kingwa is the best decission. He is a good fellow. We tried together find a way, how organize shipment of nfb 10.33 to my cursed land. We failed. But from this experience i can say, Kingwa and his team, are those, with whoom you can make a deal.

P.S
About Russian dealer. Direct link on one of the raging posts

http://forum.doctorhead.ru/index.php?showtopic=5456&st=3275#entry565377

Translate (with mine and google help

)

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!