ThieAudio Legacy 9
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Animagus

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That looks like a good opportunity to use another dynamic drive. The rise on the L9 I think starts about 400-500hz. But the problem with the L9 bass is that slow attack/decay that doesn't keep up with the BAs and bleeds a little into it.

These Sonion EST is kinda different technology and it has it's own power converter integrated. On paper, it shouldn't be need a strong source of power to drive it.
Sonion EST drivers are actually electrets and not electrostatics, so they do not need as much power.
 
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post-15711983
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Precogvision

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Nothing I didn't really go over in my reviews, but if anyone wants to check out a quick, condensed version I made a video too!
 
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SciOC

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Sonion EST drivers are actually electrets and not electrostatics, so they do not need as much power.
That isn't my understanding of the sonion as they have an external voltage adapter.... The stuff in the shuoer tape and shuoer singer are clearly electrets though, and presumably the new bgvp as well. But the sonion drivers are like BA style estats although their actual function is hard to tell, they definitely aren't shaped like dynamic drivers like the electrets....
 
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ReaperZzZ

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Nothing I didn't really go over in my reviews, but if anyone wants to check out a quick, condensed version I made a video too!
Thanks for the quick review, sounds like similar to a lot of other reviewers, with it being a fun v shape.. Perfect for my basshead needs with that sparkly treble too :D
 
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Animagus

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That isn't my understanding of the sonion as they have an external voltage adapter.... The stuff in the shuoer tape and shuoer singer are clearly electrets though, and presumably the new bgvp as well. But the sonion drivers are like BA style estats although their actual function is hard to tell, they definitely aren't shaped like dynamic drivers like the electrets....
Here you go - https://www.sonion.com/wp-content/uploads/ds-EST65DA01_v2.pdf. I haven't seen what Shuoer uses in those 2 IEMs but they could be magnetostatic drivers. BGVP Zero uses a magnetostatic driver too. Electrostatics need additional bias voltage and Sonion drivers being electrets don't and so can be driven easily. My friend @EagleWings and I have been cringing about Sonion marketing their EST drivers as electrostatics for a while now. Lol! I have a couple of Sonion EST drivers based hybrids and tri-brids and have reviewed some on Twister6 and Head-fi. :)

Sonion EST.png
 
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EagleWings

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That isn't my understanding of the sonion as they have an external voltage adapter.... The stuff in the shuoer tape and shuoer singer are clearly electrets though, and presumably the new bgvp as well. But the sonion drivers are like BA style estats although their actual function is hard to tell, they definitely aren't shaped like dynamic drivers like the electrets....
You are mixing things up. What you are calling as an external voltage adapter is a step-up transformer, which takes the input signal and steps up the voltage for the stator. The transducer assembly (stator+diaphragm) is housed inside a BA like enclosure. But the transducer tech/type is still electret. In an electret, the diaphragm is inherently charged, which is what the Sonion EST drivers are. Whereas, diaphragms of electrostatic transducers like the Stax are charged by an external energizer.
 
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SciOC

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Here you go - https://www.sonion.com/wp-content/uploads/ds-EST65DA01_v2.pdf. I haven't seen what Shuoer uses in those 2 IEMs but they could be magnetostatic drivers. BGVP Zero uses a magnetostatic driver too. Electrostatics need additional bias voltage and Sonion drivers being electrets don't and so can be driven easily. My friend @EagleWings and I have been cringing about Sonion marketing their EST drivers as electrostatics for a while now. Lol! I have a couple of Sonion EST drivers based hybrids and tri-brids and have reviewed some on Twister6 and Head-fi. :)

Sonion EST.png
Yikes, you've essentially dropped my interest in any sets using the sonion drivers to zero. I should hear them to make judgements but my view is that calling electrets/magnetostats "electrostatics" is essentially fraud. I knew the magnetostats licensed from earbridge (I think) were nonsense, but the sonion are just as bad, if not worse given the price jump.

You are mixing things up. What you are calling as an external voltage adapter is a step-up transformer, which takes the input signal and steps up the voltage for the stator. The transducer assembly (stator+diaphragm) is housed inside a BA like enclosure. But the transducer tech/type is still electret. In an electret, the diaphragm is inherently charged, which is what the Sonion EST drivers are. Whereas, diaphragms of electrostatic transducers like the Stax are charged by an external energizer.
Yeah, I should've read the layout specs when I first saw them. The set up gives the impression it could be true electrostatic if you don't read the details. This makes it look like even more deliberate bait and switch to me....
 
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EagleWings

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Yea, the marketing is a bit misleading although, politically, they are not completely wrong either, as electrets do come under the electrostatic transducer family. So far, I have heard 4 IEMs with the Sonion ESTs and I doubt I can tell a Sonion EST apart from a BA tweeter, let alone perceive any advantages of it as an end user.

All that said, don't discount Sonion EST based IEMs just because of the marketing ploy. BGVP ES12 and Pola39 are among the top 10 of my favourite IEMs, and both use Sonion ESTs.
 
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SciOC

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So far, I have heard 4 IEMs with the Sonion ESTs and I doubt I can tell a Sonion EST apart from a BA tweeter, let alone perceive any advantages of it as an end user.
Right, and that's where I struggle. Costs more, has a deceptively fancy name, but probably doesn't give any benefit at all.

It describes audiophile snake oil, snobbery and diminishing returns at it's finest.
 
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Animagus

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Right, and that's where I struggle. Costs more, has a deceptively fancy name, but probably doesn't give any benefit at all.

It describes audiophile snake oil, snobbery and diminishing returns at it's finest.
Yes, electrets are estats at the end of the day, but cheaper estats. Haha. When implemented properly they are quite nice but as @EagleWings said, you can't really differentiate them a lot from BA tweeters because at the end of the day, it all depends on how you use them in the tuning. You can take a dynamic driver, BA or an electret and mold it the way you want if you're good at tuning. In my experience, the current EST drivers don't really have any specific advantage over regular BA tweeters but then, I might get punched in the face by the next new EST IEM that hits it out of the park and changes my viewpoint and opinion completely. #positivevibes Haha.

You also can't discount ESTs as just a gimmick because driver manufacturers need to experiment and keep innovating to bring out new stuff for brands/tuners to have more options and for technical advancement in general. Out of those some might work and some might not. Brands/Tuners too like to experiment with new technology to see if they can make something new, innovative and exciting for the market. That is why you should always wait and read a couple of reviews to see if the new IEM with new technology is a hit or miss and also keep a track of what the new tech is and how it works. :D

Yea, the marketing is a bit misleading although, politically, they are not completely wrong either, as electrets do come under the electrostatic transducer family. So far, I have heard 4 IEMs with the Sonion ESTs and I doubt I can tell a Sonion EST apart from a BA tweeter, let alone perceive any advantages of it as an end user.

All that said, don't discount Sonion EST based IEMs just because of the marketing ploy. BGVP ES12 and Pola39 are among the top 10 of my favourite IEMs, and both use Sonion ESTs.
Again, I'm with Eaglewings here as those same EST hybrid IEMs as well as another Magnetostatic driver based IEM are in my top 10 favourites too. So, don't lose hope. Haha. Here are my reviews for some if you'd like to know more about them - BGVP EST12 (8BA+4EST), ItsFit Fusion (1DD+2BA+1Magnetostatic) and Shozy Pola39 (1DD+2EST).
 
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Thanks for the clarification on the Sonion electret technology! I’m not writing off any IEMs just b/c they use the Sonion electrets, as they could be spectacular sounding. I also don’t automatically give credence to an IEM simply because it uses this new, pricy technology.

The tuning of the Tape is odd, but I do like the sound of the treble (with some EQ), and do find the magnetostat to be really detailed, and somehow more pleasant (natural?) sounding than a lot of BAs. Is it true that the magnetostat drivers will eventually run out of charge, and cease to function? So the Sonion electrets have the advantage that they don’t have that lifespan limitation?

It may be nice to see hybrids with just DDs and Sonion electrets. Perhaps they could have a really natural timbre.
 
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Animagus

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It may be nice to see hybrids with just DDs and Sonion electrets. Perhaps they could have a really natural timbre.
That's Shozy Pola39 for you with 1DD+2EST but it is fun and energetically tuned. :sweat_smile:
 
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waveSounds

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I really, really want this iem.

Love my 846 for its comfort and form factor (no problems wearing it under a motorcycle helmet), and its sound, too, but I want that meaty DD sound. Think this sounds like the one!
 
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twice2

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Placed an order for the L9 a couple of days ago, was advised there's a wait of approximately a week, hopefully it doesn't stretch out too much.
Did you receive your L9 yet? :)
 
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ReaperZzZ

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Did you receive your L9 yet? :)
I did about two days ago!! Will take some better photos in a day or so and write a review once I've had a good chance to listen to them.

Initial thoughts though, the treble is incredibly detailed, light and airy, mids are so so as you'd expect from a V shape tune, and the bass is nice. I'll be EQing in probably + 3-6db under 60hz once I get a chance to sit down and listen to them for more than an hour!

Mine had a thin seal over the ported hole which I had to break with a toothpick 🤔

20200709_143057.jpg20200709_143107.jpg20200709_143445.jpg
 
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