The Watercooler -- Impressions, philosophical discussion and general banter. Index on first page. All welcome.
Oct 16, 2022 at 4:32 PM Post #38,221 of 87,558
But still, no matter how unrefined or unsophisticated (judgement calls, to be sure), what makes any of it “guilty”?

All in on the unabashed love part, though.
The way I look at;

You have heard the music so many times that you will learn nothing new listening to it again, you listen to it only for pleasure. The guilt is that you are wasting time you could have used listening to music you have not yet heard or you are trying to understand.

That said should we take life so seriously,
a term like “guilty pleasure” is just an adjective for something we like.

Note; last time this was asked a year ago I answered Goldfrapp and stirred up some fans right away who find nothing guilty there, offended by the thought. Which reminds me some Goldfrapp would be a great Supermoon test.
 
Last edited:
Oct 16, 2022 at 4:38 PM Post #38,222 of 87,558
Have you tried the HiBy R5 Gen 2 in Class A mode? I reckon that would be a good pairing. If budget is no constraint and you don't care about streaming, then the PAW6000 maybe?
I did consider the R5 Gen 2. I went with the DX170 as I really liked the form factor and one came up on the classifieds for a good price. I just got a good deal on a DX240, no 4.4mm in stock form though. I'm considering pickup up the AMP8 module, but that's another $200 I'm not sure I want to spend just for portable commute use. I'll definitely give your review another read. :wink:
 
Oct 16, 2022 at 5:32 PM Post #38,223 of 87,558
I did consider the R5 Gen 2. I went with the DX170 as I really liked the form factor and one came up on the classifieds for a good price. I just got a good deal on a DX240, no 4.4mm in stock form though. I'm considering pickup up the AMP8 module, but that's another $200 I'm not sure I want to spend just for portable commute use. I'll definitely give your review another read. :wink:
Haha. Yeah, DX170's form factor and weight are perfect! HiBy R5 Gen 2 Class A mode does offer a slightly more gooey analogue-ish character in comparison though. The normal mode isn't as impressive as Class A but offers a spectacular 35 hour battery life, which is a major win when travelling. I quite like R5 Gen2's form factor too!

As for DX240's options, I reviewed the DX240 + stock AMP1MK3 + AMP8 MK1 and Alex reviewed the DX240 + AMP8 MK2 against all the options. From what I remember of Alex's review, the AMP8 MK2 has slightly warmer midrange and better dynamics than stock AMP1MK3, which will again work in your favour.
 
Last edited:
Oct 16, 2022 at 5:35 PM Post #38,224 of 87,558
The way I look at;

You have heard the music so many times that you will learn nothing new listening to it again, you listen to it only for pleasure. The guilt is that you are wasting time you could have used listening to music you have not yet heard or you are trying to understand.

That said should we take life so seriously,
a term like “guilty pleasure” is just an adjective for something we like.

Note; last time this was asked a year ago I answered Goldfrapp and stirred up some fans right away who find nothing guilty there, offended by the thought. Which reminds me some Goldfrapp would be a great Supermoon test.

A beautiful album from Goldfrapp...

NC0zNTYwLmpwZWc.jpeg
 
Oct 16, 2022 at 8:35 PM Post #38,225 of 87,558
New addition to my life.
tempImagec3eyHI.png
tempImage2fLp1P.png
tempImageoXKdmJ.png
 
Oct 16, 2022 at 9:39 PM Post #38,226 of 87,558
New addition to my life.
Enjoy your time with the cute kitten. My cat that has been with us for almost 17 years are spending her last few days due to cancer and the pictures reminded me the day we adopted her when she was still a cute little thing.
 
Last edited:
Oct 16, 2022 at 10:45 PM Post #38,227 of 87,558
Had a few days of listening to the UM Multiverse Mentor demo and so I’ve been getting to know it better versus when I first listened to it at CanJam last month. Here’s some brief impressions on how I hear it:

Starting with just the big picture of the sound, I’d call it a warm leaning W-shaped sound, and so overall pretty balanced with no part of the frequency range dominating over the other. It’s got a tuning that lends itself to all-around listening / many genres and is easy to listen to (i.e. no shouty upper mids, piercing treble peaks or fatiguing bass, etc) while still being engaging (i.e. good macro dynamics).

The bass on Mentor is being done by BAs, and I’d say it’s an improvement over the last BA bass IEM I owned, the Phonix. Phonix’s bass (from memory) lacked the texture needed to avoid becoming a distraction from the greater whole during the time I owned it. Mentor’s bass texture is pretty good for a BA, and the decay isn’t super quick like some other BA IEMs, leading to more authenticity for bass guitar notes. It certainly doesn’t have the more drawn-out decay of bass notes like an EXT or Z1R, but it’s got enough that it isn’t distracting is the point. While there is good extension in the bass, don’t expect the sub bass to rumble like a DD along with that more perceivable moving air feeling that DDs have. I’m not hearing a particular focus on either mid or sub bass, and so Mentor’s bass seems pretty balanced between mid and sub.

The mids are warm and bodied. The sound is more natural, as if a thin layer of plastic was removed coming from Indigo (from memory), which had a timbre that that I felt was just ok for non-synthesized music. Vocals, and the midrange more broadly combined with the imaging precision and presentation are the star of the show for me on Mentor. The tuning seems to do equal just to both female and male vocals, including ones with deep voices such as Matt Berninger from The National. The soundstage is more on the intimate side compared to Jewel, spreading less in width and notes imaging closer in front/sides of my head with large sized notes and great depth and height to the stage. It kind of gives a small room presentation where you’re really close the music, especially the vocalist, as other instruments are positioned more behind and to the sides relative to the vocals.

Treble is well extended by my standards and so no complaints from me here and there’s definitely an airy top end going on while still having enough lower treble energy (i.e. more than Jewel). One thing I was curious about when listening to Mentor is whether the treble had some coarseness to it, which is something I’d sometimes get with Indigo depending on the track, but this hasn’t been a problem on the Mentor based on everything I’ve thrown at it in the past few days.

Noise floor performance is good on Mentor, not getting any hiss / waterfall noise when plugging into either the N8ii or WM1ZM2 (both high gain). Also, the 2-pin connection seems solid on the demo unit, but of course we’ll see if that’s still the case as more people get these in their hands to gauge from a larger sample size. I know Indigo has had issues with the 2-pin connector on some units.

To sum it up, Mentor goes for a warm, easy listening but still engaging sound while being very technical.

UM_Mentor.jpeg
 
Oct 16, 2022 at 10:58 PM Post #38,228 of 87,558
Had a few days of listening to the UM Multiverse Mentor demo and so I’ve been getting to know it better versus when I first listened to it at CanJam last month. Here’s some brief impressions on how I hear it:

Starting with just the big picture of the sound, I’d call it a warm leaning W-shaped sound, and so overall pretty balanced with no part of the frequency range dominating over the other. It’s got a tuning that lends itself to all-around listening / many genres and is easy to listen to (i.e. no shouty upper mids, piercing treble peaks or fatiguing bass, etc) while still being engaging (i.e. good macro dynamics).

The bass on Mentor is being done by BAs, and I’d say it’s an improvement over the last BA bass IEM I owned, the Phonix. Phonix’s bass (from memory) lacked the texture needed to avoid becoming a distraction from the greater whole during the time I owned it. Mentor’s bass texture is pretty good for a BA, and the decay isn’t super quick like some other BA IEMs, leading to more authenticity for bass guitar notes. It certainly doesn’t have the more drawn-out decay of bass notes like an EXT or Z1R, but it’s got enough that it isn’t distracting is the point. While there is good extension in the bass, don’t expect the sub bass to rumble like a DD along with that more perceivable moving air feeling that DDs have. I’m not hearing a particular focus on either mid or sub bass, and so Mentor’s bass seems pretty balanced between mid and sub.

The mids are warm and bodied. The sound is more natural, as if a thin layer of plastic was removed coming from Indigo (from memory), which had a timbre that that I felt was just ok for non-synthesized music. Vocals, and the midrange more broadly combined with the imaging precision and presentation are the star of the show for me on Mentor. The tuning seems to do equal just to both female and male vocals, including ones with deep voices such as Matt Berninger from The National. The soundstage is more on the intimate side compared to Jewel, spreading less in width and notes imaging closer in front/sides of my head with large sized notes and great depth and height to the stage. It kind of gives a small room presentation where you’re really close the music, especially the vocalist, as other instruments are positioned more behind and to the sides relative to the vocals.

Treble is well extended by my standards and so no complaints from me here and there’s definitely an airy top end going on while still having enough lower treble energy (i.e. more than Jewel). One thing I was curious about when listening to Mentor is whether the treble had some coarseness to it, which is something I’d sometimes get with Indigo depending on the track, but this hasn’t been a problem on the Mentor based on everything I’ve thrown at it in the past few days.

Noise floor performance is good on Mentor, not getting any hiss / waterfall noise when plugging into either the N8ii or WM1ZM2 (both high gain). Also, the 2-pin connection seems solid on the demo unit, but of course we’ll see if that’s still the case as more people get these in their hands to gauge from a larger sample size. I know Indigo has had issues with the 2-pin connector on some units.

To sum it up, Mentor goes for a warm, easy listening but still engaging sound while being very technical.

UM_Mentor.jpeg
Great impressions !! Helped me make my decision on the mentor to be honest :). Do you have an preference in prog rock or metal ? If so what's your go to iem ?
 
Oct 17, 2022 at 1:11 AM Post #38,229 of 87,558
Had a few days of listening to the UM Multiverse Mentor demo and so I’ve been getting to know it better versus when I first listened to it at CanJam last month. Here’s some brief impressions on how I hear it:

Starting with just the big picture of the sound, I’d call it a warm leaning W-shaped sound, and so overall pretty balanced with no part of the frequency range dominating over the other. It’s got a tuning that lends itself to all-around listening / many genres and is easy to listen to (i.e. no shouty upper mids, piercing treble peaks or fatiguing bass, etc) while still being engaging (i.e. good macro dynamics).

The bass on Mentor is being done by BAs, and I’d say it’s an improvement over the last BA bass IEM I owned, the Phonix. Phonix’s bass (from memory) lacked the texture needed to avoid becoming a distraction from the greater whole during the time I owned it. Mentor’s bass texture is pretty good for a BA, and the decay isn’t super quick like some other BA IEMs, leading to more authenticity for bass guitar notes. It certainly doesn’t have the more drawn-out decay of bass notes like an EXT or Z1R, but it’s got enough that it isn’t distracting is the point. While there is good extension in the bass, don’t expect the sub bass to rumble like a DD along with that more perceivable moving air feeling that DDs have. I’m not hearing a particular focus on either mid or sub bass, and so Mentor’s bass seems pretty balanced between mid and sub.

The mids are warm and bodied. The sound is more natural, as if a thin layer of plastic was removed coming from Indigo (from memory), which had a timbre that that I felt was just ok for non-synthesized music. Vocals, and the midrange more broadly combined with the imaging precision and presentation are the star of the show for me on Mentor. The tuning seems to do equal just to both female and male vocals, including ones with deep voices such as Matt Berninger from The National. The soundstage is more on the intimate side compared to Jewel, spreading less in width and notes imaging closer in front/sides of my head with large sized notes and great depth and height to the stage. It kind of gives a small room presentation where you’re really close the music, especially the vocalist, as other instruments are positioned more behind and to the sides relative to the vocals.

Treble is well extended by my standards and so no complaints from me here and there’s definitely an airy top end going on while still having enough lower treble energy (i.e. more than Jewel). One thing I was curious about when listening to Mentor is whether the treble had some coarseness to it, which is something I’d sometimes get with Indigo depending on the track, but this hasn’t been a problem on the Mentor based on everything I’ve thrown at it in the past few days.

Noise floor performance is good on Mentor, not getting any hiss / waterfall noise when plugging into either the N8ii or WM1ZM2 (both high gain). Also, the 2-pin connection seems solid on the demo unit, but of course we’ll see if that’s still the case as more people get these in their hands to gauge from a larger sample size. I know Indigo has had issues with the 2-pin connector on some units.

To sum it up, Mentor goes for a warm, easy listening but still engaging sound while being very technical.

UM_Mentor.jpeg
You say that Mentor has a warm and full-bodied sound while remaining very technical. You also say he has a smaller stage than Jewel. I ask you: Having Mentor a warm sound, with a nice midrange as you say, and keeping a very good technique, would you feel like saying that Mentor is therefore similar to Traillii?
 
Oct 17, 2022 at 1:36 AM Post #38,230 of 87,558
You say that Mentor has a warm and full-bodied sound while remaining very technical. You also say he has a smaller stage than Jewel. I ask you: Having Mentor a warm sound, with a nice midrange as you say, and keeping a very good technique, would you feel like saying that Mentor is therefore similar to Traillii?
They sound totally different.
 
Oct 17, 2022 at 3:43 AM Post #38,233 of 87,558
this is definitely a difference. The fact that an immense stage or a circumscribed one can be liked more is obviously subjective. And for this I wanted to understand (apart from subjective pleasure) the differences. Warm sound and excellent midrange seem to me to be two points in common between Traillii and Mentor. Of course there will also be differences, as you say on stage. And others that I look forward to reading with curiosity.:relieved:
 
Oct 17, 2022 at 3:45 AM Post #38,234 of 87,558
Talking about eartips...

Moon Audio dropped an Odyssey review YT video yesterday and at around 7min mark, she talks about
  • Foam tips and deep insertion tips lessened the BCD effect
  • Wide bore tips like JVC Spiral Dot reduces the intensity of the BCD effect (while keeping a balanced sound, good for long listening)
  • Narrow bore tips like Final E and Spinfits make you feel the effect of BCD
I don't have a BCD IEM at the moment, and I don't remember correlating ear tip types and bores to BCD effect in this way. I did end up with AET tips which had good solid core to transfer BCD effect (so it seemed :sweat_smile: ) while giving the tonal balance I needed. Does anyone with EVO/Mest family of BCDs have similar experience?
yes, both with EVO and MEST2. my preferred tips with EVO are the Spinfits cp145.
 
Oct 17, 2022 at 3:56 AM Post #38,235 of 87,558
Tell me better if you want ...
I did some A/B’ing today so I’ll quickly share my thoughts…

Mentor’s bass sounds more balanced between mid and sub bass compared to Traillii’s that’s more sub bass emphasised. Overall bass quantity-wise is pretty even, maybe with Traillii having slightly more bass. I think Mentors bass is better quality. Bass notes sound more textured and decay a little more naturally compared to Traillii’s more “BA sounding” bass.

Mids on Traillii sound warmer, presented further back and sound more relaxed in their delivery compared to Mentor’s. The more forward midrange is what I think makes Mentor’s stage depth and height focused compared to Traillii’s wider stage. I would say Traillii’s mids in isolation are more tonally emotional with a more natural timbre. Mentor’s sound a little bit leaner (but not lean in a broader sense) but are extremely detailed and more resolving than Traillii’s.

Treble on Mentor also sounds more energetic and forward than Traillii’s. To my ears Mentor sounds airier, and better extended. Traillii’s treble sounds a bit dull and veiled in comparison. Some will most likely prefer Traillii‘a more relaxed treble. I personally much prefer Mentors.

Outside of the wide soundstage, I’d say Mentor is the more technical monitor. It’s more detailed, it has a more holographic level of imaging and sounds more explosive with its dynamics.
 

Users who are viewing this thread

Back
Top