The Sennheiser Orpheus 2? A First Look At The Sennheiser HE-1 (The New Orpheus)
Nov 13, 2015 at 12:09 PM Post #738 of 2,838

Aero Dynamik

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  Ouch... the cost of this headphone is more than 1 year of my postdoc salary....

Where are you located? Why not come to Sweden? Everyone is welcome here! No questions asked! You don't even have to identify yourself. Just tell the authorities you're an asylum-seeker from Afghanistan, Somalia, Syria or Eritrea and you'll be guaranteed life long support for you and your family! Your best option is to claim you're a child, i.e. below 18 years of age.The immigration authorities have strict instructions from the government to consider anyone who looks younger than 40 years old as a child and they are not allowed to perform any kind of medical or psychological test to verify your age as is's considered insulting to your integrity and racist behavior. Sweden is a humanitarian super power (unlike most other ungenerous countries). I'm so very, very proud!!!
 
I'm sure the immigration authorities will get you and your family members a Sennheiser HE1060/HEV1060 each to ease any post traumatic stress!
 
Just go! You know you want to!
 
Nov 13, 2015 at 12:21 PM Post #739 of 2,838

HiAudio

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  Where are you located? Why not come to Sweden? Everyone is welcome here! No questions asked! You don't even have to identify yourself. Just tell the authorities you're an asylum-seeker from Afghanistan, Somalia, Syria or Eritrea and you'll be guaranteed life long support for you and your family! Your best option is to claim you're a child, i.e. below 18 years of age.The immigration authorities have strict instructions from the government to consider anyone who looks younger than 40 years old as a child and they are not allowed to perform any kind of medical or psychological test to verify your age as is's considered insulting to your integrity and racist behavior. Sweden is a humanitarian super power (unlike most other ungenerous countries). I'm so very, very proud!!!
 
I'm sure the immigration authorities will get you and your family members a Sennheiser HE1060/HEV1060 each to ease any post traumatic stress!
 
Just go! You know you want to!


This is funny **** I read here. I feel you. I hope Sweden does not get ruined. It used to be the model country that I had thought for the world.
 
Nov 13, 2015 at 1:26 PM Post #740 of 2,838

Ormia

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This is funny **** I read here. I feel you. I hope Sweden does not get ruined. It used to be the model country that I had thought for the world.

 
 
  Where are you located? Why not come to Sweden? Everyone is welcome here! No questions asked! You don't even have to identify yourself. Just tell the authorities you're an asylum-seeker from Afghanistan, Somalia, Syria or Eritrea and you'll be guaranteed life long support for you and your family! Your best option is to claim you're a child, i.e. below 18 years of age.The immigration authorities have strict instructions from the government to consider anyone who looks younger than 40 years old as a child and they are not allowed to perform any kind of medical or psychological test to verify your age as is's considered insulting to your integrity and racist behavior. Sweden is a humanitarian super power (unlike most other ungenerous countries). I'm so very, very proud!!!
 
I'm sure the immigration authorities will get you and your family members a Sennheiser HE1060/HEV1060 each to ease any post traumatic stress!
 
Just go! You know you want to!

 
I'm a proud Canadian that is temporarily displaced in the US for work. I really commend Sweden's humanitarian efforts. In Canada we have a new Prime Minister that should value humanitarian efforts way more than our previous PM. Hopefully Canada will follow suit (and the rest of the world should as well) to take on more refugees so that its less of a burden for any given country.
 
Hahaha claiming refugee status in your country seems like an interesting away to get headphones. I'll gladly give up that opportunity for someone who really need to live in Sweden for valid reasons.
 
Nov 13, 2015 at 5:22 PM Post #742 of 2,838

purk

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  Interesting to note an original Orpheus system (headphones + amplifier) just sold on the 'bay recently for only 12 grand euros. Something to keep in mind when considering the "investment" aspect.

link?
 
Nov 13, 2015 at 6:41 PM Post #743 of 2,838

saidentary

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  My very brief thoughts on the Orpheus
 
http://www.custom-cable.co.uk/blog/sennheiser-orpheus-headphones/


You didn't say anything about the bass.  What about the bass? 
 
Nov 13, 2015 at 6:50 PM Post #744 of 2,838

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You didn't say anything about the bass.  What about the bass? 
one track a played I felt the bass through my body. It was incredibly low and controlled however it wasn't a track I was familiar with so can't comment too accurately on the bass.
 
oBravo Stay updated on oBravo at their sponsor profile on Head-Fi.
 
http://www.obravoaudio.com/
Nov 13, 2015 at 6:50 PM Post #745 of 2,838

HiAudio

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I had read that a few members had mentioned investment. I don't know who, if any, really had the thought of investment on a headphone. I bet it's just some casual talks here. For me, if in a day that I could afford it my only purpose would be enjoying music with it.  
 
Nov 13, 2015 at 7:22 PM Post #747 of 2,838

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Gonna use this HE 1060 avatar for a bit...until others start using HE 1060 avatars and I go back to anime avatars. lol
 
For your viewing enjoyment, here is a hi-res image of the new Orpheus system.
 
Oh, and if you are going to quote this long post, please remove everything except the specific parts you are replying to.
 
@analogsurviver
 
You posted so much great info that I'm not going to quote it all. I will just reply with a few comments and questions.
 
#1: As far as frequency response goes, some electrostats have accurate measured bass all the way down, or even emphasized bass. And some of the higher-end electrostats are known to be capable of plenty of impact. Just because some other headphones have "more" doesn't mean they are accurate. I also think electrostats have significantly higher quality bass than other technologies.
 
#2: Can you explain, in a technical manner, how amplification inside the headphones prevents its use with other systems? The Bose QuietComfort 15, Blue Mo-Fi, and others have amplification inside the headphones, yet they are compatible with practically any system.
 
#3: I do remember you talking in the past about how difficult it is for electrostatic systems to accurately reproduce higher frequencies. (Although they are generally regarded as having better treble than non-electrostats.) So are you saying that, due to the design of the new Orpheus system, this is not an issue anymore? Can you go into further detail as to why?
 
#4: I'm curious, what are your impressions of the HE1000? You have mentioned a few times that you feel it could surpass electrostats, but personally, although I do think it sounds good with all music, I don't even think it sounds that good at all compared to electrostats. (And I've heard just about all genres of music with it, using very high-end systems.) It doesn't matter how thin a planar magnetic headphone's diaphragm is when it's still being "weighed down" by the metal on it, unlike electrostats.
 
  It's also interesting to consider the history of the original Orpheus and it's effect on Sennheiser's product range.
 
The HD650 could be seen as a direct child of the Orpheus, in a lineage that goes from HE90 -> HE60 -> HD600 -> HD650.
 
The musicality and sound signature of the HD650 I can see has shades of HE90 in it. 
 
I wonder if this new Orpheus is the first step of a sound signature that will proliferate into Sennheiser's product range.

 
All I know is that the aesthetic design of the HD 650 (as well as countless other models) was derived from the HE 90.
 
  +1  You seem to get the point that so many are missing.  Thanks Sennheiser for doing the R and D to bring us your best shot at the ultimate SOTA headphone system you know how to  build. Yes few can afford it, I never will. but that's true about every product category in high end audio. I'll never own a Continuum or Onedof $200,000 turntable, or a Naim $240,000 amp,  Wilson Alexandria $210,000 speakers, etc, etc, etc.  You know you could lose $2 million in a SOTA system real fast today.
Crazy, yep.  Might some be over priced, yep.  But that's just the cost of having the VERY BEST in High End and it's  no different than lots of other big boy toys. Ya got to have the cash to play. I don't.  
frown.gif

  Sennheiser makes a good point that still a headphone setup costs only peanuts in comparison to a 2 channel home stereo system. In a 2 channel home stereo system still you have to spend serious money for a suitable audio room. Depending on what part the world, materials, engineering, contractors, etc. It could costs hundreds of thousands of dollars!.

I'll be really honest. The price doesn't surprise me in the slightest. I come from HiFi and if you want the best you're gonna pay £30k+ for a preamp alone. A Krell, Meridian, McIntosh or AudioNote system comprising of a preamp & 2 power amps can cost you £70k without any source components or speakers.
I think the worlds best (supposedly) headphone system for £50k is a bit of a steal.
"It's a deal. It's a steal. It's the sale of the screwin' century!"
As a matter of fact, I might buy two!

 
You guys are making me feel less embarrassed about wanting to spend this much on a headphone system. :two_hearts:
 
Still toying with the idea of getting into high-end speaker systems in the distant future. I would be able to use some of the gear (such as DACs and cables) for both.
 
  I think the best way to 'fast track' a demo in such restricted time frames is take a USB stick with your AIFF of a track you know really well, with a good mix of vocals, dynamics and bass content, and of course very well recorded. When I test new gear or components out, I go back to a batch of 3 or 4 recordings for a memory check. I have found I can remember the sound signature of these tracks in demos I had over a year ago. If you listen and hear new details, or it sounds closer to the master, (more realistic than before), you know right there.
 
I also have a couple of 'test' tracks with female vocals on, which I know when she hits those high notes, if the treble is not right, it will show right away. Nowhere to hide kind of test.
 
DO NOT demo anything with the manufactures tracks, you don't know them, you will be distracted, they will be picked to sound good on that equipment. Avoid the 'con' of hifi shows.

 
You are so right. I listen to nearly all types of music and agree that the best way to test out the capabilities of a headphone in an audition is to use as much of your own music as you can.
 
  Having owned  and enjoyed the HD-600 for over 15 years, both the STAX 009 and the King Sound H-03 stats, and having heard the Orpheus on two occasions, I have to disagree with you on two points. For of all, it is very difficult for me to believe that more than a very small minority would prefer the HD-600 (or 650), even in the most optimal setup, over a properly working Orpheus. Just my opinion, of course. Secondly, I don't find the difference between dynamic and electrostatic to be at all subtle. I'm not saying that one technology is always superior to the other as many design factors come into play. This is not like the difference between amps or DACs. It is much more obvious.

 
Same here. I love electrostats so much more than everything else that I'm only interested in a few non-electrosats nowadays.
 
  At the same time, I would argue there are two types of personalities when it comes to consumer goods in general. One type who has a set of requirements, and chooses a product based on those requirements and stops there. The second type has the personality which is constantly seeking "better" products, and is never satisfied with their current products and is always seeking something else (whether there actually exists products which are objectively better or not almost doesn't matter).
 
I would argue that most of the community contributing here fall into that second category.
 
There is no "right" answer or "right" way to approach headphones, only that from my personal experience there is overlap between the former personality above and those that had previously owned Orpheus systems. We are after all talking about personal preferences, which is what headphones are, and not objective metrics such as who is the fastest race car driver around a track.
 
I could ask my acquaintances who I've been in touch with to sign up for this forum and contribute here regarding their reasons, but I'm not sure what the point would be.

 
I'm a mutant mix between the two. My requirements are: the best. But it just so happens that there is no definitive best. You can't stop anywhere when you want something as vague as the best, since various headphones excel at various things. There is also preference at play. Even if, after hearing all the headphones I could, I determined the one overall best headphone for me, that doesn't mean I would be satisfied with it alone.
 
  Every electrostatic I've ever heard or owned was lacking in bass authority.  They just couldn't reproduce the lowest of the low end.  Midbass punch was relatively lacking as well.  I've heard the SR-007 and SR-009, and I owned the Lambda (Pro?) SIgnature and another Lambda Signature that was modified to essentially be a 404.  Sometimes people mention this about e-stats, and other times it's ignored.

 
Plenty of electrostats have accurate bass quantity down to as low as you can hear, and some even have overemphasized bass quantity. The measurements prove this. Perhaps you want more bass than is actually in the recording. Anyway, you can easily boost the bass with a parametric equalizer, as long as your amp is powerful enough to handle it without distorting. I would also recommend spending more time listening to electrostats to get to know them better.
 
  Stradivari and a small number of other artisans created musical transducers that achieve far and beyond the levels of ...

 
A transducer (in the context of Head-Fi) converts electrical energy to mechanical energy. How is an acoustic musical instrument a transducer?
 
On a somewhat related note, I used to own a Bach Professional Bb/F Tenor Model 42B Stradivarius trombone with F attachment. Performing in wind ensembles, orchestras, and a jazz band with it was fun. (Got to practice and perform with Ira Sullivan in the jazz band!) Marching bands...not so fun, due to the grueling marching practice. (In one marching band, I performed with Enrique Iglesias and Bow Wow once!)
 
  if I heard this and thought it was worth it I would get them. I am doubting both. I think it might be an impossibility for these to match loudspeakers of the same price or more. as much as I like headphones. the analogy of the buggatti is more than one. that car is a piece of junk. I doubt these headphones are junk but I also doubt they can match the best loudspeakers. perhaps the best headphones to be had but price seems out of line. I just cannot see them being seriously better than the sr009. they pretty much hit the ceiling for headphones right there. if I am entirely wrong I would sincerely attempt to obtain a pair. who knows but I am just doubting it. like some tequila. it can be 100x the price of another but not really any better. I am afraid as with the buggatti what one is buying here is status. at least the headphones should "start" every time. I do actually hope I am wrong and these would blow me away. I just see a physical limitation here. I would not get these sight-unseen though. in fact I have demoed all my gear with the option to return. you can look at my posts here and see what kinds of things I am talking about. I am just guessing they will not readily demo these. even totl shops would be hard pressed to stock these I imagine.

 
Out of all the impressions I have seen so far, not one person has preferred the SR-009 over the HE 1060. It has always been the other way around. Food for thought.
 
  Sometimes I wish I was a fortunate enough to spend thousands of dollars on audio equipment
triportsad.gif

 
The total value of all the music-related equipment I have owned is five figures, and I also spent multiple five figures on my music collection. Wish I hadn't on the latter, because I could have gotten the best headphone gear instead.
 
It is clear from the price (including inflation) that Senn is seeking to target the affluent audiophile.  The reasoning behind original Orpheus was not about lining their pockets, and for this reason I am glad they are not calling it the Orpheus II.

 
Nope; just Orpheus. XD

http://en-us.sennheiser.com/orpheus

I think this was a bad move on Sennheiser's part, because now, when the Orpheus is mentioned, many people will get confused and have to ask which Orpheus system they are referring to: the old or new one.
 
(In case you weren't aware, the original Orpheus headphone was called Sennheiser Orpheus HE 90, while the new one is called Sennheiser Orpheus HE 1060.)
 
I wonder , if someones´s ready to spend E 50.000 buying these cans, what kind of source (player, dac, cable) has to use to match this kind of gear?
confused_face(1).gif

 
Depends what you mean by "match": sounding great or sounding "the best"...the latter of which ultimately comes down to "Which DAC sounds the best?" There are some very expensive DACs out there. For example, this one costs around $130,000 with all the upgrades. Such extravagance certainly isn't necessary. I mean, the Schiit Yggdrasil is regarded as one of the best DACs, and it's hardly over $2K. And you could always just use the HEV 1060's DAC. There's also the issue of "the best" DAC not necessarily sounding the best with this particular system, but I'm gonna go out on a limb here and discount this possibility.
 
  To call the HD650 high fidelity at all is rather laughable... It has a thick, congested sound with an unrealistic tonality. It is dreadful compared to the HD800. The HD800 is the most technically competent Sennheiser headphone that I have personally used, even though I prefer the HD540/HD560 models for their musically engaging quality. Apart from its slightly dull phase quality, the HD800 is the most capable dynamic headphone I've listened to that uses enclosures over the ears (I will leave the AKG K1000 aside here). I am curious about how much more capable the two Orpheus systems could really be compared to the HD800, whose drivers are large, sensitive and already very magnifying of microdetails. Further resolution of the very smallest sonic nuances is possibly the only improvement I may experience. Hopefully they're more musical than the HD800, which sounds somewhat dull despite its fantastic sonic linearity.

 
Those who find it hard to believe that the HE 1060 could sound much better than an HD 800 need to listen to all the electrostats they can.
 
objective measurements of headphone performance aren't "random", they're as purposeful as any other objective measure of performance

 
When he said random, he meant type. Like one type of measurement, then another type of measurement; not that measurements themselves are random.
 
  The Enigmaacoustics Dharma is actually a hybrid dynamic/electrostatic over-ear headphone.

 
I covered this in a PM reply, but I'll mention it here as well: It's an electret/dynamic, not full-fledged electrostatic/dynamic. That's why you can use normal amps with it.
 
You can learn more about electrets here:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Headphones#Electret
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electret
 
  These are "limited edition" the same way a HD 600 is "limited edition", in that in both cases Sennheiser will manufacture as many as they can sell up to the limits of their assembly line.
 
If there is a business case for building more, I'm sure Sennheiser can make it work to build more than 200. Just because this one is more "hand made" doesn't really mean much, every assembly line will have it's "natural limits" for manufacture.
 
That said, at 50k+, there is some doubt if Sennheiser can even sell 300 of these, which while not technically "limited edition", they might actually end up being more rare than even the original Orpheus.
 
In many ways the question of whether this headphone is or is not "limited edition" is merely academic. 

 
This isn't made on an assembly line, as far as I know. They stated that they can't produce more than a few hundred per year.
 
...But I honestly doubt they would sell nearly that many per year. I'm with you there.
 
  I would think there is a limited amount of people who would spend this much on a headphone set. It would be interesting how Senn are going to do demos to convince buyers. If it was me, I would need a home demo for a day at least, that is not logistically possible. So, basically punters and going to buy it on 'mystique' or based on a 'fixed' demo with set music like the previous Orpheus demos at shows. That is not a way to get a solid idea IMO.
 
What we need going forward, is a regular poster on hear who buys it, and has a comparable system to compare it too (Abyss, 009+BHSE or LCD-3). Then we will get e better idea of where is sits and if it really is top of the game).

 
You can count on me! (Sooner or later. haha)
 
  If I have disposable cash for it I would get for the end of game equipment. But a product at this price deserves very long time warranty, say 10+ years. Imagine you spent $55000 for a headphone set and it stops working at 3-5 year mark and then you have to spend $5000-10000 to fix it. 

 
I do wonder what the warranty will be like.
 
"I was going to buy a Ferrari but they didn't offer a lifetime warranty" said no one ever.....

 
ahaha! Nice.
bigsmile_face.gif

 
  I  couldn't afford the taxes on both.  LOL

 
You don't live in one of the countries that charge outrageous fees and taxes on headphone purchases (especially imports), do you?
frown.gif

 
(If so, it would be cheaper to just move to the US or something, from a purely cost-related standpoint.)
 
  It will be possible to pre-order the new Orpheus starting in early 2016. We will announce on the exact procedure at the beginning of 2016. 

 
This is...somewhat exciting news! Then again, even if one could afford it, having to wait around half a year with over $50K held up isn't exactly a picnic. I'm assuming that even with pre-orders, it wouldn't be anywhere near sold out by the time it's released.
 
By the way, is the 1060 pronounced "ten sixty" or "one thousand sixty"?
 
  My very brief thoughts on the Orpheus
 
http://www.custom-cable.co.uk/blog/sennheiser-orpheus-headphones/

 
Thanks for sharing your thoughts! In-depth comparisons with other headphones (like the SR-009) would have been better, though. If you can describe here the differences you heard between the HE 1060 and SR-009, etc. (in a general sense, of course, since you couldn't directly compare), that would be awesome.
 
Nov 13, 2015 at 7:30 PM Post #749 of 2,838

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These are "limited edition" the same way a HD 600 is "limited edition", in that in both cases Sennheiser will manufacture as many as they can sell up to the limits of their assembly line.

If there is a business case for building more, I'm sure Sennheiser can make it work to build more than 200. Just because this one is more "hand made" doesn't really mean much, every assembly line will have it's "natural limits" for manufacture.

That said, at 50k+, there is some doubt if Sennheiser can even sell 300 of these, which while not technically "limited edition", they might actually end up being more rare than even the original Orpheus.

In many ways the question of whether this headphone is or is not "limited edition" is merely academic. 


the new orpheus is not a limited edition model and that shouldn't be up for debate. a limited edition model has a pre-determined number of units to be produced. once that number has been reached then that is the end of the production run - forever. the production of the orpheus will be ongoing as i understand it but limited to 250 units per year.
 

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