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The Leben CS300XS Thread
Mar 6, 2018 at 6:49 PM Post #2,251 of 2,299
Hello all,
Well, i have read so many articles praising the qualities of this amp while some may be reserved about its power, none of them mentioned flabby bass and poor resolution, therefore i am quite surprised and curious to know where you found these negatives reviews, could you by any chance provide some links ?
I can't agree more with PanosK, you should try to go to a hifi store to get a chance to hear a CS300xs with your own CDs, your hears for sure will decide what to think about this amp.
As for an explanation, i hope those people who wrote negative comments may have provided some elements to explain their poor listening experience, but beyond that i can't guess without reading those reviews.
A wild guess would be : wrong phase power plugging - some amps like this one are sensitive to it, and any other source connected to it as well. I remember i red a lot of posts on french forums about this problem about many amps and how it affects listening experience. For example: http://whatishifi.blogspot.fr/2017/05/power-cord-polarity-line-phase.html , this is all i can think of.
fr9ncisco
 
Mar 6, 2018 at 8:51 PM Post #2,252 of 2,299
fr9ncisco said:
Hello all,
Well, i have read so many articles praising the qualities of this amp while some may be reserved about its power, none of them mentioned flabby bass and poor resolution, therefore i am quite surprised and curious to know where you found these negatives reviews, could you by any chance provide some links ?
I can't agree more with PanosK, you should try to go to a hifi store to get a chance to hear a CS300xs with your own CDs, your hears for sure will decide what to think about this amp.
As for an explanation, i hope those people who wrote negative comments may have provided some elements to explain their poor listening experience, but beyond that i can't guess without reading those reviews.
A wild guess would be : wrong phase power plugging - some amps like this one are sensitive to it, and any other source connected to it as well. I remember i red a lot of posts on french forums about this problem about many amps and how it affects listening experience. For example: http://whatishifi.blogspot.fr/2017/05/power-cord-polarity-line-phase.html , this is all i can think of.
fr9ncisco
Click to expand...
there are several bad reviews, or simply average... this is the most hard core one

http://www.changstar.com/www.changstar.com/index.php/topic,115.0.html
 
Mar 7, 2018 at 1:49 AM Post #2,253 of 2,299
Mar 7, 2018 at 5:15 AM Post #2,254 of 2,299
The Leben 300 series are low-powered tube amplifiers. This automatically means there's a requirement to take a lot of care with speaker matching. This is not a 100 Watt solid-state amp and shouldn't be expected to have the driving ability or flexibility of one. I think sometims people expect a universal panacea opinion on equipment which just oversimplifies matters.

Paired with high-sensitivity speakers, with a decent impedance characteristic, the technical shortcomings of designs like the Leben are not an issue.

I use mine with little Harbeth P3ESR speakers which - although of low sensitivity - have an impedence which never drops below about 6 Ohms with a gentle curve. I sit fairly close (less than 2m away) and play at mostly low to moderate levels. I could not want for more.

I have to also add that the Leben CS300XS has been wonderful with the LCD3 and Z1R.
 
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Mar 9, 2019 at 10:31 AM Post #2,257 of 2,299
17EB7BBD-59B7-4677-BB96-EA3FAD9DDD76.jpeg


Still loving my CS300XS here after 4.5 years of ownership, now using it mostly with the Sony Z1R - it’s a very nice match.

There’s a new Leben CS600X model out now. Never tried the CS600 but always wanted to. Here’s the new X version ^^^
 
Apr 17, 2020 at 2:28 PM Post #2,261 of 2,299
Haidar said:
Can anyone tell how well made this CS-300X clone is?
https://www.etsy.com/listing/744038531/tube-amplifier-pandora-leben-cs-300x
Click to expand...

Hi Haidar,
Its not a clone, this is a different beast.

The original leben is a point to point wire solder components, where the amp in the link is using circuit boards. So there is no way anybody can think of this as a clone, except the guy who wants to sell it.

The output transformers are home made in the case of leben. Here you have not homemade ones, and instead the power transformer way different.
The speech in the add speaks a lot about leben, it's creator , etc...but does not speak about the components used or any of the skills of the guys who made allegedly a leben clone. To me, it's just a bad sign.

This amp does not look bad in the end, but anyway it does not look like a leben clone to me. I heard many cs300, cs300x, cs300xs. Never this one.
And in case, the sound is not good for your ears, you won't be able to resell it that price if you ever sell it. Selling a famous amp is way more easier than selling an allegedly clone of that famous amp.
It just carry the name of a famous amp, and that is just about it.

Personally I bought a leben cs300 on the second hand market and I paid just a little above the price of this allegedly clone.
This was 6 years ago and I still own it and listen to it almost every day.
 
Apr 17, 2020 at 7:27 PM Post #2,262 of 2,299
Hi Francisco and thanks for your message!

fr9ncisco said:
Hi Haidar,
Its not a clone, this is a different beast.

The original leben is a point to point wire solder components, where the amp in the link is using circuit boards. So there is no way anybody can think of this as a clone, except the guy who wants to sell it.

The output transformers are home made in the case of leben. Here you have not homemade ones, and instead the power transformer way different.
The speech in the add speaks a lot about leben, it's creator , etc...but does not speak about the components used or any of the skills of the guys who made allegedly a leben clone. To me, it's just a bad sign.

This amp does not look bad in the end, but anyway it does not look like a leben clone to me. I heard many cs300, cs300x, cs300xs. Never this one.
And in case, the sound is not good for your ears, you won't be able to resell it that price if you ever sell it. Selling a famous amp is way more easier than selling an allegedly clone of that famous amp.
It just carry the name of a famous amp, and that is just about it.

Personally I bought a leben cs300 on the second hand market and I paid just a little above the price of this allegedly clone.
This was 6 years ago and I still own it and listen to it almost every day.
Click to expand...
 
Dec 9, 2020 at 1:34 AM Post #2,263 of 2,299
harmony1992 said:
it seems that the differences between 600 and 600x are the pre-part tubes? 12bh7 and 12au7 used in the X ver.
anyone compared the cs600 with EC studio or expensive headphone amp?
Click to expand...

I’ve just ordered a 600x , and I own a Woo WA5 and a WA22 so it will be interesting to compare when the Leben arrives.

The WA5 is a fantastic headphone amp - it makes every headphone I own achieve its full potential. It also drives a pair of Devore The Nines to very loud levels and as a 300b speaker integrated, it really is a headphone amp that can do double duty with many efficient speakers, though probably not the Harbeths (It did ok on ProAc super tablettes and Devore Super 8s). It likes premium tubes like all Woo amps and you can hear the differences between stock and vintage tubes.

I bought the Leben to better drive the Devore Nines, which probably prefer a bit more power than the 10 watts of the WA5. The synergy with Devore and Leben is well discussed so I am excited to hear what it can do. If it also sounds good with my Focal Clears or LCD3s, bonus, but I’m keeping the Woo as it’s that good of a headphone amp.

The WA22 is also special, but more finicky. It needs a balanced source and balanced headphone cables and it is way more tube finicky. But once set up, it’s a great amp especially at its price.

I nearly bought a used Leben 600 but I was worried about the dwindling supply of line stage tubes, which are no longer in production. I read where the 600 can be modified to the readily available line stage tubes used in the new 600x but in spite of calling several dealers, I couldn’t get a price or sufficient details of whether it could be easily done. So I bucked up and ordered the 600x. It’s near impossible to find a used 600x for sale in the US.

I read where the 600x has a slighty different circuit to account for the 12AU7 and 12BH7, and different “feet” but otherwise it seems mostly the same.

Exited to hear it, and roll some tubes. I’ve owned many EL34 integrated amps so excited to have one back under my roof, and sorry I gave away all my Winged C EL34 tubes as I learned they are no longer in production.
 
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Dec 20, 2020 at 12:20 PM Post #2,264 of 2,299
@davehg I have the Leben CS300 with the Devore Nine's and they are incredible together. Very natural sounding and open. Not sure how that translates to the 600x.

FWIW, here are my tube-rolling observations (with the Nine's or LCD2 headphone):

- pre tube has much more impact on the sound than the driver tube
- best driver tube - Sylvania Blackplate 6BQ6. Also tried Amperex EL84 and Siemens EL84. Both pleasant but don't have the black background, imaging, and natural sound that the Sylvania do
- best pre tube - for a long time I liked the Raytheon windmill getter 5751. Big soundstage (both speaker and headphone), great imaging, and smooth sound. Recently I've switched to CBS/Hytron 5751 and it's a clear upgrade. The CBS have all the characteristics of the Raytheon, but bring additional natural texture to the bass (especially acoustic bass in jazz and well recorded pop/rock like Beatles remasters) and enhance vocals to sound like they are singing right in front of you. Others I've tried include RCA Command 5751 (smaller soundstage but still pleasant), Amperex ECC83 Gray Plate (bit soft for my taste), Sylvania black plate 3 mica 5751 (good soundstage, not quite as 3d as the Raytheon), and GE 5751 (nothing special)

Either way, you're in for a treat. Enjoy!
 
Dec 21, 2020 at 1:46 AM Post #2,265 of 2,299
@stringgz301 thanks, not surprised the 300 sounds nice with the Nines. I’ll definitely find some NOS pre driver tubes, lots to choose from in the 12au7 and 12BH7 that the 600x uses.
 
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