The Hardest hitting Headphones are.. ( "The EXTREME BASS Club")

Discussion in 'Headphones (full-size)' started by hawaiibadboy, Apr 30, 2014.
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  1. OldDude04
    See, the fear that this would be the case is the exact reason I haven't gone ahead and ordered some Kannons. I had the Skullcandy Crusher way back with their battery powered "haptic bass response" and while you can feel the sub bass you heard none of it. Turn off the haptic bass and the driver couldn't play any sub bass notes. The Skullcandy was cheaply made plastic and the Taction Kannon looks much better made, but it would appear they both suffer the same issues. @talan7 is right that they should have used a driver capable of sub bass notes on its own, and then have the bass shaker add in that extra goodness. For now, I'll just keep jamming my JVC SZ2k with a smile on my face and hope that a Kannon 2.0 with improved drivers makes it to the market sometime soon.
     
  2. Malfunkt
    Hmm, interesting. I recently tried a SubPac, that was awesome, obviously less portable but it matched well with pretty much anything. Sounded great with the LCD2 that does go all the way down.
     
  3. Erik Garci
    The frequency response graph for the Kannon shows that 30Hz drops to about -18 dB when the tactile driver is off. Have you measured yours?
     
  4. Erik Garci
    As I understand it, a driver that is more capable at lower frequencies on its own would be less capable at higher frequencies. The Kannon gives you lower frequencies through haptics without degrading higher frequencies.
     
  5. OldDude04
    I don't believe they have to be mutually exclusive. My LCD2 pre fazor and Monolith M1060 reach way down deep in the low end and neither lack in the upper frequencies. I'm just saying that for a $500 pair of headphones aimed at bass lovers, they shouldn't be unable to play sub bass when the haptics aren't on.
     
  6. Erik Garci
    Maybe the Kannon would cost more than $500 if it used the same drivers as those headphones.
     
  7. OldDude04
    Possibly true, although the M1060 is only $300 new. I hope Taction sells a bunch as it will make other headphone companies invest in the technology, I just wouldn't buy them as it stands right now.
     
  8. TactionJohn
    Hey, folks. We’re working hard straight through the holidays to get caught up on our backlog, but I thought we should respond to the comment earlier in the thread regarding a user’s expectations about Kannon bass response without turning on Taction.

    As some folks discussed above -- yes, the frequency response of Kannons without Taction engaged is indeed rolled off. That is an intentional and important design choice. Let me explain why.

    Unlike most headphones, but like most loudspeakers, Kannons are designed as a 2-way system. In each earcup, there is a conventional audio driver and a Transporter tactile transducer.

    Combining multiple drivers is not a trivial task. Crossovers are arguably the most complex aspect of loudspeaker design. Drivers can interact in complicated ways.

    Early development versions of the Kannon did not roll off the audio driver. With Taction off, they sounded like good conventional headphones. With Taction on, there was vastly greater power in the deep bass, of course. But there was also uneven response, interference between the two drivers, and boomy bass (which some folks may have gotten used to and come to like from using other cans with extreme EQ settings applied).

    We decided to deliver the most accurate headphones we could make. So just as with multi-driver speakers, we carefully optimized for the combined output with Taction ON. You wouldn't listen to a 2-way speaker with the woofer disconnected, right?
    [​IMG]
    As shown in the attached response curves, the flattest acoustic response comes with Taction ON. For multiple reasons, we gave you the ability to tune the intensity of the base to your taste, to fit the music, etc.

    We used a combination of experienced audiophile ears and multi-kilobuck instrumentation to deliver a well-integrated high fidelity experience. It is different from other basshead cans because Kannons can deliver deep powerful bass and high-end sound at the same time. That may take some getting used to. We think that in the long run, most of you will find it more satisfying.
     
  9. TactionJohn
    First, sorry that you don't seem to be getting the full Taction experience yet. We're happy to help and see if we can resolve your issues.

    With Taction switched on and turned up all the way, Kannons give a roughly 20dB boost of deep bass (yes, even below 30Hz) relative to the midrange. That is overkill for the majority of even ardent bassheads. And we do it without adding tons of distortion in the higher frequencies.

    There are a couple of possibilities here:

    1) A small percentage of the population does not experience tactile bass as sound. In our experience, that applies to fewer than 1 in 10 people, but it is possible that you are one of them. If you are only experiencing the audio driver, you will think they are rolled off.

    2) Clamping force may be inadequate for your head. (The JVCs do use relatively high clamping force.) We will be putting up a how-to video shortly to show how you can increase the clamping force without damaging your Kannnons.

    3) Are you driving the Kannons directly from a phone? Maybe you just need more power -- Kannons are somewhat inefficient.

    4) Something might be wrong with your unit. We'll be happy to get on the phone with you and figure it out.

    Regardless, if they don't meet your expectations, we'll take them back and refund your money.

    Please feel free to reach out directly at info (at) tactiontechnology dot com.
    [​IMG]



     
    gelocks, OldDude04 and Basstion like this.
  10. flashmp3

    Hi John,

    Firstly I want to thank you for your professionalism! You have been here trying to help us since the beginning and still following our feedbacks! That is so clever and I'm so grateful!

    I m using the kannons with bass knobs almost to its maximum. Using ibasso d14 dac/amp with phone and my latest powerful MacBook pro 2016 (with the most powerful hardware). The amp has always allow me to push my jvc sz2000 to extreme sound with extreme bass I can't even bear as it s so loud. I m a fan of subbass. I can feel and hear the bass well over 30hz. But everything under is felt but not heard. It's like a rolloff. I made different basshead friends of mine listen to the kannons and they agreed they couldn't achieve what the sz2000 can do in subbass world. I felt I had to mention that on that thread as it s about the best bassheads cans. And as a bass the lover, again, I can't accept that headphones that cannot play the full range off bass frequencies could be placed above the king of bass sz2000. The minimum to be in this top 10 should be able to play all the bass frequencies well. I don't see the point having an excellent 60hz when the 30hz is weak. I prefer a medium but well played 20hz-60hz instead of an excellent 60hz but weak 30hz. For people listening to rock or edm I think the kannons should be wonderful as they allow the nice bass with clear voice as well. But for new hiphop music where beat makers like me like to play with extreme low tones, I will stick to the sz2000
     
    Malfunkt, Hawaiibadboy and OldDude04 like this.
  11. ALonDonThinG
    What power output is the ibasso d14 dac/amp ?, google says 400mw, your SZ would really like much more power than that.
    I went from 800mw to 1500 then 2100 with my SZ1 and SZ2, each step up was amazing for the sub bass with EQ.
    I would love to know what sort of power the Kannons can take, im 400 odd in the line so have a long wait to find out for myself.
    A lot of the stuff i listen to is from the early 90`s to now, but it all has lots of 20-50hz so im covered with the SZ`s they arnt going anywhere.
    I hoping the Kannons will have some other advantages over them, maybe one day there truly will be the perfect "bass head" headphones, i think we are getting closer.
     
  12. Rayz
    The bassiest (or one of the most bassiest) is definetly the Ultrasone Pro 900.
    Full and punch bass, very balanced and alive. can handle a very bass-rich explosions. (< that being said while those are amped well)
    Those headphones are the closet to speakers bass.
     
  13. FastAndClean
    the treble is really bad on those
     
  14. talan7
    I seem to have found the sweet spot with the kannons. Also, I think the sound seems to blend in better with the haptics as they break in. My initial impressions were just that, right out the box. The mids and highs are pretty good.
     
  15. BB 808
    [​IMG]
     
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