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The Hardest hitting Headphones are.. ( "The EXTREME BASS Club")

Discussion in 'Headphones (full-size)' started by hawaiibadboy, Apr 30, 2014.
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  1. Hawaiibadboy Contributor
    It is a beautiful powerful beast.
    The company did not give away 10 devices to 10 people who know jack squat but that prevented a hype train.
    I am now driving the train happily. It is very powerful, has a huge screen and the sound is superb.

    Am still getting used to the Senn. The bass boost is subtle. Well done. With the bass dial all the way down they are pretty much studio cans it seems

    The ARM2 is the real deal. Love it.
    snellemin likes this.
  2. Sound Eq
    can i assume its your most fav dap among all u have, as that to me will encourage me to get one, also the calyx got me intrigued. Calyx is out of the question for me, as such I am looking for the best android dap that is out there
    Last edited: Oct 22, 2017
  3. BB 808
    Well I need to disagree with you about the TH-X00 because they SLAM without distortion or Rice Krispies on my simple setups of iDSD Black Label or a friend's Chord Mojo and Equalizer App by Audioforge Labs. Maybe if I had a Cayin C5 or used more hyped up EQ presets I would experience what you did. My V-Moda M-100's were once beloved but I hardly use them anymore.
    Last edited: Oct 22, 2017
    Hawaiibadboy likes this.
  4. Hawaiibadboy Contributor

    Yup, you can assume that.

    It has the extra juice for planar IEM or the Kannon which can eat a little power and this dap will do it. No stack needed.
  5. DiscoProJoe
    Interesting. Does your pair of TH-X00 have a good air seal around the earcups?

    I'm also wondering if the TH-X00 was designed to hit hard in the midbass frequencies (i.e., above 60 Hz), but not so much in the sub-bass, the latter of which requires a lot more excursion.

    With the way I listen to my headphones, my portable system has extreme sub-bass (< 50 Hz), neutral-to-slightly-thin midbass and lower midrange (60 to 500 Hz) that sounds perfectly clean with absolutely no "bloat," very-pronounced upper midrange (1 to 2 kHz) with excellent "wrap-around" soundstage, and neutral-to-slightly-bright treble (> 8 kHz).

    Of course, there's some songs (such as ones with a lot of acoustic guitars) that sound better with a warmer signature, and other tunes that sound better with recessed treble, which I can also make sound great with my setup.

    Ever since my old car stereo days, I've always listened to my music differently than most people. But everyone at the New York Spring Meetup who heard my headphone system said they really liked it.
    Last edited: Oct 23, 2017
    trellus likes this.
  6. Sound Eq
    thanks so much, I will keep my eyes on the sales forum, really dig the look of that dap
    Hawaiibadboy likes this.
  7. BB 808
    • I do not have large ears or a funny shaped head so YES, I get a perfect seal with the TH-X00 (and ALL of my other headphones).
    • I do not have access to the intentions of Fostex regarding the design of their drivers.
    • I use a different definition of the frequency range: sub-bass <60Hz, bass 60Hz to 250Hz, midrange 250Hz to 2kHz, high mids 2kHz to 6kHz and treble >6kHz
    • I learned this from my old car stereo days: Instead of cranking the bass way up to increase your system's impact, raise the bass a little bit and lower the highs and mids. It's smart to keep equalization to a minimum.
    You say you were "laughably disappointed" with the TH-X00 on your portable rig and extreme sound settings. May I suggest that your extreme sound settings are what caused the distortion and Rice Krispies that you heard. Just cut your bass EQ 1 or 2 dB and remove that dumbfounded look on your face. The TH-X00 absolutely belong in the Top 10.

    snellemin, trellus and Hawaiibadboy like this.
  8. DiscoProJoe
    Since you said you got a perfect air seal, then it's possible that the earpads on the pair of TH-X00 that I listened to were just shaped really weird, or were defective. That certainly would explain it. It could've been defective drivers on that pair, too.

    But, I'm 100% sure that I was getting absolutely no clipping from the EQ, preamp output(s), or portable amp. This "Rice Krispies" phenomenon often happens when I hook up my little rig to a pair of headphones that doesn't have good power handling, X-max, or air seal. Happens with the Sennheiser HD 650 and Beats Studio Wireless, just to name a couple. Doesn't happen with the Beats Solo 3, V-Moda M-100, and Meze 99 Classic.

    Back in my old car stereo days, I didn't use a 10-band EQ or anything like that, and just used simple treble and bass controls on the head unit to match each song. Usually had the bass setting on my head unit attenuated somewhat on most songs, while gaining up the subwoofer amp quite a bit. Had a pair of Kicker CompVR 12"s in a rear-firing, sealed box (with an interior divider wall in it, of course) that was 1.75 cubic feet per subwoofer, filled halfway with pillow-stuffing material. Had separate amps for the mids & highs for the front and rear speakers, with the tweeter separates mounted in the front frame panels at ear-level, so I usually didn't have to gain up the treble, either .

    In other words, with a car stereo, you can set it up to naturally put out the sound you want without having to use extreme EQ'ing.

    Not so with headphones! That's a totally different ball game.

    Small drivers, tiny enclosure spaces inside the earcups, only one single amplifier (per pair of headphones) running full range, etc. Sorry, man, but with headphones, you're gonna need massive bass-boosting and EQ'ing to make it sound like my old car stereo. With the exception of tactile drivers, there's just no other way to achieve that with current technology.

    Let's see...the V-Moda M-100s have a natural bass-boosted sound signature of 8 dB, but also...the bass-boost switch on the Cayin C5 boosts the bass by 5.5 dB, and a Rockboxed iPod Classic has a bass-boost feature of +12 dB that's separate from the EQ. So, initally, the sub-bass and midbass both get a boost of 25.5 dB. With headphones in the real world, this equates to too much midbass and still not enough sub-bass.

    That's where DiscoProJoe's Rockbox EQ Presets comes into play! Dramatically reduces the excessive midbass (by anywhere from -5 dB to -14 dB), and further boosts the sub-bass (by as much as an additional 36.5 dB @ 40 Hz if the song needs it) on top of everything else to make the music sound absolutely amazing. And not just hit hard, but also sound absolutely amazing.

    2 sets of 590 custom EQ presets that are very-well organized, and quick and easy to navigate through and change on the fly to match each song. I developed this app off and on (through trial and error) throughout 2015 and early 2016, until I had Version 4.0. Discovered a minor tweak in late 2016 -- thanks to Hawaiibadboy -- to make it sound even better. Since then, the current version has been Version 4.1.

    Anyway, you mentioned using less bass boosting in the EQ, and dropping the mids & highs more. But Rockbox firmware has an extra bass-boost feature of +12 dB that's separate from the EQ. The Rockbox EQ also has a volume precut feature, which I use occasionally if the song needs it. If, instead, you just lower all the sliders for the mids & highs, then you're going to have to start angling down the sliders for the highs (at a steeper angle the more your 1-to-2-kHz sliders are dropped below 0 dB)...in order to keep the high-end treble sounding the same. With a volume precut feature, you don't need to do that.

    In DiscoProJoe's Rockbox EQ Presets, I only needed to angle the treble sliders downward (at a steeper and steeper angle) in the presets for the sub-bass increments beyond the 6th ones, in which the lowest band (40 Hz) is already maxed out at +24 dB, and everything else needs to be lowered (besides 40 Hz) to further add more sub-bass.

    And as for needing a volume precut for the EQ...I only need to use it for bass on about 5 percent of the songs in my music collection, or less. That's because most song recordings seem to be "rolled off" below 60 Hz, which often means that you can max out the 40 Hz slider on your Rockbox EQ by +24 dB (especially on most pop music from the 1980s), and there will still be a deficit without any EQ clipping.

    So in DiscoProJoe's Rockbox EQ Presets, a particular EQ preset will only have an automatic volume precut if one of the sliders besides the 40 Hz low-shelf filter is actually boosted above 0 dB. In most cases, it's only the "Boosted Treble" and "Additional Boosted Treble" subcategories that use an automatic volume precut.

    But luckily, there's only about 10 percent of the songs in my music collection that actually need a treble boost. Most songs don't. If most songs need a treble boost, then either A) you're boosting the midbass (and lower midrange) too much and drowning out the highs, or B) your equipment just doesn't naturally produce good treble. The V-Moda M-100 has excellent-sounding highs.

    To conclude, I'm super, duper glad I attended the New York Spring Meetup in June of this year. It really gave me a lot of validation for what I'm doing. Just about everyone -- even Jude -- told me they thought it sounded good.

    MikeZhao sent me the following private message later that evening:

    Very glad we were able to connect today! It's not often I'm genuinely blown away by audio. But I can definitively say I've never heard anything even approaching your setup in portable form. What a treat! I can't say I would be able to listen with those EQ settings regularly, but my gosh I admire how far you've pushed things. I had no idea headphones could ever produce that sound so kudos to you for continuously refining the sound you're going for.

    This is what I love about meetups: the people are great, and can actually hear your stuff. You also can hear your own equipment and sound settings on other people's headphones and components, too, to see if there's anything better.

    Personally, I only post a little on Head-Fi from time to time, now. But if I ever can make it to another meetup in the future that's advertised far enough in advance, then I'll be there! :k701smile:
    trellus and MICHAELSD like this.
  9. BB 808
    OK, I get it. Nobody will enjoy their headphones unless they do "massive bass-boosting and EQ'ing" and to do that we all need to have "DiscoProJoe's Rockbox EQ Presets" so that we have a 1 in 590 chance of getting the perfect EQ for any particular song we want to listen to. If any of the presets cause distortion, too bad so sad it's time to replace our beloved headphones with a Beats Solo 3, V-Moda M-100, and Meze 99 Classic.
  10. Hawaiibadboy Contributor
    10,000 Posts beeechuz


    biggest bass related thread in the sites history

    Allow me this moment to tell everyone from the past 4 ish years
    that acted like a fool or dissed a basshead to eat a bag of "D"'s

    C ya at 1 million suka

    Last edited: Oct 24, 2017
    DiscoProJoe likes this.
  11. DiscoProJoe
    Haha,...well, with some experience at using this app, it typically takes me about 30 seconds to find the best preset for the next song after it starts playing. If I'm completely unsure of what to expect, then I might just start with the preset "Lite Classic 0" and take it from there.

    But once I find the right preset, oh,...it is totally worth the effort. :)

    Darn, I was about to post about this, and you beat me to it! :laughing:

    I was going to ask if you could send me a little trinket prize with the name "Hawaiibadboy" appearing on it...for making the 10,000th post. But, oh well,...maybe I'll try again at 100,000.... (ha)
  12. OldDude04
    Holy hell man, 30 seconds trying out hundreds of EQ presets? At the beginning of every song? That would sap the enjoyment right out of me listening to music.
  13. DiscoProJoe
    Back in my old car stereo days, it was the same story. I'd figure out where to set the treble, bass, and subwoofer gains for each song. Nowadays with my portable headphone system, first I pick a midbass category, then a treble subcategory, and then, finally, a sub-bass increment.

    I've been living, eating, and breathing this stuff since I was 16 and had my first "little big" car stereo. You change the song,...you change the sound settings to match it.

    So I guess the more things "change" in life, the more they stay the same! :wink:
  14. snellemin
    Really enjoying the 2K in balanced config and the bargain sheepskin brainwavz pads.
  15. OldDude04
    I love the sheepskin HM5 pads on my SZ2k as well.
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