[LevA]

damn...and I was just happy to snag a brand new ipod video on ebay...
 

 

[ClieOS]

A bit of clarification: I have seen picture of the prototype (actually it is more like pre-prototype) and some of the more in-depth hardware detail, not the actual device. Only a few people in FiiO actually saw the pre-prototype devices provided by that controller company and they are still far from actually turning the pre-prototype into a working prototype.

The problem with SigmaTel is the company is in bad shape and could go away any time (just wiki SigmaTel and you will know). I like the idea of using WM8740 as it is known to be quite capable, newer generation WM8741 would be great as well but the doubling in price might not worth the effort. I am really more interested in the amp section - something similar to E7 amp section should suffice IMO. Anyone who like a better amp section should use the line-out with E11 or any other amp. Making E11 amp section into X3 will not be practical as the opamp alone will suck dry the battery. Removable battery is a good idea, but what kind of removable battery will a big challenge: Standard cellphone battery probably is not going to have enough capacity, plus they often are larger in size, making it difficult to implement in a slim design. If you look at E11 prototype, you will know you will an extra compartment just for this type battery. I am leaning more toward a generic Li-ion battery with an easily removable battery socket, so no soldering is needed for battery replacement in the future.

Standard coaxial (RCA) will be a bit too thick, the easy way is to use the same route as HifiMan, with a 3.5mm connector and an extra 3.5mm to RCA adapter. 2.5mm would also work in this case.

 

[EddieE]

Hey ClieOS, sorry for getting the wrong end of the stick, thinking you had a prototype.
 
I agree with what you're saying about amp and dac - if it was the same circuitry as the E7 it would be on a par with any other commerical DAP IMO and you can by pass not just the amp as with many other DAPs but the DAC too if you want, which is a very rare feature.
 
Re. the 3.5mm coaxial - I didn't know they existed but that is good news as it means the X3 would not need to be too thick.

 

[JamesFiiO]

It is impossible for a portable DAP to realize all the request! so
 
1, If you need higher output power to drive some earphone/headphone on the go,  We design an E11, it can pair with X3 through Line out! to have higher and better amp!
 
2, If you need a better DAC than WM978740, We will have a new portable DAC/AMP which with coaxial./usb/optical digtal and suport at least 96k/24k format!
 
3, If you wants a huge power output for your headphone, you can dock it into our E9, which had been proved to be a decent amp to HD600/650, DT880/990, K701/K702, of course, if you can affort the price of T1, and HD800 , I guess you will not buy our E9, LOL, not about SQ but the
 
   class!
 
4,If you need high capacitor, X3 support up to 32g TF! if you wants to put all your music into a affortable player, we will based on this solution develop a desktop HD player which can support Hard Disk! mark this HD is not hard disk!
 
5,If you really need a long playtime, we can also provide some extra backup power ( we had developed a PSU in 3 years ago which integrate a charger, power supplier, backup power ).
 
We have a unbroken new products plan,  you will see all is relate with each others! but before we start some new project, we really need to make some researching to find if it is worth to do that! 
 
I guess you all know we will not try to recover the cost of R/D in just hundreds unit! and we never clone or copy others design, so the cost of R/D is quite high! so only when we belive we can sell thousands. we can keep the price in a reasonable level! 
 

 

[KuKuBuKu]

Could you make the new x3 at least 1mm thin and sprinkle unicorn dust? If no, that could be a deal breaker.

 

[i_djoel2000]

my expectation on this DAP is either this two:
 
1. has decent DAC chip + 3.5mm line out, or
 
2. has optical output (iriver h1xx series successor!!)
 
@feiao: what dac chip will you implement in this X3?

 

[JamesFiiO]

WM8740

 

[EddieE]

Quote:

2, If you need a better DAC than WM978740, We will have a new portable DAC/AMP which with coaxial./usb/optical digtal and suport at least 96k/24k format!
 

Aha! I was hoping to hear that! 

 

[i_djoel2000]

Quote:

WM8740

niiiceeee..
 
i'm getting excited with this DAP rather than the E11 now

 
any time estimation on when this DAP will be released?

 

[Nihility]

having usb digital out, would be amazing. since i'd be pairing it with my e7 most likely (i pair my ipod dock out --> e7) and its good for me, i dont use hard to drive headphones (grados mostly).
 
i dont see what the issue is with thickness are, i have an e7 and i actually wished my ipod was that size/shape when i got it.
 
assuming it has at least 32 gb.. ill get this no problem.
 
if its less.. i hope it has a (properly integrated) min (NOT MICRO) sd card slot, so i could affordably upgrade size.
 
i currently have 100+ gigs of 320mp3's/AAC files I avoid lossless because i switch DAC's a lot (hopefully i can settle on Fiio.. i love my e7/e9 combo) so worrying about FLAC and apple lossless compatibility was a huge hassle.
 
I know theres a difference between lossless and 320 but its mostly bring it with me and listen to it or while im on my computer doing other stuff.
 
If i want to sit down and really enjoy high quality source - i use vinyl
 
anyway. im REALLY looking forward to this. some sort of projected date would be awesome because im really to throw my ipod out the window. i hate this stupid touch wheel.

 

[Riku540]

Quote:

It is impossible for a portable DAP to realize all the request! so
 
1, If you need higher output power to drive some earphone/headphone on the go,  We design an E11, it can pair with X3 through Line out! to have higher and better amp!
 
2, If you need a better DAC than WM978740, We will have a new portable DAC/AMP which with coaxial./usb/optical digtal and suport at least 96k/24k format!
 
3, If you wants a huge power output for your headphone, you can dock it into our E9, which had been proved to be a decent amp to HD600/650, DT880/990, K701/K702, of course, if you can affort the price of T1, and HD800 , I guess you will not buy our E9, LOL, not about SQ but the
 
   class!
 
4,If you need high capacitor, X3 support up to 32g TF! if you wants to put all your music into a affortable player, we will based on this solution develop a desktop HD player which can support Hard Disk! mark this HD is not hard disk!
 
5,If you really need a long playtime, we can also provide some extra backup power ( we had developed a PSU in 3 years ago which integrate a charger, power supplier, backup power ).
 
We have a unbroken new products plan,  you will see all is relate with each others! but before we start some new project, we really need to make some researching to find if it is worth to do that! 
 
I guess you all know we will not try to recover the cost of R/D in just hundreds unit! and we never clone or copy others design, so the cost of R/D is quite high! so only when we belive we can sell thousands. we can keep the price in a reasonable level! 

Good to know the battery and storage capacities aren't going to be an issue; we can put a lot the the discussion for that to rest.
 
Also, I like how James just casually mentions a new DAC in the works in a thread of something that hasn't been released yet.
 
Looks like I'll be buying quite a lot of FiiO products in 2011.
 
Quote:

/img/forum/go_quote.gif

I have to whole-heartedly disagree with you.
 
Do many of these features already exist in current products? Of course, I don't think anyone would argue that. But what I think you miss with the sound-only stance is that for the majority of consumers, the balance of those features is also very important. I've been trying to decide between 3 different devices as an upgrade for the past couple months, at least, and still can't come to a conclusion because, while all those devices are excellent, each has balance issues that prevent me from picking a clear winner. If there was a perfect player out there for me, I'd have it almost regardless of the cost. But that isn't the case for me or most others. What people in this thread (myself included) have done is list the features which really matter to them. A lot of people have very similar ideas, and many of the requested features I don't think are too unreasonable. I think a lot of it really can be done to make a great balanced DAP.
 
If you want to throw out battery life and storage considerations, etc., for an uncompromising focus on sound quality, then guess what? There's already a product for you. It's called the S:flo2 and by all accounts should give you a fantastic 6 or 7 hours of listening to a small portion of your music collection. Personally, a poor UI, short runtime, and limited storage capacity make it pretty easy for me to pass up, sound quality be damned. And that's true of a lot people.
 
FiiO's philosophy seems to be one of providing products to a large target market at a low price, so I don't think they're aiming to design an extreme niche audiophile product here. They have to find what lots of people care about in a portable music player in order to design something that lots of people would want. Nobody wants a dud of a player, but lots of people, even here, want more than sound quality alone.
 
Edit:
Personally, I'm less than satisfied with anything less than 10 hours for battery life. More is obviously nicer for those longer periods you have to go without a charger, but for the most part I would agree with you that more than 24 hours is unnecessary for all but the most extreme cases.
However, if FiiO went the route you suggested, I'd honestly be a disappointed at what could have been. The thing may sound better, but it will come at a pretty big cost to usability for a lot of potential users.
What I would like to see is a player that sounds good and strikes a better balance between features than the competition. What I won't bother with is a player that sounds great while sacrificing all else.

You missed the point completely; I suggested the X3 have far more battery than 6-10 hours and 8 gigs as an extreme minimum. I just don't think we need an excess 100 hours and 500gb storage as some mentioned here...

 

[tds101]

@feiao: What battery life are you trying to get from the player? Just a question, as I know this is a "pre-beta" model right now.

 

[Berserker]

Looking forward to a release FiiO. Sounds interesting. I have the E3, E5, and E7. I enjoy FiiO products.

 

[JoetheArachnid]

Quote:

2, If you need a better DAC than WM978740, We will have a new portable DAC/AMP which with coaxial./usb/optical digtal and suport at least 96k/24k format!
 

*facebrick*
 
What have you done? Now we'll get another thread completely derailed by wildly speculating about a product still very much in pre-alpha phase.

 
 
On topic, I really like the idea of a 2.5mm TS jack for the digital coax out. (Just an FYI to others - coax needs a connector with two conductors. That's it. Doesn't matter if it's RCA or anything else, but RCA or BNC tends to be standard.) This would, quite importantly IMO, stop people from accidentally plugging headphones into it and getting their gear/ears destroyed. Plus it would hopefully help to keep it low-profile and not take up too much internal space.
Also good to hear that we'll get up to 32GB microSD support, but I'd still like a reasonable internal storage if possible.

 

[charlie0904]

are we talking about transport now? hehe...
its going to be exciting.