The Cure's new album 4:13 Dream
Oct 29, 2008 at 9:25 PM Thread Starter Post #1 of 16

milkweg

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Only listened to the complete album once through so far but my impression is that the only really good song out of 13 songs is Scream. The rest of it is just average or a bit weak. At least by The Cure standards.
 
Oct 29, 2008 at 9:32 PM Post #2 of 16

BloodSugar00

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Quote:

Originally Posted by milkweg /img/forum/go_quote.gif
Only listened to the complete album once through so far but my impression is that the only really good song out of 13 songs is Scream. The rest of it is just average or a bit weak. At least by The Cure standards.


For me, an album needs 3-4-5-6 listens for me to make any conclusive judgements. However, your findings are disappointing to me, as I've recently been listening to a lot of the Cure for the first time and I was kinda hoping they'd produce a stunner in this new release and that'd be a nice record to come to after exploring all of their backcatalogue prior to it. I'll still give it a chance though
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. Look forward to more impressions!
 
Oct 29, 2008 at 9:38 PM Post #3 of 16

milkweg

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OK, I'll give it a few more listens and then post some more but I can tell right away that is not as good as their last album from 2004 called just The Cure. I know all of The Cures music and have been listening to them since 1981 so know of what I speak.

Just checked the score at metacritic and the average is 71 and no review gives it above 80 so even after only one listen I would say that score pretty much jives with what I said.

http://www.metacritic.com/music/artists/cure/413dream
 
Oct 29, 2008 at 10:05 PM Post #4 of 16

BloodSugar00

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Quote:

Originally Posted by milkweg /img/forum/go_quote.gif
OK, I'll give it a few more listens and then post some more but I can tell right away that is not as good as their last album from 2004 called just The Cure. I know all of The Cures music and have been listening to them since 1981 so know of what I speak.

Just checked the score at metacritic and the average is 71 and no review gives it above 80 so even after only one listen I would say that score pretty much jives with what I said.

The Cure: 4:13 Dream (2008): Reviews



Fine, I respect that. I'm just saying that, for me, you gota approach things with an open mind and give them a fair enough chance to shine and/or grow on you. That's what I find anyway. The best music oftens grows on me with time.
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To each their own anyway. Look forward to more impressions (not just off you but from other members also). All I'm saying, and it's not a pop or jibe at you or your musical or listening prestige, is that I take first impressions lightly (I do understand that you cited that you have only listened to the album all the way through once).
 
Oct 30, 2008 at 12:21 AM Post #5 of 16

PWilson

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Generally I agree that an album needs a few listens before a judgement is made. Some will really start to shine as it clicks into place. Some, however, will stay at the murky depths
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Oct 30, 2008 at 12:25 AM Post #6 of 16

jernmo

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Agreed about the number of listens Blood. I won't pass judgment on an album unless I've heard it at least three times. Also I've noticed that if I don't like an album, I put it away for a few weeks and bring it out again. Sometimes that's when I really discover that the songs were great, I just may not have been in the mood at the time, or expecting something else.
 
Oct 30, 2008 at 1:01 AM Post #7 of 16

jellojoe

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Quote:

Originally Posted by milkweg /img/forum/go_quote.gif
OK, I'll give it a few more listens and then post some more but I can tell right away that is not as good as their last album from 2004 called just The Cure. I know all of The Cures music and have been listening to them since 1981 so know of what I speak.

Just checked the score at metacritic and the average is 71 and no review gives it above 80 so even after only one listen I would say that score pretty much jives with what I said.

The Cure: 4:13 Dream (2008): Reviews




Amazing, even worse than the last album. I listened to that one a few times and gave it away because I didn't want it tainting the rest of the discography. IMHO, they've been going through the motions since Wish.
 
Oct 30, 2008 at 4:59 AM Post #8 of 16

bong

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i may be biased as i'm sure people on head-fi probably label me as The Cure fanboy#1, but i like the new album. it has a lot of surprises, twist and turns for a Cure album... although i do kinda agree it isn't as instantly likeable as the last self-titled one. i do think this is a grower. 4:13 Dream has been getting a lot more positive reviews than the self-titled album four years ago IIRC.

that said, "Underneath the Stars" is as hauntingly beautiful as anything from "Plainsong" to "All Cats are Grey," it's that good! best Cure song in quite a long while. "The Scream" is satisfyingly dark, aggressive, and angry, and "The Reasons Why" is classic poppy, melancholy Cure. Three of my faves from the new album at the moment. IMO "The Perfect Boy" is my pick of the four singles released.

saw them live just this past July, and The Cure never ceases to amaze me... they truly are the kings of stamina! let's see some young whipper-snapper band play three hours straight.

oh, and they have been awarded NME's Godlike Genius award for 2009... 'bout effin' time too, should've been awarded before New Order in my opinion, and i love both bands.
The Cure honoured - Music news, latest news, artists, bands | MSN Music UK | MSN Entertainment | MSN UK

EDIT: oh, and it has been reported that there were enough material to fill up two albums during this recording session... the album released as 4:13 Dream consciously collected the set of upbeat and more rock-sounding songs. the other songs recorded are supposed to be very dark and melancholy (straight from the horse's mouth, Mr. Smith) and may be released next spring... should satisfy those who are waiting for Disintegration II or something.
 
Oct 30, 2008 at 7:48 AM Post #9 of 16

milkweg

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Quote:

Originally Posted by jellojoe /img/forum/go_quote.gif
Amazing, even worse than the last album. I listened to that one a few times and gave it away because I didn't want it tainting the rest of the discography. IMHO, they've been going through the motions since Wish.


Heh, I'm the same way with my DVD collection. A friend of mine keeps giving me his old DVD's as he buys them in BluRay versions and while I do appreciate it I have to say it is watering down the quality of my collection. I abolutely refuse to give his Steven Seagal movies a home though.

Some albums need more listens to fully judge them but if I know a band really well then it is not always the case. The 2004 The Cure cd didn't get great reviews but I found far more than one good song on it. I would say it had 3 or 4 fairly good songs. 4:13 Dream is not bad, I just find it mediocre and for The Cure that is not acceptable to me. I expect better from them because I know they are capable of it. But I guess they have had their day and it is time to move on. I don't consider Disintegration as their high point like many people do either. For me that would be 17 Seconds, Faith and Pornography as the height of their artisitic creativity.
 
Oct 30, 2008 at 1:00 PM Post #10 of 16

bong

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i think with bands like The Cure, who has a rich history and an expansive back catalogue discography, they will never get fair album reviews from either professional critics and long time fans. i know i'm guilty of doing it myself, but i try not to. people will always compare the new release with Disintegration, Pornograpy, The Head on the Door, etc. it's like when Playing the Angel came out, it was a great album, got glowing reviews, but people still downplayed it when they compared it with Violator... it was unfair to Depeche Mode as an artist.

to me, it's unfair to the band as an artist, and it's unfair to the music as there will always be a basis of comparison and not have the new album stand on it's own right. a bad album is a bad album, and a good album is a good album, regardless of past glories.

also, to say an artist is capable of better things than a current release, that may be true but there are factors that cannot be repeated. artists, like people, live throught different times and move on.

my $0.02
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that said, i've been listening to 4:13 Dream non-stop since last week, and i have to say it's a very cohesive album. i think The Cure (the last album) had a few stronger songs but 4:13 Dream is a better collection of songs.
 
Oct 30, 2008 at 1:22 PM Post #11 of 16

BloodSugar00

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Quote:

Originally Posted by milkweg /img/forum/go_quote.gif
Heh, I'm the same way with my DVD collection. A friend of mine keeps giving me his old DVD's as he buys them in BluRay versions and while I do appreciate it I have to say it is watering down the quality of my collection. I abolutely refuse to give his Steven Seagal movies a home though.

Some albums need more listens to fully judge them but if I know a band really well then it is not always the case. The 2004 The Cure cd didn't get great reviews but I found far more than one good song on it. I would say it had 3 or 4 fairly good songs. 4:13 Dream is not bad, I just find it mediocre and for The Cure that is not acceptable to me. I expect better from them because I know they are capable of it. But I guess they have had their day and it is time to move on. I don't consider Disintegration as their high point like many people do either. For me that would be 17 Seconds, Faith and Pornography as the height of their artisitic creativity.



Point taken. I can understand how one can have more of an instant feel for something in that way and judge the quality quicker, quality being the key word. This may evade wants, hopes, desires, preconceptions narrowations of band-width as you listen and all that, that what can unfairly bias a listener's perception as they listen to a new record or release from a band etc. It sounds to me, now, like you do approach and have approached this listen with an open mind and a willingness to follow the artist(s) and what they want to explore and/or express, and you're, from having listened extensively to them and their careeer, are simply able to tap in and feel and see that these arrangements are not to the quality or creativity they have previously exhibited down the years. In that respect yu see it as disjointed, sluggish, mediocre. I can understand that. Still I will listen with an open mind, be recpetive to the artists art and ideas and concepts etc and 'truly' listen to them, and see what I feel about it (which is ultimately the point and what one needs to do for themselves
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).

P.s.// I gota mate into Segeal also. He's got all his DVD's. Terrible films. But worthy of a chuckle!
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Quote:

Originally Posted by PWilson
Generally I agree that an album needs a few listens before a judgement is made. Some will really start to shine as it clicks into place. Some, however, will stay at the murky depths
tongue.gif
.



I agree. This is generally my experience to a tee, pretty much. However, I can imagine and have experienced to some extent what Milkweg details ie having enough experiece of an artist(s), their careers and music etc, that you can begin to adjudge the quality of the compositions, musical complexity and/or creativity etc etc more quickly/instantly.

Quote:

Originally Posted by jernmo
Agreed about the number of listens Blood. I won't pass judgment on an album unless I've heard it at least three times. Also I've noticed that if I don't like an album, I put it away for a few weeks and bring it out again. Sometimes that's when I really discover that the songs were great, I just may not have been in the mood at the time, or expecting something else.


It's funny you should say that as I've been beginning to notice that I do this a lot lately! Music I bought 4-5 months ago I'm suddenly relistening to, clicking with and thoroughly enjoying
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Quote:

Originally Posted by bong
i may be biased as i'm sure people on head-fi probably label me as The Cure fanboy#1, but i like the new album. it has a lot of surprises, twist and turns for a Cure album... although i do kinda agree it isn't as instantly likeable as the last self-titled one. i do think this is a grower. 4:13 Dream has been getting a lot more positive reviews than the self-titled album four years ago IIRC.

that said, "Underneath the Stars" is as hauntingly beautiful as anything from "Plainsong" to "All Cats are Grey," it's that good! best Cure song in quite a long while. "The Scream" is satisfyingly dark, aggressive, and angry, and "The Reasons Why" is classic poppy, melancholy Cure. Three of my faves from the new album at the moment. IMO "The Perfect Boy" is my pick of the four singles released.

saw them live just this past July, and The Cure never ceases to amaze me... they truly are the kings of stamina! let's see some young whipper-snapper band play three hours straight.

oh, and they have been awarded NME's Godlike Genius award for 2009... 'bout effin' time too, should've been awarded before New Order in my opinion, and i love both bands.
The Cure honoured - Music news, latest news, artists, bands | MSN Music UK | MSN Entertainment | MSN UK

EDIT: oh, and it has been reported that there were enough material to fill up two albums during this recording session... the album released as 4:13 Dream consciously collected the set of upbeat and more rock-sounding songs. the other songs recorded are supposed to be very dark and melancholy (straight from the horse's mouth, Mr. Smith) and may be released next spring... should satisfy those who are waiting for Disintegration II or something



Haha, I remember your name from the thread I started when I was looking for new Cure material recommendations to explore after Wish! I think, also, possibly, from the I started citing impressions of Kiss Me, Kiss Me, Kiss Me, I subsequently bought.
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As it happens, that album has and is growing on me massively!

I understand your possible bias- but I'm likely to be biased also as I've gotten into The Cure pretty solidly!-, but it's great to hear some positive remarks about the new record and it's encouraging for me that you cite it as a grower! I knew they had made that decision to go in that more poppy, bouncier, happier vein for this release, and thus most of the more heavy and moody songs cut were left off this release (hopefully and I think with intention to be released in the future) but I like either focus/style they adopt so no probs there! I'm gona have to pick it up. Still I think I'll stick with my plan- listen to an digest The Top through Wish; listen and digest Three Imaginary Boys through Pornography; Wild Mood Swings through 4:13 Dream.
 
Oct 31, 2008 at 12:54 AM Post #12 of 16

milkweg

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Yea, people do change and not always for the better. In muisc it is often for the worse because peoole lose their edge and creativity as they get older. I love Sinead O'Connor's early music but I would not buy an album of hers if she put one out today. She has completely changed and her voice is not very good at all anymore. If you don't believe me then go listen to some of her 2008 concert tour on youtube. I find it hard to believe that is even her up on stage. Her voice has been ruined from too many cigarrettes or something. Sad.
 
Oct 31, 2008 at 3:46 AM Post #13 of 16

dabblerblue

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So far I am loving the new album to bits. I am part of the crew that thinks it's the best album in the last 15 years from the boys.

I absolutely love Underneath The Stars, The Reasons Why, Freakshow, Switch, Sleep When I'm Dead, Scream, and It's Over.

Totally looking forward to the reportedly darker companion album that will be following 4:13 Dream.
 
Nov 6, 2008 at 3:48 PM Post #14 of 16

milkweg

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Bloodflowers was only 8 years ago and this album is not better than that one, IMO. I've given it another listen and I was more favourable to it but still not grabbing me. Perhaps I will like their next album better as I have always liked their darker music better. It was the dark music that first drew me to The Cure and not stuff like The Head On the Door album and Love Cats etc.
 

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