[BeBop Lives]

Bebop, you ought to be a politician! We asked for names of better performing and better value amps than the C5, and you haven't answered the question.....

Which part of what you read don't you understand? I wont insult your intelligence by suggesting you believe what you just said.

 

[CoFire]

However, there are better values and performance for the same money.

I wanted clarification on this part with some suggestions, not just some very general generic statement that portable amps work better with low ohm iems and headphones. To be complete, you should have said work better with iems and headphones with less than xx ohm impedence in conjunction with higher than xxx dB sensitivity. That's really the more complete story, but I'm interested in suggestions. Thanks in advance.

 

[thelonious58]

Be advised in my opinion portable units, and that would be amps deigned for PORTABLE use (to carry and take with you, combined with a DAP source), are best suited for headphones and iem's with ohm values on the lower end.  Try and experiment with  the various possibilities.  It's about your equipment, your ears. and, your wallet among other things. Good hunting!

And the various possibilities are .....? I haven't read the whole thread, but at least three different posters have asked for specific recommendations after your critique of the Cayin C5. They are interested in knowing what the better performing options are in the same price bracket. I'm not being flippant, just asking for specific recommendations

 

[DiscoProJoe]

Got another little component to use with my portable headphone system if I ever need it:
 

 
Has a 30-pin plug on one end, and a micro-USB jack on the other. In my dual-listening setup (click the link to view), I have two Cayin C5 amps. But I only use the dual-listening setup (which includes the 2nd amp) about 10 percent of the time. So...I got this little adaptor for my beloved Rockboxed iPod Classic...to connect to that short little micro-USB-to-micro-USB dongle that comes with the Cayin C5, pictured below:
 

 
So now, if I'm ever out-and-about, or on a long flight or whatever, and my iPod gets low on juice, then I can just use my 30-pin adaptor plug with the little micro-USB dongle, and plug it into the "CHG OUT" port on my 2nd Cayin C5 amp that's usually sitting idle 90 percent of the time. Then, I just turn on that amp and it starts charging the iPod. This 2nd amp can be used as a portable charging station, now -- even for my iPod Classic! Yay! 

 
(Of course, I also can use the micro-USB dongle with the 2nd amp (without the 30-pin adaptor) to charge my 1st Cayin C5 amp that's tethered to my iPod, as well. I run it from the "CHG OUT" port on the 2nd amp...to the "PWR IN" port on the 1st amp.)
 
So this month, my portable headphone system got two upgrades: an upgrade for DiscoProJoe's Rockbox EQ Presets (to the new Version 4.1 -- click the link for more info), and now...this new little adaptor I got off Taobao at this link for a buck!
 
Music to my ears.... 

 
Anyway, I plan on attending the New York spring meetup on Saturday, June 10, 2017, and will have a table set up with my portable headphone system and extreme EQ presets for everyone to hear. (Click here for more details, if you're interested.)
 
Oh well,...have fun, everyone....

 

[Mrbutts]

Nice

 

[teston]

I have a question. When the third led indicator blink while charging the cayin C5, it means the C5 is full battery or wait for it to stop blinking? Because I was charging it for more than 12 hours and it still blink. 

 

[BeBop Lives]

  I have a question. When the third led indicator blink while charging the cayin C5, it means the C5 is full battery or wait for it to stop blinking? Because I was charging it for more than 12 hours and it still blink. 

Wait for it to stop blinking.  When all three are lit up the unit is fully charged.

 

[skingg]

  I have a question. When the third led indicator blink while charging the cayin C5, it means the C5 is full battery or wait for it to stop blinking? Because I was charging it for more than 12 hours and it still blink. 

Are you using a proper2A charger and usb cable? Because I do not remember the C5 taking anywhere close to 12 hours and not getting fully charged.

 

[teston]

Are you using a proper2A charger and usb cable? Because I do not remember the C5 taking anywhere close to 12 hours and not getting fully charged.

Yep I'm using the Xiaomi Mi4 wall charger and the Cayin C5 stock usb cable. It took nearly 20 hours to stop the blinking led.
The charger is fine so I think that the C5 is defective. Just bought it from the black friday.

 

[Vicca Tito]

Hi, joined the club.
Amazing little amp.
 
 

 

[big45-70]

How does the C5 compare to the A5?

 

[DiscoProJoe]

  How does the C5 compare to the A5?

 
I used to use the FiiO E12A, and have heard that the A5 is exactly like the E12A. That is,...except with a total power output of 800mW (at 32 ohms), instead of the E12A's 400mW.
 
Cayin overrates the C5 at 1600mW (i.e., "800mW + 800mW"), but in my experience with extreme sub-bass EQ'ing, I personally would rate the C5 at about 900mW (450mW + 450 mW) total.
 
I used to use the FiiO E12A until after Rockboxing my iPod, and realizing I needed more power to push the extra bass. So I replaced it with the Cayin C5.
 
You can read a long, detailed post I made about it here on Head-Fi at this link. That was in April 2015:  back when I was using my first general set of EQ presets in Rockbox firmware, which I now call Version 1.x.
 
(Earlier this month in December 2016, I just came out with Version 4.1 at this big link!)
 
From my experience with both the C5 and E12A, I would recommend the C5 if your music player has a customizable 10-band EQ on it (or if it can be Rockboxed). The slightly extra power of the C5 really comes in handy if you're a basshead and are pushing a lot of sub-bass. A customizable 10-band EQ (on a music player) can be used to correct the excessive amount of midbass / lower midrange that the C5's bass-boost switch puts out. Trust me,...if you're pushing a ton of low-end sub-bass,...you need all the power you can get.  

 
The C5 also can be used as a portable charging station as well (with its "CHG OUT" port), whereas the A5 doesn't have that function.
 
On the other hand, I would recommend the A5 if your music player doesn't have a customizable 10-band EQ, and/or can't be Rockboxed. The A5's (and E12A's) bass-boost switch sounds a lot better than the C5's bass switch without using an EQ.
 
(Both the C5's and the A5's bass switch will boost the sub-bass by 5.5-to-6 dB.)
 
Here's a cool secret: if you have an EQ and you're changing from a C5 amp to an A5, and if you always use the bass-boost switch, then you should implement the following adjustment to your EQ bands to make the A5 sound similar:
 
125 Hz:  +1.5 dB
250 Hz:  +1.5 dB
500 Hz:  +0.3 dB
 
If you're changing from an A5 / E12A to a C5, then the proper EQ adjustment (for the bass switch) for the C5 would be...
 
125 Hz:  -1.5 dB
250 Hz:  -1.5 dB
500 Hz:  -0.3 dB
 
Anyway, I hope this helps. Happy amping! 

 

 

[Andykong]

I used to use the FiiO E12A, and have heard that the A5 is exactly like the E12A. That is,...except with a total power output of 800mW (at 32 ohms), instead of the E12A's 400mW.

Cayin overrates the C5 at 1600mW (i.e., "800mW + 800mW"), but in my experience with extreme sub-bass EQ'ing, I personally would rate the C5 at about 900mW (450mW + 450 mW) total.

I used to use the FiiO E12A until after Rockboxing my iPod, and realizing I needed more power to push the extra bass. So I replaced it with the Cayin C5.

You can read a long, detailed post I made about it here on Head-Fi at this link. That was in April 2015:  back when I was using my first general set of EQ presets in Rockbox firmware, which I now call Version 1.x.

(Earlier this month in December 2016, I just came out with Version 4.1 at this big link!)

From my experience with both the C5 and E12A, I would recommend the C5 if your music player has a customizable 10-band EQ on it (or if it can be Rockboxed). The slightly extra power of the C5 really comes in handy if you're a basshead and are pushing a lot of sub-bass. A customizable 10-band EQ (on a music player) can be used to correct the excessive amount of midbass / lower midrange that the C5's bass-boost switch puts out. Trust me,...if you're pushing a ton of low-end sub-bass,...you need all the power you can get.  

The C5 also can be used as a portable charging station as well (with its "CHG OUT" port), whereas the A5 doesn't have that function.

On the other hand, I would recommend the A5 if your music player doesn't have a customizable 10-band EQ, and/or can't be Rockboxed. The A5's (and E12A's) bass-boost switch sounds a lot better than the C5's bass switch without using an EQ.

(Both the C5's and the A5's bass switch will boost the sub-bass by 5.5-to-6 dB.)

Here's a cool secret: if you have an EQ and you're changing from a C5 amp to an A5, and if you always use the bass-boost switch, then you should implement the following adjustment to your EQ bands to make the A5 sound similar:

125 Hz:  +1.5 dB
250 Hz:  +1.5 dB
500 Hz:  +0.3 dB

If you're changing from an A5 / E12A to a C5, then the proper EQ adjustment (for the bass switch) for the C5 would be...

125 Hz:  -1.5 dB
250 Hz:  -1.5 dB
500 Hz:  -0.3 dB

Anyway, I hope this helps. Happy amping!   

Very interesting impression on C5 and A5/E12A. I am very interested in your conclusion that "I personally would rate the C5 at about 900mW (450mW + 450 mW) total." Did you measure the output of C5? or through subjective listening? Can you tell me what headphones has been used to determine your output rating? What about the source used in the rating? a mobile phone? a DAP with genius line out? or you are connecting to the phone out of the iPod directly?

The EQ suggestion is also very interesting, how many headphones have you been used to test this EQ setting? Are you sure the setting will be valid to everything from IEM to high impedance headphone?

 

[DiscoProJoe]

Very interesting impression on C5 and A5/E12A. I am very interested in your conclusion that "I personally would rate the C5 at about 900mW (450mW + 450 mW) total." Did you measure the output of C5? or through subjective listening? Can you tell me what headphones has been used to determine your output rating? What about the source used in the rating? a mobile phone? a DAP with genius line out? or you are connecting to the phone out of the iPod directly?

The EQ suggestion is also very interesting, how many headphones have you been used to test this EQ setting? Are you sure the setting will be valid to everything from IEM to high impedance headphone?

 
I didn't use any measuring equipment to determine the power output; it was just through subjective listening. I was using my V-Moda M-100 headphones with my Rockboxed iPod Classic, and while using the headphone output port on the iPod, running through the line input of the Cayin C5. (This is how I always listen.)
 
I don't use the 30-pin port on the iPod (as a line-out) for listening, because this will disable the volume control on the iPod. The way I listen (with "double amping") makes no audible difference in the sound quality for me, nor does it affect the power output of the Cayin C5.
 
For the EQ settings, I only used my M-100s, so I can't be sure that my "adjustment" numbers will apply to other kinds of headphones. These numbers may or may not apply to other headphones; I just haven't tested that.
 
Anyway, if you haven't already, I'd strongly suggest that you follow this link to my in-depth comparison post from April 2015, comparing the E12A to the C5. Regarding the power output, here's a little excerpt from it:
 

  But the considerable difference was in the power output.
 
On this song and others while turning up the volume, the C5 seemed capable of playing the bass about 50 percent louder before amp clipping began. If you do the math, 50% louder = 1.5 times louder, and 1.5 squared = 2.25 times the power. 10 log 2.25 = 3.5 dB of gain.
 
Now, in the specifications, Cayin claims that the C5 amp has "800mW + 800mW" (or 1600mW) of power at 32 ohms, but after doing my own comparison with the E12A, I think this spec is false. My guess is that 450mW + 450 mW (or 900mW total) at 32 ohms is probably closer to the actual output of the C5.
 
So either Cayin is overrating the power spec on the C5, or FiiO is underrating the power on the E12A, or both. But I think it's much more of the former than the latter.

 
In other words, the E12A is rated at 400mW, so if the Cayin C5 has 2.25 times that amount, then that comes to 900mW for the C5. Check out that link!

 

[ceemsc]

...

The way I listen (with "double amping") makes no audible difference in the sound quality for me, nor does it affect the power output of the Cayin C5.

...

Nothing wrong with that; people do it all the time whenever they hook their rig up to other equipment. Even line-outs use a non-adjustable amp of some sort to boost the audio from the DAC to an audible level for the power amp to work with.

You just have to test & make sure your gain levels don't introduce clipping & that there is no channel imbalance up the audio chain.