[Ikon]

I'm currently auditioning several headphones to choose a partner for my HD580 from. I've successfully ruled out the DT880 (not enough treble resolution for my taste, also a little harsh) and have now arrived at the mighty HD650. Now that is one strange phone. The first impression was: tons of bass + no treble. After some burn-in, the treble has cleared up quite a bit, though it is certainly not as open as the HD580s' (looks like the HD650 has a warmer character). But there is still the bass. With many songs, it is just "very present" but at least it ... behaves itself. But beware if a song goes to low, then something really ugly happens. The bass gets overpowering, swallowing up everything else, even forcing me to turn down the volume. Not only is it overpowering in that region, it is also sloppy and ... uncontrolled. The HD580 has a much less dominant/present bass - it never gets in the way as the HD650's. The HD580's bass really shows itself in exactly the same places where the HD650's gets ugly, but there it sounds deep and TIGHT and still not overpowering (which is funny as the HD580 are often accused of not having real bass).

The HD650 actually manages to sound fatiguing through its constant bass assault, something I have never heard before in headphone land. The only way I knew listening fatigue until now was through too harsh highs or a too small soundstage (-> "in the face" sound).

I'm convinced that the HD650 overall detail level is on par or even a bit above the HD580, but I simply cannot listen to it! To experience all the treble and midrange detail, I would have to turn up the volume to a level where the bass has my eardrums bleeding. It's like trying to enjoy an opera with FAT ALBERT running in circles between me and the stage, yelling "hey, hey hey" all the time!!

Re-reading this post after typing it, makes me think it sounds like a rant. It was not intended that way, I just wanted to express my impressions about the HD650's bass. But I guess, subconciously, I'm a bit dissapointed of Sennheiser for releasing such an unbalanced and "popular sounding" phone as its top of the line model.

It seems that I like the HD580 (plus a little equalization, perhaps) more than the HD650 - who would have thought that

The HD650 are loveable - but mine are most likely going back. Tomorrow, the K501 should arrive and I'm thrilled how they'll sound.

 

[socrates63]

I found myself using my HD600 more than my HD650 because I found the HD650's bass too boomy (is that a word?). But when I rolled in Amperex tubes into my Woo3 and took out Siemens tubes, the bass tightens considerably. I did a double take to make sure I had the HD650 plugged in and not the HD600. The change was that dramatic.

It seems the HD650's sound depends a lot on the other parts of the audio setup. I'm very happy with them now.

 

[NotJeffBuckley]

As a happy HD650 owner, I would like to say...



trust your ears. If you don't like how they sound, don't feel as though you're downgrading by going with something you prefer. If the HD580 are better for you, they are better for you, end of story.

 

[Kirosia]

I found the bass to be a bit overpowering as well. It was masking detail and it's been bothering for awhile. (perhaps this is the veil?)

 

[Patu]

The bass was quite overpowering and even boomy with my old equipment but then came Rudistor and it was all gone. I'm really wondering is there an amp performing better with 650s than RP5.1. The amount of musicality and resolution it added is just amazing.

Of course cable upgrade helped also but not so much with the bass. It affected mostly to highs which came clearer and it very effectively removed this so called Sennheiser veil.

So as said million times before, 650s really have much potential in them. What's sad is that it's not always so easy to reveal.

 

[LFF]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kirosia I found the bass to be a bit overpowering as well. It was masking detail and it's been bothering for awhile. (perhaps this is the veil?)

I agree. I found the bass to be killer MUCH MUCH better than the Grado PS-1 but the downfall was that the 650's were a bit fatiguing. I then traded my 650's for some woodied HF-1's and I couldn't be more happier. The best Senn in my opinion (exluding the big O and baby O) is the 600. I love my 600's for classical.

 

[Jon L]

Quote:

Originally Posted by socrates63 I found myself using my HD600 more than my HD650 because I found the HD650's bass too boomy (is that a word?). But when I rolled in Amperex tubes into my Woo3 and took out Siemens tubes, the bass tightens considerably. I did a double take to make sure I had the HD650 plugged in and not the HD600. The change was that dramatic. It seems the HD650's sound depends a lot on the other parts of the audio setup. I'm very happy with them now.

Wow, I have never, ever seen any Amperex tube have "tighter" bass than Siemens. Amperex (6922, Ecc82, etc) tends to have round, bloomy bass, which is pleasant with lots of bass volume impact, but various Siemens tubes (ecc82, 5814, etc) definitely have more neutral, controlled, extended bass IME. Perhaps it's the OTL circuit in particular?

 

[JaZZ]

I suppose your HD 650 isn't broken in yet. A dominant bass is normal for a new HD 650, although I'm surprised that it's so dramatic. Anyway, wait a few days until it's passably settled down. And try to stretch the headband a bit; a new headband makes for a very tight grip, resulting in an overly dark and bassy characteristic. Just simulate a looser headband by slightly pulling the earpieces away from your ears. It makes a considerable difference. Finally there could be some mismatch with your amp(s), although the HD 580 should be similarly concerned, then. But just to give you a hint: my HD 650 sounds in no way bassier than my HD 600. Otherwise it would be too much for me as well.

I'm suprised that you find the DT 880's treble lacking resolution; this contradicts my own experience. Of the mentioned harshness there was only a hint and just the first few hours. After about 100 hours the treble was very clear and smooth, with a resolution (at least almost) comparable to the HD 650, just more of it, and definitely higher than the HD 580's or 600's. Strange indeed.
.

 

[Patrickhat2001]

My experience is much the same as yours--HD650 too much bass (and too warm), HD600 just about perfect. Just personal taste really.

 

[cheechoz]

I had an HD650, HD600, and I am getting another HD650, probably tomorrow. I never found the bass to be so overwhelming, that I couldn't enjoy the rest of the music. The HD650 needs a heavy dose of break-in, at least 200 hours, if not more!

Give it more time to break-in. Also, try to test out some aftermarket cables. I really like the Equinox cable for my Senns. A brighter cable like the Silver Dragon, or the Zu Mobius, might bring the highs more into focus, taking the emphasis off of the lows!

You can also defoam them, by removing the piece of foam under the pad!

 

[aaroncort]

I'm suprised that you are finding the bass overwhelming as well. There are times when I wish there was a just a wee little bit more that they already have.

 

[Zorander]

If there is anyway to properly tone down the fat bass, the HD-650 would be the perfect can for me. I understand very well when you mentioned overpowering bass, esp. with 'cooked-up' recordings.

There was something I recently noticed though. I was always using the Silver Dragon cable with the HD-650 (never the stock). When I switched to the stock cable, resolution and extension went down by a notch but the bass has now become much much more controlled (not over-dominant). Were you using an aftermarket cable with the phones? If so, you might want to test it with the stock cable and hopefully get to the same finding as me.

Cheers!

 

[NotJeffBuckley]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zorander If there is anyway to properly tone down the fat bass, the HD-650 would be the perfect can for me. I understand very well when you mentioned overpowering bass, esp. with 'cooked-up' recordings. There was something I recently noticed though. I was always using the Silver Dragon cable with the HD-650 (never the stock). When I switched to the stock cable, resolution and extension went down by a notch but the bass has now become much much more controlled (not over-dominant). Were you using an aftermarket cable with the phones? If so, you might want to test it with the stock cable and hopefully get to the same finding as me. Cheers!

The HD580/600 is a good way to tone down the bass while still keeping a very, very similar mid/treble presentation.

 

[fewtch]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ikon The HD650 are loveable - but mine are most likely going back. Tomorrow, the K501 should arrive and I'm thrilled how they'll sound.

My good friend, ready yourself... you are about to have the DIAMETRIC OPPOSITE experience tomorrow with the K501!

Quote:

Originally Posted by JaZZ I'm suprised that you find the DT 880's treble lacking resolution; this contradicts my own experience.

Ditto. Starting to wonder what kind of music Ikon is listening to (unfortunately, his musical preferences aren't listed in his profile).

 

[euclid]

sorry to be "that guy" but hd-650 need a powerfull amp to keep the bass under control and maintain instrument seperation. no complaints here either, so far for me the weeknesses have been upstream related. (and foam related too)