[riverlethe]

Not sure if Annie have a different sensitivity compare to K712Pro but I can drive my Annie with my iPad2 with just 50%~ of the max volume...

Bear in mind that newer recordings can be two to four times as loud as older ones.

 

[BillsonChang007]

Bear in mind that newer recordings can be two to four times as loud as older ones.

Don't really have old records, but I do have albums released in the year 2000. Indeed they are much softer in volume than records these days but I still find my iPad capable of driving Annie to decent volume 

 

[devhen]

Bear in mind that newer recordings can be two to four times as loud as older ones.

 
This. I just maxed out my G109 amp at 100% volume on a very quietly recorded track and it still wasn't enough for my tastes. And the G109 is a powerful amp. This was with my GMP 400, not the K712, but the K712 only requires a little less amping. How people can assume that a certain amp or setup is "enough" in terms of volume without knowing what levels the music being listened to is recorded at is beyond me. I can go from literally ear-splitting levels to "not loud enough" without touching the volume dial, by simply changing tracks.

 

[JWahl]

Sure, I don't need measurements or careful AB'ing to tell me that the K712 sounds different from the HD650's. However, the measurements do explain the differences I perceive. On the other hand, I couldn't hear much if any difference between a $300 off the shelf receiver and a $1200 DAC/amp, even though the $1200 unit measured better (unless I plugged in my IEM's and cranked the volume with no sound playing. Then the receiver had an audible hiss...).

 
Consider yourself lucky then haha.  I don't think that price necessarily correlates directly with sound quality that often.  I once used a cheaper 100wpc receiver I got from a garage sale for $20 to drive an HE-6 using an Audio-GD SA-1 DAC (PCM 1704 based) and it sounded great.  I'm not particularly wealthy and can't just go out and buy the most expensive stuff.  And even the amp and DAC I use now were both bought well used.  Paid $1150 for the S7 and $600 for the Anedio vs. $1800+ and $1250 new respectively.
 
And at times I've had to scrap my whole setup and start over for finanacial reasons.  Hence why I'm using the K712 right now instead of HD800.  But I do plan to upgrade again in the future.  On the bright side, it's given me experience with different gear and getting a better idea of what I like each time.
 
Perhaps we should start a thread in sound science to discuss theoretical headphone metrics.  Could be an interesting discussion.
 

Bear in mind that newer recordings can be two to four times as loud as older ones.

 
Totally agree.  Especially with higher res recordings.  I'm certain this is due to differences in dynamic range.  A lot of newer recordings are heavily dynamically compressed.  With some high dynamic range recordings, and using the TbIsone plugin with about 6-8db of headroom, I can max out the S7 and still not have enough gain, even though it will normally blow your ears out with the K712.
 

Not sure if Annie have a different sensitivity compare to K712Pro but I can drive my Annie with my iPad2 with just 50%~ of the max volume...

 
I did notice my new iPhone 5S drives the K712 reasonably loud but my old Galaxy S4 couldn't. Obviously not nearly the overall quality though.  And not much headroom available.

 

[Claritas]

A quick question for anyone who knows: what size is the K712 driver? 45mm like K702 or something larger?
 
I'm sure it's been commented on, but it's easy to get lost in this thread. Thanks much.

 

[roguegeek]

  A quick question for anyone who knows: what size is the K712 driver? 45mm like K702 or something larger?
 
I'm sure it's been commented on, but it's easy to get lost in this thread. Thanks much.

Same size as all the drivers have been since the K701. 45mm.

 

[Claritas]

Same size as all the drivers have been since the K701. 45mm.

Do we know if it's a new driver or a retuned version of the old one?

 

[roguegeek]

Do we know if it's a new driver or a retuned version of the old one?

This one is a debated topic here with no real answer. Some people think there's a difference in the signature between the K702 65th AE and K712 which leads to the conversation that the driver must be new or revised. In my opinion, I heard no discernible difference between the K702.65 and the K712 when I tested them side by side. I believe they are the exact same cans with purely cosmetic differences.
 
I'm going to throw an email over to AKG support tomorrow to see what they say about this. They've answered this question before for me when it came to the Q701 and K702.65 driver differences.

 

[Claritas]

This one is a debated topic here with no real answer. Some people think there's a difference in the signature between the K702 65th AE and K712 which leads to the conversation that the driver must be new or revised. In my opinion, I heard no discernible difference between the K702.65 and the K712 when I tested them side by side. I believe they are the exact same cans with purely cosmetic differences.

I'm going to throw an email over to AKG support tomorrow to see what they say about this. They've answered this question before for me when it came to the Q701 and K702.65 driver differences.

Thanks. Much appreciated.

I should think there'd be some sonic difference considering the measurements. (I haven't yet heard K712, only the other four variants.)

What got me wondering is the similarity of the K712 and K812 charts. That's why I asked about the driver size. I'm wondering if K712 was a sort of test run for what they wanted to achieve with K812.

 

[BillsonChang007]

IMO, driver size doesn't matter

 

[elwappo99]

IMO, driver size doesn't matter

 
it's the motion of the diaphragm?

 

[Zalgorithm]

   
it's the motion of the diaphragm?

 
Oh I like your magentic flux....

 

[roguegeek]

You guys are cracking me up. 

 
Quote:

IMO, driver size doesn't matter

Yup. I would agree.

 

[macbob713]

Great review on the 712 Pro in the new issue of Sound&Vision magazine by Steve Guttenberg.He states in the article that the driver was reworked to produce more bass. Awarded S&V Top Pick Award.

 

[oddsocks]

Just got my pair today. Compared to my 7 bump K701s, I can definitely agree with the more lower end opinions. I'll have to give it a few more days, but from what I'm hearing now, I do feel they've improved on the K701s finally after all these years.