[akira281]

Don´t get caught up on the specs too much, folks. I have all AK3XX Daps, and while the specs of both AK320 & AK380 aren´t that different, in terms of SQ the AK380 is a completely different animal. That being said, I like all of my AK3XX Daps. In fact, the AK300 was my first love....

While I would agree with you that sound is most important, knowing what bit rates a DAP plays or doesn't isn't unimportant. Otherwise we all still might be listening to 16/44 files. And obviously A&K thinks they are important because they list them on their websites, albeit conflicting. Spec knowledge can help to make purchase decisions (e.g. Will it be future proof? What kind of files can I play? If a DAP won't play 32/382 files natively does it make any sense to pay extra for them?).

Which brings me to Astell&Kern. Had they been more transparent and forthcoming (my question was also sent to them without an answer) I would not need to ask the question here. Nor has their rep addressed my question on the "line out" setting. This isn't leaving a good impression about the company, so far. Why all the mystery?

 

[fotomeow]

Agree that having all that info on files is useful for the most part. e.g. for me, 24/192 is plenty of resolution.
So 32/384 doesn't interest me, in fact I dont like 32/384,
it is too smoothed out IMO and takes the punch and swing out of the music.

So I agree that conumers should have access to this info, but for different reasons.
But my reasons for wanting to know if it is 32/384 would be to avoid it, not go for it.

[FYI: i went on an effin' rant about corporations ..... sorry about that, that is not what this forum is for ... So I erased it.]

 

[seedubchris]

"A different animal completely" Really? That stands in stark contrast to all of my research on the differences between the players. Maybe if you are listening to a lot of DSD files... In almost all cases members found that the differences in SQ were " Marginal" . Speaking of stats, they are identical between the 3 series players as it pertains to amp performance. I would like to add a third reason to know what the DAP is doing with the sample rates and that has to do with professional applications where rendering 32 bit files for mix review is easily done as that is the working float point for most Pro Tools session files. At the end of the day if I knew what the player was actually going to play back I could decide if the extra size of 32bit file is worth the extra size or just to down sample from the DAW and save space. As it stands I'm just guessing and potentially rendering files for my review that will under go a down sampling which can add artifact and phase smear. If I knew the answer I would know what specs to render for.

 

[seedubchris]

So far so good with the recorder. It recorded hi res for 2 hours powering a matched pair of AKG 414's at a gig I played this last weekend. Sound quality was very good. It's using the same a/d dac as the d/a. Very impressive dacs compared to the saber in my Grace 920 and the Cirrus Logics in the ak240. Very clean and revealing which suits my needs. They don't sound radically different than the Saber sound but just that much more clean to my ears. I'm waiting for a 256 gig sandisc card to delve into the DSD recording as the player can't seem to accurately estimate the available recording time available to the machine. It always says there is far less available that there is actual gigs left in storage. My plan is to load my music on the micro card and save the internal space for recording as there is still a question of what speeds the card will need to write DSDx2 or DSD 256. My calculations show that DSD 256 writes at around 10 GIG's an hour so I'm sure the internal storage is up to writing at DSD requirements regardless of the write speeds of the sandisc card. I'll keep ya'll posted as I try ever more resolution with the recorder.

 

[haiku]

"A different animal completely" Really? That stands in stark contrast to all of my research on the differences between the players.

Yes, really. I can also enjoy the AK320, though. More than my SP1000Cu, which I put back into it´s box, til hopefully some future update will change the sound quality to my satisfaction.

 

[fotomeow]

Now back to the cool gadgets:

I'm not a musician, but the c414s look impressive, great that it is recording well. With such quality mics, seems logical that good sound would be had.
But I think the real test will be using crappy mics. They will expose the weaknesses of the AK's recording capabilities much more than a higher quality mic, I would think.

Yes, the AKM 4490 is pretty impressive with the right electronics. I say that b/c before I bought the 320, i tested the KANN which has a solo 4490, but there is a faux-static distortion added or filtered in or something that seems like they try to give the music a "live" sound or recording. I have been to the AKM website or read a review online talking about the audio gear using the 4490. I dont recall most of the names but was an impressive list. The 320 has a much cleaner sound than the KANN. I just wish they had included the BLUE NOTE Special Edition with the 320 in addition to the 240. the 240 Blue Note Edition was MSRP $6k, which is bullocks of course, but now it is on sale for $1500 with like a 100 classic jazz h-res albums from the Blue Note label.

I-fi is also using the 4490 in their DACs now ,but not sure if they are paired up as twins like the 320.

 

[seedubchris]

Just did a recording with Mohavi MA101fet matched pair mics which sounded great . No where near the quality of the 414uls TL2's. Recorded to the sandisc ultra 256 in dsd 2.6 with no problems. I was using the Tascam dsd editor software to convert the dsd to pcm when my mac book suddenly died. If its not one thing its another. Hating mac . New for me.

 

[akira281]

I doubt it will be possible to ever really know what its doing as it will list the file sample rate and word length but may be downsampling internally...

Ah, but then how do we know it even outputs any rate higher than 16/44?

In any event I just received my AK320. The box lists the res as 24/192 instead of the AK website's advertised 32/384. Unless they reply to my earlier request for clarification they will probably loose a sale. Oh well, I just hope they won't be unresponsive to my refund request also.

 

[fotomeow]

The Mohave mics are FET powered, but I didnt see any similar specs on the AKG c414 website. Any idea?
If they sound better than the Mohave, what is that mainly due to?

 

[seedubchris]

The 414's are German made with premium parts like ck12 capsules . Tons of r and d as well as being one of the most sought after brands of microphones in the pro studio world right below other post ww2 third riche mic companies like Neuman and Telefunken. Mohavi is a USA company started by ribbon mic designer David Royer. Great company making mikes designed in USA and built with Chinese parts . Surprisingly good sounding mikes considering their price point.
I used the ak recorder today during a mix session by recording the output of the 1/2 inch Sony to dsd . Wow! It really sounded amazing . I thought I would like it but there really is something to the dsd thing compared to pcm. My intention is to pitch the final mix captured from the console through the tape machine to dsd directly through the mastering chain. Skipping a redundant conversion in the process . A lot of pros use this method taking advantage of the infinite resolution of tape straight to dsd cranked up instead of going directly back to pro tools. . I think it is going to be a another upgrade in my work flow .

 

[fotomeow]

"Ah, but then how do we know it even outputs any rate higher than 16/44?
In any event I just received my AK320. The box lists the res as 24/192 instead of the AK website's advertised 32/384. Unless they reply to my earlier request for clarification they will probably loose a sale. Oh well, I just hope they won't be unresponsive to my refund request also."


Well, we all have our breaking points. Personally, Im tired of owning a digital source for a year,
then selling and buying again, and my reason for buying the 320 was b/c it is advanced and I think I can hang with it for 2-3 years.
I'm so tired of having to learn and relearn different digital systems with diff Apps, transfers, only to be dissatisfied and start the cycle
all over again.

Best of luck, let us know what you replace it with.

 

[fotomeow]

thanks for the info. yes, zee Jermans! great engineering.

Above, you said, "I thought I would like it but there really is something to the dsd thing compared to pcm."
Did you mean to say "I thought I would NOT like it, but .....". Not quite sure I am understanding.

Awesome that the recording sounds so good from 1/2 to DSD, would hope so. Not sure what is meant by
"skipping a redundant conversion in the process". I am assuming the sound went from analog to digital console
to analog 1/2" tape back to DSD. That is 4 conversions. what am I missing?

A few years back I went to the CA Audio Show, the English gent, the owner of Music First non-gain preAmps,
had recorded a Jackson 5 CD onto a 1/4 or 1/2" tape, then played that into the Music First PreAmp,
then into a Class D S300 Bel Canto amp into a pair of old Rogers L3S5 speakers. Actually sounded incredible.

I asked him why he bothered to do this set up with the tape machine and all, he said, "human beings just like things that spin in a circle".
Damn, he's right.

I'm going to PM you with a couple questions about recording, offline since it is not directly AK-related

 

[seedubchris]

He forgot to mention that tape smooths out digital especially the highs . Cymbals sound substantially better and there is usually another octave to be had from the bass as well . This is why people still record at 15ips instead of 30.

 

[seedubchris]

It sounds awesome . No complaints with the recorder. I wish the ak320 has a dedicated line out to connect to my alo cdm and not just the headphone out cranked to max 150. I think that feature is misleading in the adds.
I talked to alo and they said the best way to connect the cdm is using the mini USB out of the 320 to the mini USB input . Does anyone know if the ak320 supports audio out of that port! I read it was for data transfer or to use the ask as a dac with a computer, not the other way as transport with audio out to external dac down stream. Anyone know where to get the right cabling (mini USB to mini USB) . There are adaptors but these look cheap . Thanks

 

[fotomeow]

Chris,
ALÓ is either out of their gourd or misunderstood your question. I’m hoping the latter. The only USB I have ever heard of is for digital transfer not analog.

The CDM does not have a DAC, which would be the only use for running the AK320 into the CDM with a USB.

BTW, I use the headphone out the AK all the time using the Line Out function. I had my doubts, But I’ve had nothing but great results. I thought I would hear some distortion, so if there is some, it’s pretty minimal IMO.

Are you not impressed with the line out function? Have you heard sonic degradation with it?