[Sweet Spot]

I was at the supreme court today in downtown Manhattan because I have to serve freekin Jury DOODY, so I thought I'd stop into J&R to see if they got the Karma yet. No dice, but said perhaps today, tomorrow, or next week. There are 3000 on order so they're a commin' ! In the process of looking, I saw these 2 older people looking at the iPod and the Zen. I decided to butt in and give them my 2 cents about both..or as much as I know about them respectively. They were buying one for their 16 year old grandson as a birthday gift (lucky sob ) and they wanted to know which was the better deal. To make a long story short, they were finally convinced that for $227, the Zen was a hell of a better deal because of the amount of storage, the remote with FM capabilities/recording etc...

I felt sort of bad for the salesman, because he was just standing there like "duh, I should have said that" becuase it looked as if they were going to shun both of them and go for some small junky mp3 player.... Basically what I'm sayin' is...I got SKILLZ YO ! I should've made that damned commission

Oh, and that kid may make an appearance here...I gave his grandparents this web address in case he needed audio assistance etc.... So be on the lookout.

P.S. Ya know, I really could have sold the iPod too, but I just didn't feel like it.

 

[strohmie]

Nice. Though, did you mention to the couple that the remote would cost an extra $70? (or was that somehow included in that very nice price?)

There still isn't much debate for me as to whether the Zen or iPod is a better deal. Size really doesn't matter that much.

 

[lan]

Everytime I'm at J&R, I always give people advice.

 

[blessingx]

Same deal with Fry's on this side of the country. The V6's and Triports are stacked right next to each other!

 

[bangraman]

I'd probably curse you with all my breath. The kid was probably praying for an iPod.

 

[Sweet Spot]

Quote:

I'd probably curse you with all my breath. The kid was probably praying for an iPod.

LOFL ! Yes, I know. I did think about that. However, I also wanted to give the kid more credit. I truely wanted to believe that he was the sort of kid that didn't follow all his stupid friends' advice on such matters, ergo "ooh, but it's so shiney and pretty..oh and the lights...the lights...duh".

Yes, they do know that the remote is $70 extra, but they also now know that he'll be able to keep that thing in his shirt pocket (i easily fit it in my scrubs pocket, (and scrub tops don't have very big pockets) and they now also know that he'll have a radio, and a way to record things...and that he's getting more storage space, and outstanding audio quality bla bla blazidee bla...

He will appreciate it in the future. Anyway damn it...it was a free freekin' thing ! If he's pissed that it's not an iPod, then let em' get a job & buy one

 

[bangraman]

I was only half joking. Although I returned the iPod, I did buy it, not the Zen. I could have bought the Zen after, but I didn't. I even went to try it out again. And for a guy who buys stuff at the drop of a hat, that probably means there's something I really didn't like about it. Tell the truth, if I did it again and I was happy to use some of the volume ramping programs available now to circumvent the Euro volume limit, I'd still buy the iPod. That's despite the EQ that doesn't work properly, the relatively short battery life and sound quality that my NZ90 can trump. There's no joy to be had holding a Zen. Holding an iPod is despite the annoyances all joy.

 

[blessingx]

Quote:

Originally posted by Sweet Spot LOFL ! Yes, I know. I did think about that. However, I also wanted to give the kid more credit. I truely wanted to believe that he was the sort of kid that didn't follow all his stupid friends' advice on such matters, ergo "ooh, but it's so shiney and pretty..oh and the lights...the lights...duh".

Hey Sweet Spot, I bring up the Zen and NJB with people also and am surprised more Windows users don't go that route. I believe the Zen is probably the best for most, out of these three (considering size, price, likely to record, OS, etc.), but as an owner of both companies products, there are reasons besides the shine that some people would prefer the iPod. Giving credit where credit is due (to the kid or not). Proud ex-NJB, iPod user.

 

[Sweet Spot]

Quote:

there are reasons besides the shine that some people would prefer the iPod.

I'd love to hear those reasons, no sarcasim intended. From what I've seen and heard, the only apparent thing that the iPod has the Zen beat on, is the size and overall look. The Zen offers more useful features, lager capacity at a cheaper price (even after buying the remote) good power output, and from what I listened to, a great sound ta boot.

I have also listened to the iPod, and thought its sound was really nice ...but through Porta Pros. Through my PX 200's was another story. The Zen sounded fuller/richer than the iPod TO ME. I wouldn't say it was a night and day difference, but my preference would be towards the Zen. As a matter of fact, I really considered buying it today, but then thought I'd better wait for the Karma

So truely, tell me what it is about the iPod that would make one want one over the Zen. The firewire ? The software ? Even if I had a hole burning my pocket, I dont' think I'd get one even then because of one thing...The remote. Even though the iPod is smaller than the Zen, at its current size, taking it out of your pocket/whatever, everytime you want to check something, is a pain in the ass...especially with the risk of either
A)dropping it
B)having someone snatch it

That's why I won't be too concerned with the Karma. It's size will allow me to clip it onto my person somewhere whilst looking at the LCD in order to fotz around with the buttons. Even more of a reason to like the Zen with its remote control. It says safely in the shirt/bag while the remote does all the work.

Obviously nothing against Apple, but why wouldn't they just make an LCD remote ?

 

[lan]

he's young, he wants to be cool, he probably wants to impress the ladies. iPod = winner

oh one more thing, it wasn't his $. it's always different when it's not your $. i have no prob with more bang and features of the buck with the zen but i just don't use those.

we need to have a portable mini meet or something and have the same songs on there.

 

[blessingx]

Quote:

Originally posted by Sweet Spot I'd love to hear those reasons, no sarcasim intended.

Was it you that I had the whole remote conversation a month ago with? If so, once again, I find remotes unnecessary (on my old MD, NJB or iPod). In fact I wish there wasn't a cord running from the player to the headphones. That would be ideal. Different strokes for different folks, but certainly that's not a deal breaker for all people.

And as I mentioned I often recommended the Zen, but the NJB has the most features (out of these three) if that's all we're going for. If you're willing to give up some things to do other things better (like size in that case), here are reasons person X may like the iPod better (or more importantly the iPod be better for them)...

Size
Weight
Much Better Build
Yeah looks
Much better GUI
Firewire
SmartPlaylists
OS compatibility (Windows, Mac, Linux)
Likely higher resale value
Better drivers (Creative didn't get their rep for nothing)
Much better software (especially when iTunes for Windows is released)
AAC support
Audible (.aa) support
Much better third party hardware support (iTrip, iFM, battery power pack, 3000 cases, etc.)
Replaceable battery (unlike Zen)
PDA (Calendar/Contacts)
Game
Load your OS/programs on it and use the iPod as a boot drive on another computer (maybe this is possible with Zen, I just haven't heard of it)
You get a free Volkswagon (oh that's the other way around)

I'm sure there's a bunch of things I can't think of at the moment. Again there's a list why the Zen (or NJB) would be better for others. Just depends.

 

[lan]

Best Buy has the Rio Nitrus in stock. I'm tempted BUT I'm waiting for the Eigen. It's a few bucks more and supposed to be aluminum. Only thing is there are no pics of the Eigen around so I don't know if it's just an aluminum Nitrus. It's supposed to have more features though. Maybe the Karma may appear there also.

 

[austonia]

Quote:

Originally posted by bangraman Tell the truth, if I did it again and I was happy to use some of the volume ramping programs available now to circumvent the Euro volume limit, I'd still buy the iPod. That's despite the EQ that doesn't work properly, the relatively short battery life and sound quality that my NZ90 can trump. There's no joy to be had holding a Zen. Holding an iPod is despite the annoyances all joy.

"despite the fact it has so many problems, I love how shiney it is!"

well, someone's gotta keep Apple in business. lol

 

[bangraman]

It's also probably because I'm an industrial designer. (Although whoever designed the remote was probably on work placement)


And probably because I'm shallow. But then ultimately so are 99% of other people on this planet.


Actually it's not because it's shiny but the way it feels to use. It's because it does everything really nicely. Slightly indescribeable. Let's call it "Le Je Ne Sais Quoi". I didn't get it from the Zen, the NZ90, iRivers and MT888 although all were solid products. I did get it a little on the MZ-E10, yet another slightly flawed product. Since I had the two for a while, I did gauge the LJNSQ, and found the iPod to have a considerably higher LJNSQ than the E10.


I'm still tempted to get a US model and hope Apple fixes the various other issues, but I think I'll wait for the Karma and see what that's like.

 

[Sweet Spot]

Blessingx, yeah...it was definetely me you had the remote discussion with, and I think that I concurred with you. However, I did for one reason. I pondered that if a player was small enough, (ala Rio Karma ) then a remote would just be a cumbersome object and redundant. But I think that I justly stated my case for having one with a larger unit with the examples I provided. (Dropping unit when taking out of pocket; having it snatched...these arent' bad reasons, they're logical reasons")

At that juncture, who'se to say that the lad wouldn't be thrilled with a player that had a remote opposed to one that didn't ? As for the reasons, it really looks like you were reaching high there man !

The list starts showing redundancy points in my eyes.

Size (Ok, I already said that..no problem)

Weight (well duh, it's smaller

)

Much Better Build (try dropping both from a nice height.....either way, HD soup buddy!)

Yeah looks
Much better GUI (IYO. Others may think otherwise)

Firewire (which one may need to buy extra hardware for)

SmartPlaylists (ok. no prob. But are you saying that the zen offers no playlist feature?)

OS compatibility (Windows, Mac, Linux)(don't know about the zens compatibility list so ok.)

Likely higher resale value (dude, that is soooo reaching..and that's only on account of its prices never dropping anyway. )

Better drivers (Creative didn't get their rep for nothing)
(Well ****. Ya got me there..can't argue with that one..hell my 6 year old brother could write better driver code than those Creative Monkeys !)

Much better software (especially when iTunes for Windows is released) (couldn't say, but I've heard that some of the 3rd party software for the Zen is just great, so I can't accept that one)

AAC support (proprietary codec..another free codec killer..lots of hype..sorry doesn't really spell winner in my book, and I can't be the only one thinking this)

Audible (.aa) support (I'm pretty sure the Zen has this now..at least on the new one, and if so, then I'm sure with a firmware update, the regular Zen will have it too)

Much better third party hardware support (iTrip, iFM, battery power pack, 3000 cases, etc.) (Funny funny funny....iTrip is a program to be used with iFM which looks like a mongaloid abortion ! You of all people like this monstrosity ?! Come on man, what happened to your remote control argument...a bit hippocritical don't you think ? And personally, even though I don't mind remotes, that iFM is the ugliest, most obtrusive POS peripheral I"ve ever seen ! Battery pack..HA HA ! Look at the reason YOU NEED a battery pack for..nuf' said on that. 3000 cases...Well, now who could argue with that ? Yes, having 3000 cases to choose from is definetely what would make me i/switch ! lol Damned Zen and it's measaly 1000 cases !

Replaceable battery (unlike Zen) Now, has this been confirmed ? Since the Zens backside is easily removeable, enabling the owner/tech geek to swap out the HD (gee...can you do that on the iPod ? hrmm..), I see no reason as to why one couldn't change the battery while there..correct me if I'm wrong.)

PDA (Calendar/Contacts) Yes, I can certainly see the justification in running down my already short iPod battery life by using a feature which is best suited for a dedicated PDA

Game. (Um..see above, battery life. I don't think that zoning out on a grey scale lcd tetris game is worth not having music when I get stuck somewhere...)

Load your OS/programs on it and use the iPod as a boot drive on another computer (maybe this is possible with Zen, I just haven't heard of it) This is by far the only useful(and very cool) thing I've heard about the iPod, but it still wouldn't make me buy it. Ever hear of an external HD ? Gawsh, you make this too easy.

You get a free Volkswagon (oh that's the other way around) (Bugs are the most gay looking cars. not that there's anything wrong with being gay of course. But um no thanks, you actually couldn't give me one for free !)
____________________________________
Hey Austonia, here's your guy, in a quote from Ian:

Quote:

he's young, he wants to be cool, he probably wants to impress the ladies. iPod = winner oh one more thing, it wasn't his $. it's always different when it's not your $. i have no prob with more bang and features of the buck with the zen but i just don't use those.

Ian, Ian. So freekin disapointing. If you were going to support the iPod, you should have gone the route that Blessingx did, but instead, you proved once again that aesthetics are more important to some people than functionality. I realize that you were being a bit sarcastic and all, but your true thoughts really shone through there. Being young doesn't mean having to be a retard...I have a young step brother who is a freekin genius and I'm sure he wouldn't fall into the category you so gracefully threw together for his demographic..
But I just love this one.. Quote:

i have no prob with more bang and features of the buck with the zen but i just don't use those

Just curious, when you whip out your iPod and flash the ladies with it, do they swarm around you and start groping at you ? Cuz if so, then perhaps..just perhaps, I'll think about getting one....