Stax "energisers" - a few questions, mostly valve-based.
Aug 18, 2008 at 6:37 PM Thread Starter Post #1 of 20

AudioPhewl

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Hi all.

Am looking at buying the Stax SRS-4040II package - SR404 earspeakers, and the SRM-006II energiser. But I'm unfamiliar with the "quirks" of valve gear, and have a few questions...

1. I use my headphones virtually every day, for several hours. My DAC, CDP and amplifier are left powered-up 24/7 and have been so for many years now. I can't do this with a valve amplifier, can I?
2. Tube life. How long can I expect the stock tubes to last? I don't expect any firm dates, but I'd love to know whether I'd be looking at swapping them out after 6 months or 6 years...
3. Replacement tube cost. Are they difficult to replace(I'm handy enough with mechanics and soldering). Do they simply "pop" into place, or is it a more detailed task? How much do replacement tubes cost?
4. Would I be better off buying the earspeakers by themselves, and using a DIY or aftermarket amplifier? Total package cost is ~£1000, or £600 more than the bare earspeakers. What would I be looking at buying in terms of aftermarket gear, at this price point?

Thanks for any advice, and apologies for all the questions.
smily_headphones1.gif


~Phewl.
 
Aug 18, 2008 at 7:42 PM Post #2 of 20
1: You can leave a valve amp on all day and I've run my Stax SRM-T1 (predecessor to the 006t) 24/7 for several months and there is a noticeable difference to the sound once the amp has reached thermal stability.

2: They will last for years and years but you should really replace the stock tubes with some nice NOS units, preferably made in Japan units often found on ebay.

3: The tubes cost around 15-30$ depending on what type they are and the amp has normal tube sockets so the tubes just plug in. You do need to rebias the amp after swapping out the tubes (instructions can be found here online) but it is very simple and you only need a voltmeter and a screwdriver.

4: The Woo Audio GES might fit into that price point but you might have to pay VAT on top of the price. I'm not really a fan of the 006t or the SR-404 for that matter so one of the older amps and headphones might be a better choice. If you haven't owned Stax before then the SRS-4040 system is very good but those of use that have owned close to everything they've ever made prefer the older models.
 
Aug 18, 2008 at 7:51 PM Post #3 of 20
Quote:

Originally Posted by spritzer /img/forum/go_quote.gif
...I'm not really a fan of the 006t or the SR-404 for that matter so one of the older amps and headphones might be a better choice. If you haven't owned Stax before then the SRS-4040 system is very good but those of use that have owned close to everything they've ever made prefer the older models.


So... for inquiring minds... the obvious question that follows... is... why?

I realize the answer is probably buried in reems of related posts... but... simply stated... why?

Don't all Stax phones suffer from weak bass, weak slam, and a bit lean sound... with the possible exception of the 007 MKII.

And... don't the older models suffer from some driver control issues, which produce some aberations in their sound at certain frequencies - just from what I've read.
 
Aug 18, 2008 at 8:13 PM Post #4 of 20
Quote:

Originally Posted by Gradofan2 /img/forum/go_quote.gif
Don't all Stax phones suffer from weak bass, weak slam, and a bit lean sound... with the possible exception of the 007 MKII.

And... don't the older models suffer from some driver control issues, which produce some aberations in their sound at certain frequencies - just from what I've read.



You are joking right? Such utter nonsense in two paragraphs...
 
Aug 18, 2008 at 8:26 PM Post #5 of 20
Quote:

Originally Posted by Gradofan2 /img/forum/go_quote.gif
Don't all Stax phones suffer from weak bass, weak slam, and a bit lean sound... with the possible exception of the 007 MKII.

And... don't the older models suffer from some driver control issues, which produce some aberations in their sound at certain frequencies - just from what I've read.



Don't believe everything you have read!
popcorn.gif
 
Aug 18, 2008 at 8:35 PM Post #6 of 20
Firstly, thanks to everyone who has replied so far.
smily_headphones1.gif


Quote:

Originally Posted by spritzer /img/forum/go_quote.gif
2: They will last for years and years but you should really replace the stock tubes with some nice NOS units, preferably made in Japan units often found on ebay.


What tubes in particular should I be looking for?

Quote:

3: The tubes cost around 15-30$ depending on what type they are and the amp has normal tube sockets so the tubes just plug in. You do need to rebias the amp after swapping out the tubes (instructions can be found here online) but it is very simple and you only need a voltmeter and a screwdriver.


Excellent. It sounds as simple as I was hoping it would be
smily_headphones1.gif
. Will read up on the bias adjustment... don't suppose you have any particularly good links handy?

Quote:

4: The Woo Audio GES might fit into that price point but you might have to pay VAT on top of the price. I'm not really a fan of the 006t or the SR-404 for that matter so one of the older amps and headphones might be a better choice. If you haven't owned Stax before then the SRS-4040 system is very good but those of use that have owned close to everything they've ever made prefer the older models.


Can I ask why you're not a fan of the 404 or the 006t? Would I be better off looking at the cheaper 303 and the solid-state "energisers"?

Am I looking at the wrong products? I'm off to test the system out later this week, and it'd be nice to know which components to avoid...

Thanks!

~Phewl.
 
Aug 18, 2008 at 9:02 PM Post #7 of 20
Quote:

Originally Posted by spritzer /img/forum/go_quote.gif
You are joking right? Such utter nonsense in two paragraphs...


Don't be a simple-minded "fan-boy" - explain why - present some facts... not just biased opinions.

Some of us would actually like to know the answers in simple summary presentation - without biased opinion.

If they're as good as you say... surely you can stand up to the challenge.

"Thou doth protest too much, methinks."
 
Aug 18, 2008 at 9:28 PM Post #8 of 20
Well where did you read this control issues thing? Links please. No quote is good without reference, otherwise what you said is your own experience, in which case we might as well call ******** on you based on majority's experience. Lastly - logical scientific argument says that proof is on you, positive statement 'there are problems' requires proof, not the opposite that says 'no, there are not'.
 
Aug 18, 2008 at 10:18 PM Post #9 of 20
Quote:

Originally Posted by AudioPhewl /img/forum/go_quote.gif
What tubes in particular should I be looking for?


1960's Toshiba are the best I've found but NEC are also very good. If you find some 6CG7's that are made in Japan odds are they will be a good match.

Quote:

Originally Posted by AudioPhewl /img/forum/go_quote.gif
Excellent. It sounds as simple as I was hoping it would be
smily_headphones1.gif
. Will read up on the bias adjustment... don't suppose you have any particularly good links handy?



Nope, sorry but there was a thread about it about a month or so ago.

Quote:

Originally Posted by AudioPhewl /img/forum/go_quote.gif
Can I ask why you're not a fan of the 404 or the 006t? Would I be better off looking at the cheaper 303 and the solid-state "energisers"?


The 303 is almost identical to the 404 with only a different cable. The upper midrange lift on the 404 simply kills them for me in comparison to the older Lambda Signature and the 006t is cold and lifeless in comparison to the T1. The 313 is a pretty bad amp, sterile and cold, but the newer 323 is quite a bit better and on par with the older SRM-1 amp. The best amp Stax has made recently is the 717 which is not to be confused with the mess that is the 727...

Quote:

Originally Posted by AudioPhewl /img/forum/go_quote.gif
Am I looking at the wrong products? I'm off to test the system out later this week, and it'd be nice to know which components to avoid...


The 4040 system is good, very good but the older amps/phones are better to my ears. This is through extensive direct comparison so without that you might not even notice these things. You certainly wouldn't be the first one.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gradofan2 /img/forum/go_quote.gif
Don't be a simple-minded "fan-boy" - explain why - present some facts... not just biased opinions.

Some of us would actually like to know the answers in simple summary presentation - without biased opinion.

If they're as good as you say... surely you can stand up to the challenge.

"Thou doth protest too much, methinks."



Calling me a fanboy just landed you on my ignore list. There are plenty of Stax products I don't like and I'm first in line to critic their newest products, besides you are simply spewing nonsense without any first hand knowledge.
 
Aug 18, 2008 at 10:31 PM Post #10 of 20
Quote:

Originally Posted by spritzer /img/forum/go_quote.gif
Calling me a fanboy just landed you on my ignore list. There are plenty of Stax products I don't like and I'm first in line to critic their newest products, besides you are simply spewing nonsense without any first hand knowledge.


Fine... it makes no difference to me.

If you can't rise to the challenge to defend your "opinions" with some simple summary factual observations - then they must be based more on emotion than reason - but... it would be good for you to just admit that.

And... I'm sure you both have read all the review comments about the various limitations and distortions of various Stax phones - they are numerous by both amateur and professional reviewers - I shouldn't have to repeat all the comments which I'm sure you've seen...

http://www.audioreview.com/cat/ampli...4_2719crx.aspx

http://www.onhifi.com/product/stax_srs4040.htm

http://www.head-fi.org/forums/f4/sta...60/index4.html

http://forums.naim-audio.com/eve/for...5/m/6562917707

http://www.onhifi.com/product/sennheiser_hd600.htm

http://www.amazon.com/gp/cdp/member-...stRecentReview

http://www.6moons.com/audioreviews/stax/stax_3.html

http://www.head-fi.org/forums/f13/re...ystem-ii-9211/

In addition to the many related comments in the various Stax theads on this forum.

Again... you're way too sensitive... to be objectively confident in your positions - any good proponent would never "blow up in an emotional huff" as you two have. They would simply, and calmly recite the facts and justify their positions, as virtually all others do.

Neither you, nor Stax, are above reproach.

"Thou doth protest too much, methinks."
 
Aug 18, 2008 at 10:54 PM Post #11 of 20
When you got nothing to say, you can go fight Gradofan...but people who know what's going on will walk away. If you choose to follow, you'll just get shot in the face and that will be the end of it. If you want to seriously challenge someone, when you make a statement - post proof of it. Either that or at least have reputation of knowing things and alot of experience with the equipment - not the reputation of being a 'fan'.
 
Aug 18, 2008 at 11:21 PM Post #12 of 20
To be fair to Gradofan, there are bass issues with most stats... bass on my Omega2 is awesome now, but was pretty weak until I got an aftermarket amp. The bass on my HE60 is virtually non-existant even with an aftermarket amp. Although these are the only two stats I've heard, common wisdom states that bass isn't usually the strong point of stats (I'm pretty sure the Omega2 is an exception to the rule).
 
Aug 19, 2008 at 12:12 AM Post #13 of 20
Bass on Stats actually works fine on quite a few models, the current Lambdas (202 / 303 / 404) have a different, very serious problem, which makes them sound sterile / anemic across the range. On the other hand - 001/003, 4070, and O2 don't suffer from having weak bass, HE90 also has a great bass response. Point is - this is not the issue of being electrostatic, dynamics can come with whacky bass too (and more often than not they do).

But ya - the current production amps from Stax don't work very well, especially for O2.

But that is moderately irrelevant - Gradofan is talking about older amps, which actually often work very well, and one particularly popular amp for e-stats on this forum is actually based around an old Stax amp ( ... not going to name the manufacturer to avoid summoning the heat ).
 
Aug 19, 2008 at 6:56 AM Post #14 of 20
i havent tried any of the current production stats, but the sr-sigma and jecklin float doesnt exactly lack any bass... unless you compare it to the boomy monster that is the dt770pro.

to gradofan; try not to enter a discussion in "attack mode"; do your fighting in the taxi queue on a saturday night, not on headfi
duggehsmile.png
 
Aug 19, 2008 at 2:26 PM Post #15 of 20
Gradofan2, please tell us which Stax 'phones you have heard and who suffer from these issues.
"weak bass", "weak slam", and "a bit lean sound"...

In my opinions neither the SR-007BL (never heard the SR-007 MK2 you refer to) or the 4070 have these issues.
You are of course fully entitled to have your own opinions, but please back up the statement. Especially when putting out such a strong statement as you did above.
 

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