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Sep 26, 2010 at 4:46 PM Post #242 of 5,004

Bilavideo

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Hey Bill,
 
In your opinion what is the biggest difference between th sr60 and sr60 I series. I have my eyes set on a of sr 60's in the FS section.


I don't know.  I've had SR60s and SR60i's and they're pretty much the same thing.  The "i" series may have more thump.  I seem to be encountering this "more thump" up and down the product line - from SR60i's to SR225i's to the SR325is.  It all sounds a bit like the HF2's relationship to the 325i and the RS1.  In terms of something you can see and hold in your hand, the SR60i has a slightly larger shell.  The old series - from the SR60 to the SR225 - patterns itself after the RS1.  They were plastic RS1s, which were wooden PS1s and HP1000s.  The new mold for the housing is the 325, with its tapered look, something the GS1000 and PS1000 imitated with their giant mushroom tops.  Now, everything wants to be a 325 - or better yet, a PS1000.  From the SR60 to the RS1, you're getting the little can version.  The GS1000 has the wooden version.  The PS1000 has the wood and aluminum hybrid.
 
None of this matters, of course.  Just buy the SR60 and then take it apart.  When you get this stuff stripped down to the drivers, it's pretty hard to tell one from the other.
 
Sep 26, 2010 at 5:43 PM Post #243 of 5,004

Bilavideo

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Hey, Bilavideo. Do you completely submerge the drivers in boiling water, or is it like halfway up? Also, how to you work the screwdriver? Is it a back and forth, or some other way? I also can't get it out with brute force. I'm thinking of going berserk and just cutting it out with a knife.
very_evil_smiley.gif
 Any help would be appreciated.
 
EDIT: I just realized that even if I got it out, then my problem wouldn't be solved. the plastic is still in the way. Does anyone have an extra sr60/80 driver they would be willing to part with?


I've got an extra.  
 
With respect to the disk removal, I have more pics if you want them.  This time, I tried to be more explicit about what's involved in popping the driver out.  Let me just do a little shout out to EbExchange.  Dude, we were successful in liberating your drivers!
 

 
Here's where we started.  You can see the silver cabling, the vented drivers and the adhesive felt covering the back of the magnet plate.
 

 
If you're going to get screwed, this is how you do it.  I"ve got a big flat-head screwdriver and a pair of smaller screwdrivers.  I've also got scissors and tape for my boo- boos.
 

 
The idea is to get the head into the space between the driver and the plastic cup and work things loose.  It's not going to just pop up.  I'm going to have to work the circle and do so with great patience.  Fortunately, I've got the McDonald's ketchup packets nearby, in case I need a condiment.
 

 
Right now, in addition to the full horror of my ghostly Scot-Irish/German hands (melanin not included), you can see me going Medieval on the outer wall of the cup.  
 

 
As I work my way around the circle - huffing, sweating and eye-balling those ketchup packet - I start thinking that maybe I should get the other screwdrivers in on the action.
 

 
One of the little screwdrivers jumps in with all the fury of Daniel Craig going over a guy who stole his car.
 

 
If one blond Bond is good, two are better.  In this situation, it's all about leverage as we press forward toward snap, crackle and pop.
 

 
It's you versus the disk.  You know if you get mad enough, and push hard enough, it's eventually going to be you, because you've come too far to go home empty-handed.  Even if you are home, you crazy HeadFier with ghostly white hands!
 

 
Success - almost!  The driver is free but the diaphragm has gotten a couple of wrinkles.
 

 
It looks pretty good but there are place in the diaphragm that don't look quite right.  I'll have to hit it with some more Nip/Tuck.
 

 
In the meantime, the other driver is coming along.  
 

 
Going around, working the circle, I get a beach head.

 
The goal here is to put leverage on the disk with as little contact as possible with the diaphragm.
 

 
This one came out better, though with a few bends that need to be straightened out.
 

 
Time for some Nip/Tuck.  You want to be Christian but here, you have to be Sean.
 

 
The right side looks 100% better but the left side needs more work.
 

 
When you use the tape, you want to be gentle but you need to also make sure you're making contact with the wrinkle.  Otherwise, you get this . . . 
 

 
Everything on this driver looks get except the upper left corner.  I need to hit it with the tape again.  This time, I'll be more careful.
 

 
Drum roll, please . . . 
 
 
 
 
 

 
Now, that's better!  
 
Sep 26, 2010 at 5:56 PM Post #244 of 5,004

BobSaysHi

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Success! 
 
Thank you so much Bilavideo. It suddenly dawned on me that I needed more leverage. So, after putting all my weight on the screwdriver, I heard a crack. You really do have to go Medieval on the driver otherwise you are wasting your time. 
evil_smiley.gif

 
Thank you so much, no more rattle. Now I just need some shells. 
o2smile.gif

 
I guess it never ends...
 
Sep 26, 2010 at 10:50 PM Post #245 of 5,004

tdockweiler

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Man, today was the best day ever. It went from absolutely terrible to GOOD.
 
I was messing with my favorite Koss Pro DJ 100 and tore it apart to experiment. The ultra tiny internal wires are so cheap that they fall apart easy.
Well I was experimenting to see if I could get some more bass from them. I poked some holes in specific areas and put them together and listened.
 
There was some MASSIVE bass. No I'm not exaggerating. Unfortunately it drowned out the mids majorly. Made it sound pretty bad, but I was pretty amazed with the bass.
I figured I could open it up and make it sound a lot better. Well I ended up ripping the cables apart and after about an hour could not get it fixed. This made me kind of mad since it's my favorite headphone ever.
 
Depressed, I went downstairs and opened up my SR-80 again. I instead went with the 6 hole mod. This seems about perfect. I had way to many previously. There is a bit too much mid-bass, but it's not too bad at all. I'm now really liking my SR-80. Seriously, it felt like someone just handed me a new $150 headphone.
 
I posted an extremely long winded review of the Koss Pro DJ 100 vs the HFI-680 and nobody read it probably, but that's OK.
 
In it I mentioned that the DJ 100 has a LOT of similarities to the SR-80, but has slightly more bass.
 
I got down to the Koss Pro DJ 100 driver and look what I found....
If you think it's bad to get to the SR-80 driver, wait until you try this.
 
 It's similar to the SR-80 driver:
 
1. It has 10 holes
2. It has only 1 "vent" hole on the magnet instead of 2.
3. It has a blue dot. Why? The Grado has a red dot.
4. The holes circle the driver
5. It's the same size
6. It looks the same in most ways, except the very center of the driver.
7. The vent hole on the Koss had glue covering it. Found that interesting.
8. Poking 6 holes for this Koss was stupid. Waaaaayy too many!
 
This all probably means nothing, but I found this VERY interesting. I compared my DJ 100 to the SR-80 for hours and there's a lot of similarities.
The highs are not the same though. The Koss driver is supposed to be the "Titanium" version. It's 40mm.
 
 

 

 
BTW I bought some new silver cable to fix my DJ 100. It's an expensive mistake.
 
UPDATE: I've been listening to the 6 hole modded SR-80 non-stop now and it's just jaw-dropping amazing. Total difference from the stock SR-80. Bass is perfect now and there is a lot. I'll have to pry these off my head sometime tonight and actually get sleep. I think removing the "SR-80" logo helps in some ways too. Only advantage my Koss Pro DJ 100 has now is the highs are not as fatiguing and the imaging and soundstage are far better.
 
Sep 27, 2010 at 1:23 PM Post #246 of 5,004

tdockweiler

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Surprised there is not more feedback on the sound of a modded SR60 or SR-80. More people should do this! It's very easy!
 
I have to ask. What purpose do the holes on the magnet serve? I've heard some people say to NOT cover them and others say to cover them.
 
I have both of them open and it sounds fine to me.
 
Anyway, loving my modded SR-80 now as if you couldn't tell.
 
Eventually I may recable them too if I like the new cable on my DJ 100 that I broke. I've soldered a total of one thing in my life, so hopefully I don't screw something up!
 
Sep 27, 2010 at 6:59 PM Post #248 of 5,004

Bilavideo

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The holes do serve a purpose - on large woofers. They're heat vents to protect the voice coil from overheating when hundreds of watts are pumped through them. They serve no purpose on a half-watt mylar speaker. All headphone manufacturers copy features found on loudspeakers either to gain an actual advantage or to avoid the appearance of being second-rate when their competitors play this game.
 
If the magnet plate is such a source of resonance, there are better ways to fix this than to drill tiny holes into it.  A ring magnet would have a hole right through it.  
 

 
That's basically what Sennheiser is selling with the HD800.  
 

 
If I had a choice between plugging the center of my driver with a magnet plate or a ring magnet with a hole in the middle, I'd choose the latter.  In fact, I'd pop out the back of the magnet plate and replace the magnet with a ring magnet if I didn't fear damage to the driver.
 
Sep 27, 2010 at 8:53 PM Post #250 of 5,004

Bilavideo

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We're talking about the driver back.  There was a previous question about whether it's a big deal to cover up the holes in the backplate when damping it.  Several pointed out that there's really no difference in sound, whether you cover the holes or not.  I added that the reason for this lack of difference is that the holes are just cosmetic.  They're an imitation of the heat vents on the backs of large woofers and subwoofers, which are designed to protect the voice coil from damage when hundreds - if not thousands - of watts are pumped through them.  By comparison, a half-watt mylar headphone driver has little likelihood of suffering from a heat-related disaster.  Those holes are just a cosmetic affectation, a practice followed by most headphone manufacturers.  If something is a big deal in the loudspeaker world, it gets copied in the headphone world.
 
Sep 27, 2010 at 9:37 PM Post #251 of 5,004

Derp

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Hey, I'm sure this is mentioned in the 17 pages but what's the easiest and safest way to get the Sr caps off the grating? I have an Sr225i if that matters, it has the metal grating.
 
Sep 28, 2010 at 5:54 PM Post #252 of 5,004

Bilavideo

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The caps are held on with the same glue used to hold the shells together. Heat it and the caps will loosen up, allowing you to get under them with a screwdriver head or knife blade and apply pressure to pop them off.
 
Sep 28, 2010 at 6:27 PM Post #253 of 5,004

tdockweiler

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I hate to be annoying, but I have to ask.
 
Has anyone seen that Pro DJ 100 driver in anything else?
Perhaps in another Grado headphone? I know it's not the same as the one in the SR60 or SR-80.
 
My guess is that Koss and Grado just import them from the same company or something. I don't think Grado makes it's own drivers, but maybe.
I don't know how that works. I highly doubt Koss is using Grado drivers. That's be impossible. I just don't have a clue why they're so similar.
 
Maybe there's a ton of drivers out there that all look alike, who knows.
 
 
Sep 28, 2010 at 8:44 PM Post #254 of 5,004

Bilavideo

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The question of whether Grado makes its own drivers is a sensitive one.  It's a debate that brings out some of the angriest replies I've seen on HeadFi.  The official word from Grado is that the drivers are made in-house, so - at least to some Grado fans - to suggest otherwise is to call somebody a liar.  You don't have to live in Texas to know "them's fightin' words."
 
Sep 28, 2010 at 8:55 PM Post #255 of 5,004

bbophead

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Interesting and insightful read.  Thanks.
 

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