[DivineCurrent]

I have very limited experience with planar headphones, but I am comparing the Hifiman HE-400i and the Senn HD650 specifically. Not so much sound quality in the subjective sense, but the amount of capability each headphone has. For example, due to the smooth nature of the HD650, it doesn't have that artificial treble spike that gives the impression of more detail. However, the HE-400i does have a slight 8 khz spike. I guess my question is this: is the reason the 400i seems to have more detail directly because of the treble spike, or is it because of the fact it is a planar? I had the Beyer DT 880 a while ago, which is a dynamic but also has that 8-9 khz spike, but didn't bring out nearly as many imperfections of recordings as the HE-400i, like pops and cracks. (Which may be due to greater treble extension.)

 

[jcx]

frequency response does appear to be the 1st order audible difference, can be EQ'd to a degree - probably beyond many head-fier's expectations
 
Smyth sells the complete system with in ear microphones for this http://smyth-research.com/technology.html
 
 
 
a much older, cruder study of EQing differing headphones:
Quote:

 

Headphones do NOT sound the same and cannot be made to sound the same when they're in a different grade of performance...If, however doing so satisfies your ears, then you've saved yourself some money.

 
FYI:
http://www.cpt.univ-mrs.fr/~briolle/11thAESpart1.pdf
http://www.cpt.univ-mrs.fr/~briolle/11thAESpart2.pdf
 
Indeed, we can certainly save some money. 

 

[ghostnote]

>I guess my question is this: is the reason the 400i seems to have more detail directly because of the treble spike, or is it because of the fact it is a planar?
 
It's a bit of both, but this might be oversimplifying things. The thing is that "detail" is not just found in the higher frequency ranges. Planars, in particular, have very good detail retrieval in the bass region, where dynamics can sound bloated and thus mash together two sounds that otherwise would sound distinct.
 
Along the same line, the transient response of a headphone at different ranges bears directly on how much information it can display. The quicker the diaphragm can return to neutral, the faster it can reproduce another detail in the overall soundwave. Planars are pretty good at this because their diaphragms tend to weigh less than dynamics. 
 
The other thing is that, as you mentioned, the treble spike will naturally cause more of the details residing in that part of the spectrum to cut through the overall sound.
 
But detail retrieval alone does not make for a good headphone, despite what detail whores say For the very same reason that Sennheisers are described as "veiled," others say they are "euphonic" .... that is, except the HD800.

 

[DivineCurrent]

Thanks, yeah I figured planar drivers would be generally better at sound detail than dynamics. Problem for me is most of those planars below $1k have too much treble for my taste, even if it does bring more detail out. I would have to get an Audeze or the Hifiman Edition X to get my preferred sound signature. Unless I perfectly EQ the treble down on the HE-400i, but I've always run into resonance probelms doing that for some reason.

 

[gay4dre]

planars are good, dynamics are okay

 

[DivineCurrent]

  planars are good, dynamics are okay

Lol, thanks for the detailed feedback
 
Anyway, It's only been 2 weeks, but I have returned my HE-400i to buy something with a little smoother tonal balance. I've only listened to one planar, but people say that in general it is easier for dynamic headphones to reproduce smoother midrange and treble than planars. Planars tend to have more peaks in these regions, but they outclass most dynamics in bass extension. Ugh, isn't there one headphone that has the best of both worlds, lol. (Maybe Stax?) I do prefer warmer less treble oriented sound though, so perhaps the Audeze LCD-2 would be a good choice. 

 

[HiFiChris]

I think you should try something from Audeze then.

 

[theveterans]

 Anyway, It's only been 2 weeks, but I have returned my HE-400i to buy something with a little smoother tonal balance. I've only listened to one planar, but people say that in general it is easier for dynamic headphones to reproduce smoother midrange and treble than planars. Planars tend to have more peaks in these regions, but they outclass most dynamics in bass extension. Ugh, isn't there one headphone that has the best of both worlds, lol. (Maybe Stax?) I do prefer warmer less treble oriented sound though, so perhaps the Audeze LCD-2 would be a good choice. 

 
I would go on a different route: upgrading to a warmer, smoother and more natural sounding Schiit Multibit or Metrum NOS DACs. This way, you enjoy incredible detail resolution and speed of the planars without ever feeling fatigued with treble / upper mids. Another reason this is a good upgrade is because you're maxing out your HE-400i's potential. An analogy with upgrading to Audeze is like upgrading from a Lexus to a Porsche, but driving at pedestrian speeds, never feeling its full potential. Schiit and Metrum multibit's synergy with bright planars or HD800, AKG K700 series, Beyerdynamic is amazing IMO.

 

[cel4145]

I would go on a different route: upgrading to a warmer, smoother and more natural sounding Schiit Multibit or Metrum NOS DACs. This way, you enjoy incredible detail resolution and speed of the planars without ever feeling fatigued with treble / upper mids. 

He already has an ODAC. The ODAC is generally considered to be already at the accurate/transparent within the range of hearing threshold. Likely he would find no significant difference between those DACs and the ODAC if properly compared.

 

[catspaw]

From my experience, the Audeze LCD 2 sound the best of all headphones I have tried (the only thing missing is stax, tried most of the other high end HPs).
My only problem with the LCD-2 is weight (Its far too heavy for me for long term use, and I use HPs while gaming) so I currently stay at the HD600.
 
Everything else I have tried just doesn't sound right in one area or another.
The audeze definitely has less treble but somehow I did not feel like any detail was missing (where are on the HD600, I do).