[Earbones]

Thank you Earbones, just yesterday I was looking around about the possibility of bringing a dac / amp but I have some doubt, I already have the Dragonfly Red paired with Huawei Mate 10 Pro which has a usb-c in only.. I want to know if I can get enough in terms of audible sound with another DAC/Amp (even with the clutter of the USB-C port in without audio input). Not so there is a big step forward, right? On the other hand I don't know that dap has enough power to feel the difference, and I'm not sure if I spend € 1500 in a dap (like Astell & Kern Kann Cube) instead of a 700 € dap I will have a better deal. If you know please tell me, I'm new here. Thanks.

Psikey gave you some great advice. Assuming your headphones are getting enough power, the difference between various DAC/amp devices are really just different ”flavors of sound”, not anything really dramatic. It’s not going to be a massive night and day difference, no matter what crazy statements you read, ha ha... I real all these reviews talking about “the difference was night and day” between two devices, and it’s just ridiculous. Even between a top-end DAC/amp device and a laptop. While there is no question that really a nice DAC/amp (either standalone or in DAP form) is going to sound better than the headphone jack out of your computer, it’s never going to be night and day. It’s going to be flavors. Night and day changes are heard between different headphones, not different DAC/amp devices.

Also, I will say something some might find a little controversial, but when it comes to solid state amplifiers, I think power is power and sound is sound. The tech to build solid state amps is just too well-established these days... It’s neither particularly difficult nor expensive to get right. All modern solid state amps provide clean power, and they all sound the same. If one solid state amplifier of the same power output as another sounds significantly better, it’s not because it’s so great, it’s because something is wrong with the other. In my opinion, the difference in sound between devices comes down to how they implement the DAC, period. I believe all a modern solid state amp has to do is provide enough power for your specific headphones. If it doesn’t, the headphone won’t sound as good as they can, and the best DAC in the world won’t be able to fix that.

SO... When looking for a DAC/amp device, either a standalone DAC/Amp or a DAP, first make sure all the devices you’re considering feature amp sections that can definitely provide enough power for your headphones to sing their best. Then decide what DAC implementation “sound flavor” you like best.

 

[Earbones]

Guys, quick question, and again I apologize if this has been discussed earlier in the thread- searching through roughly 70 pages is tough...

But are we 110% sure that the unit can’t be used as a USB DAC? I ask because on the official Sony product page, if you open the “Full Specifications” tab and look under “Footnotes” they state “USB DAC Mode”...

 

[brokengundam]

Guys, quick question, and again I apologize if this has been discussed earlier in the thread- searching through roughly 70 pages is tough...

But are we 110% sure that the unit can’t be used as a USB DAC? I ask because on the official Sony product page, if you open the “Full Specifications” tab and look under “Footnotes” they state “USB DAC Mode”...

https://www.sony-asia.com/electronics/walkman/nw-zx500-series/specifications

It says USB DAC Mode, then a blank space, meaning no USB DAC Mode, just like there is no digital noise canceling built in, like in the A100 series.

Sorry!

 

[PocketClouds]

Psikey gave you some great advice. Assuming your headphones are getting enough power, the difference between various DAC/amp devices are really just different ”flavors of sound”, not anything really dramatic. It’s not going to be a massive night and day difference, no matter what crazy statements you read, ha ha... I real all these reviews talking about “the difference was night and day” between two devices, and it’s just ridiculous. Even between a top-end DAC/amp device and a laptop. While there is no question that really a nice DAC/amp (either standalone or in DAP form) is going to sound better than the headphone jack out of your computer, it’s never going to be night and day. It’s going to be flavors. Night and day changes are heard between different headphones, not different DAC/amp devices.

Also, I will say something some might find a little controversial, but when it comes to solid state amplifiers, I think power is power and sound is sound. The tech to build solid state amps is just too well-established these days... It’s neither particularly difficult nor expensive to get right. All modern solid state amps provide clean power, and they all sound the same. If one solid state amplifier of the same power output as another sounds significantly better, it’s not because it’s so great, it’s because something is wrong with the other. In my opinion, the difference in sound between devices comes down to how they implement the DAC, period. I believe all a modern solid state amp has to do is provide enough power for your specific headphones. If it doesn’t, the headphone won’t sound as good as they can, and the best DAC in the world won’t be able to fix that.

SO... When looking for a DAC/amp device, either a standalone DAC/Amp or a DAP, first make sure all the devices you’re considering feature amp sections that can definitely provide enough power for your headphones to sing their best. Then decide what DAC implementation “sound flavor” you like best.

Wow this opinion is a shiny teaching! Thank you!

 

[Audiophile2019]

ak 100 and sony 1a are the only 2 daps I ve ever listened to. sony 1a was selling at $1150 at one point, AK 100 at $1700-1800
now I am considering buying sony zx300. hoping for sound quality that is close to 1A, but is not so huge and can be put in the pocket.

Actually ZX300 sounds much closer to flagship model, WM1Z than WM1A but with smaller soundstage. The sonic signature is "warm & fun" both ZX300 & WM1Z where as for WM1A, it's more neutral, quite bright though not as bright as AK's model like SP1000M. By the way ZX300 fits very well with MDR-1AM2..

 

[Earbones]

https://www.sony-asia.com/electronics/walkman/nw-zx500-series/specifications

It says USB DAC Mode, then a blank space, meaning no USB DAC Mode, just like there is no digital noise canceling built in, like in the A100 series.

Sorry!

Ah, I was wondering what the mention of noise cancellation in that section was all about... I was thinking perhaps it was some special EQ option for NC headphones or something.

So no USB DAC mode. That’s a bummer.

 

[psikey]

Ah, I was wondering what the mention of noise cancellation in that section was all about... I was thinking perhaps it was some special EQ option for NC headphones or something.

So no USB DAC mode. That’s a bummer.

Why the emphasise on a DAP also being an external DAC? The new Fiio BTR5 is an awesome Balanced LDAC BT adapter & also full external DAC for only ~ £75 and bloody awesome really. My Dragonfly Cobalt fed MQA via Tidal on PC still has the SQ edge but not massive improvement.

 

[salanos]

I had a brief hands-on with the ZX500, it's pretty decent sounding, but somehow I felt my ZX1 actually did better! And the ZX500's elongated format is nice and comfy to hold, but the tiny screen is an eye sore and difficult to use, it's too narrow. Song titles are truncated and such.
While the UI is generally responsive, there are significant frame rate drops throughout the general system, so it's still sluggish feeling imho.

But it's an improvement over older SONY players of course in the software end, but I feel the hardware has taken real steps back in usability. And the buttons are flush with the body of the player unlike the ZX1 which has clearly separated buttons, making the older player far easier to use in the pocket. In general this is the deal breaker for me and is what's driven me to the HiBy R6 (R5's screen felt too narrow for comfortable use for me as well).
The other reasons I wrote the ZX500 off is that combined with those traits, I don't have huge confidence in the ZX500 lasting a long time without needing a battery replacement (an issue that is affecting my ZX1 for the second time and also occurred to my F800). The lack of additional QOL features like sampling rate display in the notification bar, unconfirmed SRC bypassing, fast charge support, USB DAC functionality, etc. all kind of put me off for the price. It doesn't have a speaker at all either unlike the F800/ZX1, but that's not common in DAPs in the first place.

As discussed here before, SONY does things their own way such as relying on their proprietary amplifier, the Class D (digital) branded as S-MASTER HX and offering DSEE HX to supposedly enhance compressed audio. My personal experience with the ZX1 really is that it sounds pretty good on day to day use even if it doesn't truly measure a SNR good enough for hi-res audio and as many have pointed out SONY has consistently delivered superior battery life to other brands of players. I would probably point fingers at how they design their audio systems for this - the S-MASTER digital amps may have inferior output power, but they have power efficiency and modest consumption. The ZX1 lasts a pretty decently long time on what appears to be merely a 600mAh battery cell! 600mAh! That's 1/6th the size of most other players' batteries! If you're wondering how I got this number, I was given the old cell that was removed from my two WALKMANs, and they both looked like similar, small, chinese-made batteries with the aforementioned capacity printed on their label. The upshot to the small cell size is that they charge relatively fast even on 'standard charging'.
But the drawback here is that it seems SONY has been consistently using low quality batteries, that not only have low capacity, but poor lifespan (in terms of discharge cycles) and the battery begins to have insufficient output after a couple of years of use. That's what's been happening to my F800 and ZX1; they shut down prematurely at maybe even 75% of battery when they're being actively used screen on (I've had it die at 87% on the original cell before replacement).

Nobody's torn down the newer WALKMANs as far as I can find, but given SONY's history I don't expect them to have put in much better batteries into the ZX500 or A100. They don't quote a battery number or fast charge tech either, so I'm inclined to believe the battery subsystem is still subpar, and I'm not keen on having to go back to the SONY centre and lose my player for 3 weeks so I can actually use it without it shutting down on me at this price range.

 

[xenoVa]

People imported ZX507 from Japan: Where do you live and how much did you pay in total (including all fees and duties) ?

 

[brokengundam]

I had a brief hands-on with the ZX500, it's pretty decent sounding, but somehow I felt my ZX1 actually did better! And the ZX500's elongated format is nice and comfy to hold, but the tiny screen is an eye sore and difficult to use, it's too narrow. Song titles are truncated and such.
While the UI is generally responsive, there are significant frame rate drops throughout the general system, so it's still sluggish feeling imho.

But it's an improvement over older SONY players of course in the software end, but I feel the hardware has taken real steps back in usability. And the buttons are flush with the body of the player unlike the ZX1 which has clearly separated buttons, making the older player far easier to use in the pocket. In general this is the deal breaker for me and is what's driven me to the HiBy R6 (R5's screen felt too narrow for comfortable use for me as well).
The other reasons I wrote the ZX500 off is that combined with those traits, I don't have huge confidence in the ZX500 lasting a long time without needing a battery replacement (an issue that is affecting my ZX1 for the second time and also occurred to my F800). The lack of additional QOL features like sampling rate display in the notification bar, unconfirmed SRC bypassing, fast charge support, USB DAC functionality, etc. all kind of put me off for the price. It doesn't have a speaker at all either unlike the F800/ZX1, but that's not common in DAPs in the first place.

As discussed here before, SONY does things their own way such as relying on their proprietary amplifier, the Class D (digital) branded as S-MASTER HX and offering DSEE HX to supposedly enhance compressed audio. My personal experience with the ZX1 really is that it sounds pretty good on day to day use even if it doesn't truly measure a SNR good enough for hi-res audio and as many have pointed out SONY has consistently delivered superior battery life to other brands of players. I would probably point fingers at how they design their audio systems for this - the S-MASTER digital amps may have inferior output power, but they have power efficiency and modest consumption. The ZX1 lasts a pretty decently long time on what appears to be merely a 600mAh battery cell! 600mAh! That's 1/6th the size of most other players' batteries! If you're wondering how I got this number, I was given the old cell that was removed from my two WALKMANs, and they both looked like similar, small, chinese-made batteries with the aforementioned capacity printed on their label. The upshot to the small cell size is that they charge relatively fast even on 'standard charging'.
But the drawback here is that it seems SONY has been consistently using low quality batteries, that not only have low capacity, but poor lifespan (in terms of discharge cycles) and the battery begins to have insufficient output after a couple of years of use. That's what's been happening to my F800 and ZX1; they shut down prematurely at maybe even 75% of battery when they're being actively used screen on (I've had it die at 87% on the original cell before replacement).

Nobody's torn down the newer WALKMANs as far as I can find, but given SONY's history I don't expect them to have put in much better batteries into the ZX500 or A100. They don't quote a battery number or fast charge tech either, so I'm inclined to believe the battery subsystem is still subpar, and I'm not keen on having to go back to the SONY centre and lose my player for 3 weeks so I can actually use it without it shutting down on me at this price range.

Most lithium-ion batteries only get up to 500 full charges before they start to go out. I think I might have gotten 500 days of use out of my Hiby R6 before its battery gave up the ghost, and it had gone through at least 300 recharge cycles. I doubt any player on the market now will give more than 3 years of good battery life (even with light usage), but I wish you luck in the search.

FYI, the ZX-507 will charge in about 2 hours with a PD/quickcharge 3 charger.

 

[sander93]

Actually ZX300 sounds much closer to flagship model, WM1Z than WM1A but with smaller soundstage. The sonic signature is "warm & fun" both ZX300 & WM1Z where as for WM1A, it's more neutral, quite bright though not as bright as AK's model like SP1000M. By the way ZX300 fits very well with MDR-1AM2..

yeah, thanks, I have watched a review, where AK where labeled as bright, zx300 wm1z as warm and wm1a as neutral.
I want a truly portable player with best sound quality.wm 1z/1a are too big.
the only thing that I didn't enjoyed on wm1a was EQ, I could not add bass using EQ when I was listening to Snoop Dogg. EQ almost did not respond...why? as I understood, zx300 and wm1z play better bass, right?
I hear contradicting opinions about sound quality / signature of zx300 and zx500...
some users (and sony's survey) say that zx500 is a significant upgrade of zx300, (sony implemanted upgrades used in DMP Z1, new caps and so on..) someone even said that zx300 is a dirty dac (smth like that).
and others users say that they barely hear any significant difference between zx500 and zx300. and new caps are just the same as they was on zx300 except the color of print on it.
where is truth? I want the best SQ that I can get in such form factor.
yeap I love my mdr 1Am2. by the way, did u compare them to mdr zr1? wider soundstage and that's the only advantage of zr1 over 1Am2?

 

[salanos]

Most lithium-ion batteries only get up to 500 full charges before they start to go out. I think I might have gotten 500 days of use out of my Hiby R6 before its battery gave up the ghost, and it had gone through at least 300 recharge cycles. I doubt any player on the market now will give more than 3 years of good battery life (even with light usage), but I wish you luck in the search.

FYI, the ZX-507 will charge in about 2 hours with a PD/quickcharge 3 charger.

That's interesting that the ZX-507 has a 2 hour charge time... 2 hours is about average for a ~2,000mAh cell with no fast charge tech I think. Does the ZX500 actually have any fast charge specified and I just missed it?

And yes, most batteries getting around 500 full recharge cycles is the average, but given I do not flatline my WALKMAN battery most of the time it would wear out this much. It doesn't seem so much a severe capacity reduction, to be honest, more so than a degradation in the battery's power supply capability. Either that or it's a bug in Android of some kind, but basically what happens is while you're using the player it will suddenly report that it's out of battery and shut down at varying percentages (it gets worse as it ages more). For whatever reason it can go the usual time as long as the screen stays off. So it seems to be a power draw issue, and I did note on an old battery the voltage rating is rather low.

On the other hand, if your R6's battery went at 500 days that's not giving me much confidence either. But if it just means the player's battery life is shorter after a couple of years of use, that's acceptable to me, I just don't want it to be practically unusable.

 

[brokengundam]

That's interesting that the ZX-507 has a 2 hour charge time... 2 hours is about average for a ~2,000mAh cell with no fast charge tech I think. Does the ZX500 actually have any fast charge specified and I just missed it?

And yes, most batteries getting around 500 full recharge cycles is the average, but given I do not flatline my WALKMAN battery most of the time it would wear out this much. It doesn't seem so much a severe capacity reduction, to be honest, more so than a degradation in the battery's power supply capability. Either that or it's a bug in Android of some kind, but basically what happens is while you're using the player it will suddenly report that it's out of battery and shut down at varying percentages (it gets worse as it ages more). For whatever reason it can go the usual time as long as the screen stays off. So it seems to be a power draw issue, and I did note on an old battery the voltage rating is rather low.

On the other hand, if your R6's battery went at 500 days that's not giving me much confidence either. But if it just means the player's battery life is shorter after a couple of years of use, that's acceptable to me, I just don't want it to be practically unusable.

The R6's last month or two of life showed varying levels of charge when it would shut down. The last time it shut down it was at 15%, but never powered up again.

Edit: Sony lists the ZX-500 charge time as 6 hours, so charging 4 hours quicker is a bonus? LOL

 

[Sonywalkmanuser]

I feel that Sony has done a great job with ZX507 S-Master Amplifier. Previous implentation have some kind of metallic or brittle treble with certain music. This time it sounds as organic sounding as R2R dacs.

 

[purk]

I feel that Sony has done a great job with ZX507 S-Master Amplifier. Previous implentation have some kind of metallic or brittle treble with certain music. This time it sounds as organic sounding as R2R dacs.

I never heard it on my ZX2, ZX100, 1A, ZX300, and 1Z. The ZX1 kinda has that metallic treble.