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Sony MDR-Z1R In classical music

Discussion in 'Headphones (full-size)' started by SONYES, Aug 22, 2017.
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IS Sony MDR-Z1R suitable for classical music

  1. SONY FOR classical music

    65.1%
  2. classical music IS NOT FOR Sony MDR-Z1R

    34.9%
  3. AND WAY ...

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
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  1. ervin192
    I haven't tried Oppo HA-1 with Z1Rs, but I've listened to it and it might not be good with these cans especially when it comes to classical, it lacks some space and punch.

    As for the TA-ZH1ES its DSP part actually seems to be poor, have heard it several times with Z1R from digital inputs (walkman, CD transport, PC) and the sound seemed veiled and compressed, might better off use the analog in. Yet it indeed drives the Z1R fairly well, least doesn't let it suffer from gain mismatch.
     
    SONYES likes this.
  2. SONYES
    Thank you
    Your impression
    And your learned opinion.
    I will not buy the OPPO HA-1 that looks amazing and beautiful
    But apparently not suitable. To Z1R
    Possibly.?
    And do not want to go into another purchase.
    at the present
    LUXMAN P-1U really surprise me.
    Two sources are connected to his entrance
    RCA + XLR
    SA-11 S1 + X707ES in XLR
    rca
    XA50ES
    Others I've heard so far

    The synergy P-1U with ZIR several times made me smile.
    With excellent control over the bass with a very full MID but open
    HIGH Do not scream.

    This combination does not fit any recording
    One thing is clear.
    I've said previously Sound Stage's Z1R inspires admiration 3D
    In the organ with Bach
    I'm a paradise
     
  3. ervin192
    It's true that there is some synergy between Luxman amps and Sony phones.
    Really a pity that P-1U can't go balanced, and P-700u has more grainy and harsh sound, but now there is P-750u, said to be much smoother and fluent; haven't tried it but it might be a winner.
     
    SONYES likes this.
  4. SONYES
    grainy and harsh sound,...??? ON P-700U

    I might have a winning combination
    LUXMAN P-1U + SONY MDR-Z1R
    same as
    With HD800
    P-1U has no balanced outputs and if it was ...................excellent.
    The P-700U I have never heard and is not here in Israel even with the importer
    Only P-200.
    P-700U is based mostly on P-1U with doubling of the final amplifiers and has 4 instead of 2
    The construction and sound are impeccable P-1U
    The P-750U in Japan has already appeared just a month ago

    With which headphones did you hear the P-700U?
    And what a source
    Are they really a bit perhaps more open than the original P-1U
     
  5. ervin192
    Compared them 2~3 years ago with TH900 and HD800. Not sure about the construction, as for the sound the P700u tends to have more power and less fineness/softness. It's better driving high impedance phones especially when using balanced output.
    Somewhat like the situation I faced with my mass kobo 394. They do not drive the low impedance cans out of control but the sound doesn't feel free.
     
    SONYES likes this.
  6. SONYES
    Ahh I see
    My P-1U
    Working really poor quality and not good can. not determine uniform hearing strength.
    With the "AT-W1000X" that I have with low resistance
    However
    BCL+W1000X sounds at a low volume
    Quick as fast STAX only in this term only
    Increase the volume drop in W1000X whole mess sounds.
    So I had a huge surprise that I hooked up
    Z1R to P-1U.
    All of a sudden I opened up everything with a very, very tight bass, depending on the recording.
    Everything else. has a feeling so far that this is the winning combination
    When I already wanted to sell the P-1U. To buy the
    TA-ZH 1 ES
    The level of detail transfer is really excellent at P-1U
    Especially in the balanced connection at the entrance but there is no balanced exit
    But still amazing
    With the SA-11 S1 as well as the HD800
    A combination of hearing music and hours.
    WOW

    Z1R.
    I have to make a break because the pressure on the ear is different
    180 degrees from HD800
     
  7. thanatosguan
    In my opinion bass is absolutely critical in classical music, and Z1R delivers that in spades. Whether you're listening to Mahler's 5th or Chopin Etudes, the bass renders out the tactile feel of the room(hall or studio) and the character of the instrument (as deep as a Viennese Boesendorfer or as bright as a Yamaha CFX). If MDR-Z7 is a bit too skewed towards warmth with a bit wonkiness in the subbass and midbass(critical for orchestral), the Z1R maintains absolute natural tones while continuing to deliver deep bass with great timbre and tone.

    If the brass section is intended to be ugly, performed to be ugly, and recorded as ugly, the Z1R won't smooth that out for you, and that is great in my opinion.

    And as a pianist I appreciate the bass reproduction of the Z1R when playing solo piano very much. The piano is actually a PERCUSSION instrument, and the bass attack and timbre is extremely important. Few headphones do this very well. Most people like to throw around praises to good treble headphones and assume it would do wonders with piano music. But bass is also very important since it's always there most of the time.

    Z1R is very tactile, which IMO makes a great classical music headphone. Recently went to a Mahler 5th concert in Hong Kong and the cello section blew me away with its aggressiveness. I'm thinking about that when I write this. Some recordings do very well in this aspect with the Z1R. I recommend trying out Mahler's 6th in Bernstein's Mahler compilation.
     
    SONYES and Witcher like this.
  8. phaeton70
    agree that bass and sub-bass is crucial.
    problem is: when too much bass becomes un-realistic? I have been in many concert halls, and I have never heard a so too abundant bass like the Z1R is presenting. everything below 150Hz is definitely too much in the Z1R, I agree it can be very pleasant and engaging, but it is totally un-realistic IMHO and as far as I have experienced in any real concert hall.
    I'm not saying it's good or bad, it all depends what you are looking for. if you're looking for extreme realism, or you're looking for more engaging sound. that's why I'll maybe keep my Z1R. sometimes I like to listen with more engagement than realism. still have to decide though.
     
    SONYES likes this.
  9. SONYES
    Thank you very much for your outstanding response
    I'll discuss everything tomorrow
    Good night {here}
     
  10. JJF_888
    Anyone running the Kann with the MDR-Z1R? Is the Kann amp sufficient?
     
    SONYES likes this.
  11. banco-sg
    Z1R is not picky with amp. You can't go wrong with it
     
    JJF_888 and SONYES like this.
  12. Witcher
    I have 2 considerations for a head-fi or hi-fi sound:

    1. I would like the overall sound to be "nice to hear" as in all frequency ranges are nicely represented. Anaemic or overly bloated sounds are very annoying to listen to for medium or lengthy durations. This part is quite subjective, since what I would consider to be "just nice" might be too much or too little for others. However, this for me is about overall sound balance (less treble, more treble, less bass, more bass, etc...), and doesn't really affect the "accuracy" of the sound. This bit is what I find to be acceptable most cases, since it's subjective to preference, and we are adaptable enough to accept these differences in most cases. But yes, I personally enjoy bass with classical music. It adds to the overall impact of the piece.

    2. Being a hobbyist musician myself (for the last 28 years), I am well aware of how many different tones there are for snares, guitars, basses, and even keys. I have also spent considerable time when younger in a concert band, so am familiar with the up close tones of brass, woodwinds, percussion and stringed instruments. So there is an element of accuracy that's to be expected. For example, I noticed that the much lauded Stax 009 inflated the mids too much such that a tight snare sounded like an open one. For a headphone system (with Stax amp) that was so celebrated, I was disappointed with what I heard. The way I test this out, is to listen to tracks I have recorded myself. I know what drums I used in the studio, what guitars, amps, mics, etc, so I know what to expect. I've heard several tracks that others have recommended to me as "test tracks" only to find out that these have been severely tweaked with post production mastering, rendering them unreliable, and having not been in the studio myself, it's also difficult to interpret what the mastering process did to the individual tones. In terms of tonal representation of individual instruments, I have found the Z1R to be quite accurate, and the only difference I can tell, would be a matter of decay, attack, and balance in sound. at least it doesn't compress a snare hit the way I've heard some other cans do ending up sounding like a midi patch. The individual instruments are very well represented. This is also very evident with the HD800S, but less so with the stock HD800 with that 6khz mid spike (and certainly not with the HD700). So it's amusing sometimes to see some people claim that certain setups are "accurate" when I have experienced that they aren't. One of the best representations of accuracy I've found are the Sony Z5 iems with almost any source I've tried (though it has better synergy with the WM1 series DAPs)

    But I think the most important thing is this: regardless of accuracy, if one enjoys the sound coming out of the setup (balance, soundstage, imaging), then that should be sufficient. It's pointless to debate "accuracy" unless you've been in the studio yourselves when we could all be enjoying the music instead of debating over inconsequential issues.
     
    Last edited: Sep 11, 2017
    greggf, thanatosguan and SONYES like this.
  13. banco-sg
    I am wondering, how do you compensate the lack of bass in hd800s when you are listening to classical? They are really flat to me... i really tried to love HD800S, but i just couldnt...
     
    SONYES likes this.
  14. Witcher
    I know what you mean. However, my HD800S is driven by the ifi audio itube2 in buffer mode, and the ican SE, and I use the mojo as a DAC. The ifi stack is quite unobtrusive, so I basically get what I hear from the mojo, with a bit of smoothness contributed by the tube buffer of the itube2 (it's the same thing we use for guitar effect chains, where a nice tone buffer can "regenerate" the guitar tone with minimal colouring, but adding a little "glow" in the notes.)

    The magic of the ifi stack, lies in it's Xbass switches (ignore the 3D switches). The iCan SE has 3 settings: off, a bit (med bass), and MOAR (much bass). lol. The itube2, even in buffer mode, also has the Xbass switches, and has a 20Hz LPF in 2 gain stages as well as an "off mode", though these are configured more for speakers. However, these 2 xbass switches actually stack, so I can have 4x the amount of bass needed (enough to turn your head into mush) if I am so inclined. For classical, just leaning one of then in the mid bass mode, is enough, although sometimes going full on for one component is also fun to play with. The good thing is that the HD800S actually responds well to EQ tweaks. The good thing about the ifi Xbass, is that it only raises the sub bass, and nothing more, with almost no bleed into the bass or lower mids.

    So with such a switchable option, I just tweak to suit my needs for that particular listening period.

    P.S. I tried listening to Prince's "Insatiable" with the 4x bass mode. I couldn't take it after 2 mins. I was too busy laughing at how my brain stem reverberated with every bass hit.
     
    SONYES likes this.
  15. banco-sg
    I see, so it's basically EQ tweaks, which i am trying to avoid.
    I had HD800S and ifi iDSD BL (Xbass on, but no EQ tweak), but i just couldn't love it. They are too sterile and flat to my taste.
    Glad, i can still exchange it to utopia.
     
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