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Solid vs. Stranded: Does it matter?

Discussion in 'Sound Science' started by oddity, Dec 8, 2009.
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  1. m1abrams
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by qusp /img/forum/go_quote.gif
    I think the makers of cat5 solid core networking cable might disagree here and skin effect is much more of a problem at high frequency. higher priced networking cable that doesnt have to be moved around a lot is often solid.




    Solid network cable is used when possible because it is CHEAPER and THINNER. Nothing at all to do with its ability to transfer data better or more reliable. Price and size are the key factors. With networking cables you may not think there is much difference in the size between the two but when you end up with a bundle of 100 or more it adds up.

    Will just ignore the arcing comment.
     
  2. etiolate
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Koyaan I. Sqatsi /img/forum/go_quote.gif
    ARCING!?

    Are you ******* kidding?

    *sigh*

    Where do people come up with such nonsense?

    se




    lol, i was thinking the same. qusp, you originally said the strands act as one conductor, so how then can an arc form? potential difference between the strands would have to be present to arc (and a big difference at that), but if they are a single conductor there is no potential difference.
     
  3. SoupRKnowva
    i was curious about using stranded for digital but apparently solid is better?
     
  4. IPodPJ
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by SoupRKnowva /img/forum/go_quote.gif
    i was curious about using stranded for digital but apparently solid is better?



    I've found that Belden 1694A digital coax (sold by Blue Jeans Cable) at a length of 18 ft. to be the best.
     
  5. smeggy
    I like it really bendy best.
     
  6. SB
    Since skin effect does not happen in the audio range it would not matter.
     
  7. smeggy
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by SB /img/forum/go_quote.gif
    Since skin effect does not happen in the audio range it would not matter.



    Never let facts get in the way of good marketing. [​IMG]
     
    cjl likes this.
  8. Black Stuart
    How does the signal current flow?
    I've just asked this question on another forum and I am awaiting answers from the science brigade.

    Stranded or solid. If a bunch of wires are in contact then they must be seen by the signal as one wire BUT one wire with many interfaces.

    So, many hear no difference but how many of these that can hear no difference have ever had a hearing test - it might just shock them.

    It's no surprise to me that Nordost use multiple, seperated conductors (no cross talk) that's what I arrived at after more than 3 years of trying just about every configuration under the sun.

    Sheilding - I used to prefer non sheilded wire but that was until I tried using a dialectric that had about 3-4mm between sheilding and signal wire and that made a very big difference indeed.

    Bare wire is to be preferred to anything that has a skin-tight covering (it's irrelevant what material is used) - again this was after so many experiments.

    There are those who use cotton sleeving and swear by it and I can see why as cotton will not inter-react with whatever you use for a conductor. Only problem with this is how do you sheild this cotton sleeved wire?

    Double sheilding (which is what I use) means a dead quiet cable, coupled with bare wire ( I use high quality silver/plated HCC) means a very, very neutral cable and neutrality is what I'm after.

    I think it's crazy to talk about using different conductor types to 'tweak your system'. If using neutral cables you can hear unnatural warmth or brightness, you need to look at the components of your system.

    For those who say all wire sounds the same - to take this to a logical conclusion means that for any given cap of the same rating/voltage - the sound will be identical -now this is plain nonsense.

    Take a coupling cap - are you telling me that polyester/polypropylene/PIO(aluminium/copper/silver)/Teflon or what I use silver foil all sound the same, when all these different caps have different properties - no way.

    Don't forget the blindingly obvious (which is why so many miss it) - everything you hear through your system is conveyed by cables, which is why not only conductor type but also design is so important.

    go back to the 70/80s when even the best commercial companies were selling equipment with nothing better than bell wire.

    I've listened to most of the old amps whether solid state or valve and compared to he best of todays offerings those old amps were crap - s/s, dull and lifeless; valve, overly warm and with little real bass, mostly bloated.

    What's the difference today, certainly not the designs - this was all worked out decades ago from before WW11 up until the mid 60s.

    So what's the difference - components and wiring, you just can't compare things like naked Vishay Z foils to anything that has gone before. VH Teflons/Mundorf S/O / GS. or hand made silver foils like I use - way, way better than those from the past. Do you have to pay a fortune for seriously good caps - try ERSE - outstanding and cheap.

    Bizarrely this does'nt apply to valves/tubes. With all our knowledge of metals and with CAD you would think that today we could blow away everything produced in the past but with a few exceptions this is just not the case.

    It must also be obvious that only in systems that are very neutral and sensitive will cable differences be heard. This does'nt mean you have to have a really expensive system but rather a system that has been put together with care and balance.
     
    nick n likes this.
  9. SB
    The dielectric has no bearing in a 0-20kHz audio cables.
     
    cjl likes this.
  10. Black Stuart
    Steve, are you talking from theory or from ACTUAL experiments you have carried out?
     
  11. Black Stuart
    Uncle Erik,
    I saw on another thread that you state that your system is all about the mids - if this is so how can you possibly comment on the overall performance of cables, since you cannot hear what is going on top and bottom.
     
  12. m1abrams
    The fact that you state that amp designs have not change in decades kinda invalidates the rest of your claims. So more research.
     
  13. Hudson
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Black Stuart /img/forum/go_quote.gif
    Uncle Erik,
    I saw on another thread that you state that your system is all about the mids - if this is so how can you possibly comment on the overall performance of cables, since you cannot hear what is going on top and bottom.




    Just out of interest, do you have any empirical data showing a non-flat frequency response of audio cables across the audio frequency range? Some peer reviewed papers or something. Cheers.
     
  14. jcx
    whats wrong with RMAA tests - should show real fractional dB FR differences even with poor motherboard audio chipsets

    Download. Audio Rightmark
     
  15. SB
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Black Stuart /img/forum/go_quote.gif
    Steve, are you talking from theory or from ACTUAL experiments you have carried out?



    Measured and proven in theory, dielectrics are irrelevant until well out of the 20kHz range and well out of our power range, a simple google search will turn up a lot of info. But like everything else in high end audio the high end fan boys will take something real but apply it to an irrelevant situation. Like quantum tunneling, it is real and can cause problems but not in the audio or video spectrum.
     
    cjl likes this.
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