[Fox1977]

I can't seem to find a way to preorder the A16. Is it in a non-order phase?

Indeed Smyth Research closed the preorders a while ago to focus already on producing those already ordered.
The french dealer still proposes the A16 for sale though, for 4290€ with a shipping date estimated "Fall 2018 in limited quantities".

 

[SergioPOE]

I can't seem to find a way to preorder the A16. Is it in a non-order phase?

Pre-orders are over. You will have to wait until it's up for sale at its new and "improved" price of $4000.

 

[raband]

I can't seem to find a way to preorder the A16. Is it in a non-order phase?

Pre-orders are finished

An email to them should get you sorted or let you know when to expect to be able to put in a new.

They're pretty quick on enquiry emails (other than release dates)

 

[musicday]

I feel sorry for everyone that has to pay the new price when ordering the A16, but i think is worth it in the end if you are after such product. If you look at the top of the range headphones that are available on the market they are even more expensive. So is down to everyone. For example A16+ Meze Empyrean can give you lots of audio joy for many years to come.

 

[SergioPOE]

I feel sorry for everyone that has to pay the new price when ordering the A16, but i think is worth it in the end if you are after such product. If you look at the top of the range headphones that are available on the market they are even more expensive. So is down to everyone. For example A16+ Meze Empyrean can give you lots of audio joy for many years to come.

I didn't get in at the Kickstarter price, but I did get in at the pre-order price. If I had to buy the A16 at €4300, it would definitely sting, especially knowing how much cheaper it was, but then you look at the prices of high-end headphones, amps, speakers and audio equipment in general, and you realize that even at 4000+, it's a relative bargain for what you're getting.

 

[AppleheadMay]

I agree with both of you, about 4k sounds about right when you compare it with a decent surround receiver for speakers (like the offerings from Marantz for example.
Also, there is nothing else out there like the A16. 11.1 or whatever up to 16ch surround from headphones, all the standards needed, acts like a centre for all you surround needs just like speaker receivers do ... hard to find.
But still, the price difference between Kickstarter or even pre-order and final retail is substantial.
That said, I'd happily pay it after all having in mind that the A16 will be the centre of my media-, PC- and gaming setup.

 

[Fox1977]

I understand that the new price can be understandable regarding the technology and the complexity of the A16. When i found out the price on Kickstarter (i ran into it by chance, i hadn't heard of the Kickstarter campaign), there was only 4 pieces left at the cheapest price, so i didn't hesitate long and after VAT and with the second headtracker, i paid around 1150€.
Clearly, at the new price, it would have been a no deal for me. I couldn't spend such a huge sum from the family budget... I'd have kept using Out Of Your Head, dreaming of the A16, and maybe i'd have bought the new Creative product that is supposed to be released by the end of the year (though probably rather in 2019 since there hasn't been news about it for a long while).

 

[sahmen]

You may all be right, but perhaps only to some extent : considered in relation to rising prices in hi-end audio equipments in general (headphones, amps, DACS, network players. etc. etc.), the retail pricing of the A-16 may still seem to be reasonable, even if it is more than twice the original Kickstarter backers price...

However, you also have to consider the possibility that the new ridiculous trend in the ever-rising prices of these hi-end audio equipment, is, in itself, just that--ridiculous!,and ridiculously gratuitous, in that it is often based not on any demonstrably real production costs or genuine rising standards in audio quality, but on sheer greed, price-gouging, and (given the incidence of diminishing returns in each of these areas of audio consumption, of which almost everyone is aware) the overhyping of largely overrated claims of improvement in quality, not to mention the readiness, and even eagerness of enough hobbyists to pay for such hyped up claims...

I do not want to speculate on the motivations that drive such enthusiasm on the part of such hobbyists (that is, assuming they're indeed "hobbyists," in the first place, and not just people with deeper than deep pockets looking for ways to dispose of some disposable cash, or just "launder" it on something), or to lambast them for their choices... I am just stating this as an objective fact, in a world where people seem inexplicably willing to pay $9000.00 for a simple pair of speaker cables (link), or $3500 for a USB cable (link)... (I am sure any one can find even more outrageous examples of this trend online, without even trying too hard). In short, there seems to be more than enough evidence to at least suggest (if not demonstrate) that some manufacturers in this hobby (who shall remain nameless for now) are raising the prices of their products not because of the elevated quality of the product they're selling, but because of their suspicion that they'll find willing consumers to pay for them, regardless of how ridiculous those prices are...

Again, I am just observing, and not necessarily being judgmental... do with this what you will

 

[musicday]

I understand that the new price can be understandable regarding the technology and the complexity of the A16. When i found out the price on Kickstarter (i ran into it by chance, i hadn't heard of the Kickstarter campaign), there was only 4 pieces left at the cheapest price, so i didn't hesitate long and after VAT and with the second headtracker, i paid around 1150€.
Clearly, at the new price, it would have been a no deal for me. I couldn't spend such a huge sum from the family budget... I'd have kept using Out Of Your Head, dreaming of the A16, and maybe i'd have bought the new Creative product that is supposed to be released by the end of the year (though probably rather in 2019 since there hasn't been news about it for a long while).

Sorry don't want to pressure you, but have you heard more news from the French dealer, especially when the YouTube video will be posted? Also i want to know if you got the Audeze Mobius, what do you think about them if you tried them.
Your help is much appreciated in this thread community by the way.

 

[phoenixdogfan]

I understand that the new price can be understandable regarding the technology and the complexity of the A16. When i found out the price on Kickstarter (i ran into it by chance, i hadn't heard of the Kickstarter campaign), there was only 4 pieces left at the cheapest price, so i didn't hesitate long and after VAT and with the second headtracker, i paid around 1150€.
Clearly, at the new price, it would have been a no deal for me. I couldn't spend such a huge sum from the family budget... I'd have kept using Out Of Your Head, dreaming of the A16, and maybe i'd have bought the new Creative product that is supposed to be released by the end of the year (though probably rather in 2019 since there hasn't been news about it for a long while).

Though the Smythe is the first real product of its kin, if successful, it certainly won't be the last. Other companies will certainly follow on with products at least as good, if not better for lower cost. Paying $4k USD for an A16 in 2018 is akin to paying $1k for a Sony Beta Max in 1974.

 

[Fox1977]

However, you also have to consider the possibility that the new ridiculous trend in the ever-rising prices of these hi-end audio equipment, is, in itself, just that--ridiculous!,and ridiculously gratuitous, in that it is based not on any real production costs or genuine rising standards in audio quality, but on sheer greed, price-gouging, and (given the incidence of diminishing returns in each of these areas of audio consumption, of which almost everyone is aware) the overhyping of largely overrated claims of improvement in quality, not to mention the readiness, and even eagerness of enough hobbyists to pay for such hyped up claims...

Indeed, prices of hifi devices can grow to extreme prices that are also puzzling me sometimes... I can understand that a 10,000$ pair of headphones sounds better than a 1,000$ pair, but is the difference in sound worth such a 10-time price ratio ? It's the same with speakers that cost tens of thousands... I'm not judging, if they sell such expensives products, it is because there is a market for it.
Prices tend to grow as long as people are willing to accept these prices increases. It's like Apple with iPhones. As long as people are happy to buy more and more expensive phones, why would Apple stop increasing prices ?? They'd be dumb to... and they must be right since they keep earning more and more money. The technology of iPhone XS is of course much better than the one that was in iPhone 4, but does it justifiy to sell it nearly twice more ? For TVs for example, every year technology is improving and over the last 10 years, the size of screens have been increasing but yet, prices tend to be rather stable in their categories.

Sorry don't want to pressure you, but have you heard more news from the French dealer, especially when the YouTube video will be posted? Also i want to know if you got the Audeze Mobius, what do you think about them if you tried them.

So far no, he just sent the first of a series of emails describing all the characteristics of the A16. SergioPOE mentioned it a couple of days ago (about the two BRIR that will be included, from the BBC room and the one from the University of Surrey).
I'm also waiting for that video and i'll share it as soon as he uploads it ! He is also a journalist for a french magazine dedicated to home-theater appliances and blu-ray/4k discs (many news and reviews), so he is quite busy.

Your help is much appreciated in this thread community by the way.

I'm just an A16-enthusiast, also frustrated by the long wait, and since i know i'm not the only one, whenever i get some new piece of information from our very active french dealer, i share it here with the non-french-speaking fellows ! Glad to help !

Though the Smythe is the first real product of its kin, if successful, it certainly won't be the last. Other companies will certainly follow on with products at least as good, if not better for lower cost. Paying $4k USD for an A16 in 2018 is akin to paying $1k for a Sony Beta Max in 1974.

You may be right indeed. With the A8, Smyth Research remained alone on this market for over 10 years, but lately binauralization is getting popular and several projects are on. If Creative manages to release a Super X-Fi as good as advertized, it may bring a lot of shadow to Smyth Research.
Though the comparison with Betamax may not be that right, because no matter what comes out, the A16 will stll be doing the job in a few years, while Betamax buyers could not use their device eventually because no more movies were released in that format after a while.

 

[Richter Di]

I understand that the new price can be understandable regarding the technology and the complexity of the A16. When i found out the price on Kickstarter (i ran into it by chance, i hadn't heard of the Kickstarter campaign), there was only 4 pieces left at the cheapest price, so i didn't hesitate long and after VAT and with the second headtracker, i paid around 1150€.
Clearly, at the new price, it would have been a no deal for me. I couldn't spend such a huge sum from the family budget... I'd have kept using Out Of Your Head, dreaming of the A16, and maybe i'd have bought the new Creative product that is supposed to be released by the end of the year (though probably rather in 2019 since there hasn't been news about it for a long while).

Since I followed almost everything around the A8 I somehow did get the info about the A16 Kickstarter and did buy it asap.
So true what you are writing. For 4000 there would be no chance to find and defend the the budget.

Sorry don't want to pressure you, but have you heard more news from the French dealer, especially when the YouTube video will be posted? Also i want to know if you got the Audeze Mobius, what do you think about them if you tried them.
Your help is much appreciated in this thread community by the way.

I got the Audeze Moebius and I heard the A16 in Paris. So allthough not asked, in my opinion the A16 is miles better since the 3D feels real. It does not with the Audeze Moebius. They are good headphones with a lot of white noise but not real 3D.

 

[SergioPOE]

Though the Smythe is the first real product of its kin, if successful, it certainly won't be the last. Other companies will certainly follow on with products at least as good, if not better for lower cost. Paying $4k USD for an A16 in 2018 is akin to paying $1k for a Sony Beta Max in 1974.

The A8 came out what, eight, ten years ago? Everybody gave it rave reviews and yet no other company released anything like it, let alone better. Why would you think that anyone will release a better or cheaper product than the A16?
And the Betamax analogy is simply flawed, unless “surround sound” goes out of business.

 

[Fox1977]

Also i want to know if you got the Audeze Mobius, what do you think about them if you tried them.

I forgot to answer that question. I don't have it nor i ever heard it actually. For now, i guess only the A8/A16 can reproduce really efficient 3D.
I guess only the Out Of My Head software can be an interesting variant for the moment, for those who use HTPC or simply have their computer connected to their TV. I'd say it can compete with A8 (because it's limited to 8 channels) while using BRIR on both sides. A8/A16 will likely produce a better quality sound, but OOYH will cost only a small fraction of the price and still (to me at least) bring a convincing 3D sound. I'd be curious to hear how a PRIR converted to OOYH format would sound. I never did it because it's quite expensive (150$ to get a PRIR converted)... but also because i don't have a PRIR to convert !

 

[VandyMan]

Compared to a lot of two-channel competition, the A16 is fairly priced. I can't think of another DAC/pre-amp that has anything like the complexity, part count, input/output options, or, of course, feature set.

Assuming it is as good as we all hope, I'm sure they will sell plenty off of positive reviews. On the other hand, I agree with those who say the market is limited at that price. Also agree that similar technology is going to come from others at lower price points, eventually.

After the A-16 ships, Smyth needs to bring out a scaled down A-16, at a much lower price. I'd target 2K, since a lot of popular DAC/pre-amps are priced around there.

An even less expensive software-only version would be great too. IMO, an Apple AppStore version priced under $100, would get a ton of mainstream attention and sales, as long as it was easy to use.