Singlepower/Berning Comparison Wanted

[luvdunhill]

I pretty much have my mind made up to purchase a new or used Berning microZOTL. However, in the back of my mind, I'm considering a Singlepower model. I have a few questions along this vein:

Which Singlepower model would be comparable to the Berning microZOTL?

Could anyone compare and contrast the two for me?

Headphones will be Sennheiser 600s and signal chain will be Nottingham Spacedeck -> BAT VK-3i phono card -> headamp -> Senns

Thanks!

 

[mulveling]

That'll be a tough one - not sure too many have owned a SP and a microZOTL, plus there are so many different SP models. The microZOTL hasn't had much discussion on these boards for a couple years.

Personally I think both amps are fantastic; soon a Singlepower SDS (old chassis) and the microZOTL will be the only 2 amps I own. The SDS is better - imaging, soundstage, resolution, separation, air - all that good stuff, but the microZOTL is a champ for the price - very musical, great bass, excellent PRAT, and synergizes with a very WIDE variety of headphones. For the Grado HP2 and AKG K340 it's possibly the best I've heard (at least very close to Melos SHA-Gold Reference on the HP2). Very sweet with the high end AT's like the L3000 and W11jpn. One advantage the microZOTL has over the traditional 3x 6sn7 SP's is output power - it can drive the difficult low impedance cans like the HP2 without problem. My SDS struggles a *little* with HP2 until you use the SLAM adaptors with 5687 output tubes - then the tables are turned with dynamics and tightness superior to that of the microZOTL. Unfortunately I haven't used Sennheiser headphones in quite a while (and my HD600's...have no cable) so I can't give a specific comparison there...

If you're going to be concerned about low impedance headphones in the future, talk to sacd_lover (Earl) about the high power tube options for new Singlepowers - apparently it can be taken even a step beyond the 5687 adaptors.

 

[JzzMaTzz]

I've had my eye on this little amp as well, seems to be an excellent low budget choice for my L3000. Mulveling, how much better is the resolution on the SDS, are we talking like 5%?

 

[luvdunhill]

mulveling:

Thanks for your reply! So, are you saying I'd have to go all the way up the SP line to the SDS? Also, are your running your Berning off the tape-loop of your BAT, or off the line stage portion of the preamp? I'm not even sure what $750 buys in the SP line-up, so I'll probably have to call a retailer tomorrow... any recommendations?

Thanks!

 

[luvdunhill]

well, I ended up ordering a PPX3 SLAM directly from Singlepower! Thanks all! I'm keeping my eye open for a used Berning though, so maybe I'll have more to contribute to this thread down the line.

 

[mulveling]

Hey...
Sorry for the late reply. I've not heard any Singlepowers other than the one I own, so I can't say what part of the line (if any) the microZOTL would be comparable to. I *do* have every confidence that any SP amp will be a great investment. If/when I get another amp, it will be a 2nd SP. The PPX Slam should be awesome, great choice man!

BTW, I'm not running anything off the tape-loop of the BAT; I keep the headphone and speaker rigs in separate rooms - which is why I need a 2nd source

Quote:

Originally Posted by luvdunhill mulveling: Thanks for your reply! So, are you saying I'd have to go all the way up the SP line to the SDS? Also, are your running your Berning off the tape-loop of your BAT, or off the line stage portion of the preamp? I'm not even sure what $750 buys in the SP line-up, so I'll probably have to call a retailer tomorrow... any recommendations? Thanks!

 

[EdipisReks]

i think you'll be very pleased, luvdunhill. i have to say, however, that the microzotl is on my list of amps to buy if i ever see a good used one up for sale when i have the cash.

 

[luvdunhill]

mulveling:

yea, I may be selling my amp/speakers due to a new little-one prowling about, and if so, I'll play with the PPX3 SLAM on both the BAT's line outs and tape loop. Nice thing is, the PPX3 has a nice high input impedance, so it will mate well with the BAT. One bonus, that you may already know, is that both the phono card and tape loop "work" with the preamp off (but plugged in). This is a very nice "feature" that not many people realize, since it allows for one to save tubes when only listening through the tape loop...

 

[dave-the-rave]

I currently own a MicroZotl (which I use with Sony R10's), and I have had a Singlepower MPX3 with some upgrades in house for a 2-week audition a couple of years ago. Speaking generally, the Singlepower was more "romantic" and the Microzotl is more "neutral." That is, the SP sounds "tubier." And darker, whereas I found the Zotl to be more transparent. That said, I think the zotl is a bit more harmonically lean. (This is with Senn 600's, as I've heard both amps with these cans.)

Obviously, you can tube roll and probably move each amp a bit to the "other side," but I stand by my general characterization of each amp.

 

[sacd lover]

Quote:

Originally Posted by dave-the-rave I currently own a MicroZotl (which I use with Sony R10's), and I have had a Singlepower MPX3 with some upgrades in house for a 2-week audition a couple of years ago. Speaking generally, the Singlepower was more "romantic" and the Microzotl is more "neutral." That is, the SP sounds "tubier." And darker, whereas I found the Zotl to be more transparent. That said, I think the zotl is a bit more harmonically lean. (This is with Senn 600's, as I've heard both amps with these cans.) Obviously, you can tube roll and probably move each amp a bit to the "other side," but I stand by my general characterization of each amp.

I would agree with your characterization from a couple years ago when you no doubt used the SP amp with all 6sn7's. But now with the addition of the 5687 and 6bl7gt/6bx7gt output tubes such a charactrization is just no longer accurate. The 5687's are a more neutral and much clearer, faster and more powerful tube. The 6bl7/6bx7 tubes are just as spacious, or more so than the 6sn7's, but with many multiples the power .... and consequently far better dynamics, speed and bass slam. You definitely have to hear the amps with the new output tubes to appreciate just how much the sound quality has evolved and improved.

 

[sacd lover]

Quote:

Originally Posted by luvdunhill mulveling: yea, I may be selling my amp/speakers due to a new little-one prowling about, and if so, I'll play with the PPX3 SLAM on both the BAT's line outs and tape loop. Nice thing is, the PPX3 has a nice high input impedance, so it will mate well with the BAT. One bonus, that you may already know, is that both the phono card and tape loop "work" with the preamp off (but plugged in). This is a very nice "feature" that not many people realize, since it allows for one to save tubes when only listening through the tape loop...

I typically add a loop out on my SP amps for a similar benefit. I then can use my best source to drive two SP amps .... or the SP amp followed by my preamp.

 

[braillediver]

I'm using the Berning with an external power supply and that makes for a nice upgrade.

I'm really impressed with the Berning micro-ZOTL's performance. It's a fun, versatile amp.


Mitch

 

[Hirsch]

The MicroZOTL used to be my reference amp, which was finally replaced by EAR HP4 and the first Singlepower Supra. In direct comparison at the time, the Supra actually had a similar sound to the ZOTL, but the Supra had greater transparency and a much stronger bass response. The ZOTL always had an "ethereal" nature to the sound. Gorgeous, and IMO much better than most, but never really convinced me at the bottom end. The Supra simply stripped away that signature, and sounded like whatever tubes I put into it. I'm still unable to characterize the sound of the amp, since it will take on the character of the tubes, and impose very little of itself. It was also a relief to me to hear the music without the coloration imposed by the HP4's transformer outputs. I eventually sold the ZOTL, then the HP4, and I haven't looked back.

That said, some of the most fun I've had with headphones has been with the MicroZOTL, and I'd still own one if Mikhail hadn't raised the bar (and kept raising it again and again

). The "ZOLT" (quoting the late Harvey Rosenberg's review from the late Listener magazine) is a great little amp.

 

[JzzMaTzz]

Thanks for the reply's guys, you headfiers are sure a helpful bunch

 

[jp11801]

Single power amps are really great but in a dollar for dollar comparision I like the ZOTL on the used market they are 500-550 I think you have to spend a bit more even used for a SP to beat that. Again the single power amps are great but the ZOTL wins for me in a dollar value.
Also with the Senns I'd probably want a leaner amp.