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Sennheiser HD650 & Massdrop HD6XX Impressions Thread

Discussion in 'Headphones (full-size)' started by tangsta, Sep 24, 2006.
  1. DavidA
    My LCD-2f is a bit brighter than my HD6XX and HD650, its one of the original fazor models from 2014 and its peak is more around 5-6khz since it doesn't bother me like the HD600 that I had. This is another reason that I didn't send my LCD-2f to get the updated 2016 drivers since I much prefer mine as is even if it lacks the bass of the revised drivers but if either side ever dies on my then they will be replace with the newer 2016 version.

    My HD650 is just a touch easier to listen to than my HD6XX since its a touch more rolled off in the treble but its very subtle and if you don't listen to both side by side you'll never notice the difference and one could consider it "manufacturing tolerance" but since Sennheiser has pretty good QC I think there are very slight differences, almost like the HD6XX is made with drivers that were rejected from the HD650 due to being slightly out of spec.
  2. SilverEars
    I don't know if we're talking about the same frequencies. LOL. Because LCD2s shouldn't have peaks in those regions.

    If my HD6XX was out of spec or tolerance, it turned out in a good way I realized. They should make em all out of tolerance like mine. LOL
    Last edited: Oct 3, 2018
    DavidA likes this.
  3. DavidA
    When one talks about LCD-2 headphones its important to get the correct version: 2, 2.1, 2.2, 2014 fazor, and 2016 fazor since they all sound quite different
    I think its my LCD-2F that is the weird one, LOL
  4. Pharmaboy
    I own (and love) a pre-fazor LCD-2.1, one of the original production run w/the funky foam on inside of the headband. I also own a heavily modded HD650 (out for add'l mods at the moment) & have heard a stock HD650 at length in my system, comparing it to the LCD-2.1 and other headphones. Finally, I've also heard a 2016 vintage LCD-2 fazor at length in my system, though not in comparison to any Senn...

    I hear relatively little similarity between the various Audeze & HD650s. There is a very approximate similarity in tonality/frequency range between the LCD-2.1 and the HD650s, but even that is deceptive, since the 2.1 has way more (yet flat/neutral sounding) sub-bass + some high treble the HD650 doesn't have. The soundstaging is sorta/kinda similar, but only in the sense that it's relatively close to the head & not expansive.

    Everything else (planar vs dynamic driver; comfort/fit; weight; performance w/various music genres) is pretty different.

    IMO, the modded HD650 ("J-Mod") and LCD-2.1 pre-fazor are both total keepers, necessary to my evolving appreciation of headphone audio.
    DavidA likes this.
  5. SilverEars
    Something I've noticed is planars tend to have wall of sound compared to a dynamic like HD6XX which does sound wider with a bit depth when it comes to location of sounds. So I find one of the big strong suit of Sennheiser dynamics is imaging (it won't be directional like speakers, but no headphone is) with it's open dynamic nature.

    Interesting thing somebody pointed out is dynamic driver is more like a point source as it images better.

    I think for rock, the bass response is fine with heft, although it may not extend like certain planars, but the dynamic mids more than makes up for it.

    I think with certain tracks with well extended bass, the subs comes into play, and there are recording types that do and do not. Electronic genre I notice more interesting sounds with subs, and planars do a really good job of it.
    Last edited: Oct 3, 2018
  6. Pharmaboy
    I find that planars launch notes in a subtly different way than dynamics. I hear dynamic drivers as somewhat less precise, less silent/black between notes. Planar drivers start at zero, rise to full note volume instantly, then are silent again. Even the best dynamics seem to want to ring for a beat or two before becoming silent again. Can't emphasize how subtle this stuff is in a full range driver. I hear it because I became aware of it, now listen for it.

    This is somewhat easier to hear in full range speakers, where a planar magnetic driver (typically used for mids & treble only) will sound quite a bit "faster" and more precise than all but the very best dynamic midrange/tweeters.

    As for imaging, I'm just not sure whether dynamics are that different from planars. Think that may have more to do with the earcup/enclosure shape, dimension, and dampening applied.
  7. Deftone

    Going to spend a week with balanced then go back to the SE and see how I feel about changes if any.

    As far as I know for CMA400i; SE 100mw @300ohm and Balanced 400mw @300ohm
    prymortal, trellus and HungryPanda like this.
  8. prymortal
    i tried that last week with the HD6XX & jotunhiem then back to The Element, only difference i noticed was Dac tone which i confirmed via the outputiing from Jot to Element input (because the 6.3aux is broken on the Jot). I'm interested to see what differences you notice.
    Deftone likes this.
  9. Deftone
    I wasn’t going to talk about sound just yet because I haven’t had long enough to compare between SE and balanced but, went with balanced straight away and I don’t know if it’s the current mode class A but wow the grip it has on the HD650s bass is phenomenal, completely effortless and impressive impact.

    I think the Valhalla 2 was the worst I’ve heard 650. I haven’t tried a Jotenheim.
    Last edited: Oct 6, 2018
  10. prymortal
    I personally don't recommend it, to me the balanced Dac sounds off, certain tones not right tried output & input'ing to The Element so i know its correct & off even on MP3, WAV & Flac songs. Distortion shines through at high volume low & high gain & not in a good way, Amp supposed to be powerful but i don't find that to really be the case the balanced out has some power you can tell that but The Element seems to do a better job powering the headphones & without the distortion.

    I didn't notice a change in bass but i suspect its due to coming from a DAC thats 0-48khz set up to the Jotunheim & The Element at the same time both are 20hz-20khz, I noticed the bass when I went to The Element first & i'd say it was much the same on the Jot balanced to my ears. I guess I might have to revist it now i've got more experiance with the bass change.
    I did notice going from 0-48khz to 20hz-20khz the change in highs & trebles got more a veil on it & not as harsh on the 660s but the 650s all i noticed was the bass change.
  11. Deftone
    Thanks I’ll take note of that, Initially I had 650s at the start of the year and thought they were offensively harsh but it turned out to be bad amp matching, the Valhalla 2 (one of the most recommended OTL) particularly was too bright and grainy. I tried the element and O2 a few years back they seemed decent for the money. I recommend you demo a questyle amp if possible. Cheers
  12. Deftone
    Today I've been playing around with the dip switches of my 400i and doing a bit of comparing between balanced and single ended and i felt like i needed to talk about what i found out early.

    (SE low gain) smooth delicate sound, hitting around 1 - 2 oclock on volume, sounds good but not as good as expected.

    (SE high gain) sounds the same just a tad louder, nothing really stands out, volume dropped to 12 oclock.

    (Balance low gain) volume now at 11, bass sounds a tad punchier and more dyanmic, can hear the cymbals little more clearly and has a sharper edge, small upgrade.

    (Balance High gain) Boom! instant smile creeps up my face, clarity boost (famous sennheiser veil gone?) bass much tighter and cymbals even clearer but treble still not harsh.

    At this point its a bit of shock and im rushing through my tracks to hear them differently.
  13. DavidA
    @Deftone, I tried looking for specs on the CMA400i but couldn't find much, do you know what is the output impedance on low or high gain and if its the same for both balanced and SE?
  14. Deftone
    I don’t know either I have been trying to find out myself, all I did find is...

    Max output power
    106mW @ 300 Ohms / 980mW @ 32 Ohms via normal headphone jack

    418mW @ 300 Ohms / 3920mW @ 32 Ohms via the balanced headphone jack.

    Low gain 1.1X - High gain 2.5X

    Isnt max power handling for 650 500mw?
    Last edited: Oct 9, 2018
  15. DavidA
    I was trying to find the output impedance since I've noticed that it can have a noticeable effect on how the HD650 sounds. And lower/lowest is not always best since I find that my BH Crack is one of the better pairings and its output impedance is around 75ohm which is a bit less than what many consider to be "ideal" ratio of 1/8th or more. The more time I've been in this hobby I've found that "power or watts" don't mean much to me on how a headphone/amp pairing will sound but it seems to be the "synergy" between an amp and headphone that is the key to how an amp and headphone paired together will sound.
    trellus likes this.

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