[Jmitchell]

Would you consider the 660s or 650 in any way technically superior to the 600 or is it just a matter of sound signature?

HD600 has the best bass in terms of texture and less dirty and more peaky upper mids. Apart from that both HD650/HD600 are the superior headphone. The HD700’s drivers thrown in the new product aren’t as capable.

 

[DavidA]

Would you consider the 660s or 650 in any way technically superior to the 600 or is it just a matter of sound signature?

While I haven't heard the HD660S yet I've owned the HD600 (sold), HD650 and a new HD6XX, to me its a matter of sound signature but also the gear that you will use them with. The HD660S being 150ohms will be easier to drive properly with lesser gear compared to the HD600/650 having a 300ohm impedance.

If you want what most consider a "neutral" sounding headphone then the HD600 is probably you best choice but if you like a more relaxing sound then the HD650 would be the better choice, or the almost identical HD6XX for even cheaper. One thing that you should consider is what are your favorite genres of music? how loud (dB level) do you listen at? and what support gear (amps) you have since these will affect how you perceive each headphone.

FWIW I replaced my HD600 with a custom Ypsilon driver build and couldn't be happier since it sounds great even from my crappy Galaxy S5 or low end Fiio X1 DAP, is very light and with the larger G-pads are quite comfortable and to some look nicer:

 

[bosiemoncrieff]

I listened to the 660, 650, and 800S today at Sennheiser SF and point number 1 is that the biatches over in Wedemark can't do schiit for digital to analog conversion like the boys down in Newhall. The delta-sigma chips in HVD820 are bright, strident, and sibilant. I'd sooner skip the amp entirely and run HD600 out of my bifrost multibit than suffer Sennheiser's incompetent chain for $2400.

That said, HD660 is to my ears a step down from HD600/50. I was hoping that it would present a "best of" the two audiophile lines: the naturalness of tone of HD600 series and the accuracy of HD7/800 series. Unfortunately it seems to have achieved neither. The mids are schiit, utter schiit. Someone threw a blanket over them. Vocals in particular are recessed and veiled. The bass is a little more prominent. The treble is as sharp as HD700 or sharper. Out of 820, the entire experience was one of confusion and mystification. HD600 and 800, and yes I might be biased, are to my ears the best that the company has done short of electrostatics. The 600 series gets worse as its numbers increase, but I respect 650 in a way that I do not respect 660. 650’s excessive sweetness is not to my taste but not unpleasant. I find 660 distinctly unpleasant. Out of a Sennheiser chain it is positively painful.

 

[DavidA]

I listened to the 660, 650, and 800S today at Sennheiser SF and point number 1 is that the biatches over in Wedemark can't do schiit for digital to analog conversion like the boys down in Newhall. The delta-sigma chips in HVD820 are bright, strident, and sibilant. I'd sooner skip the amp entirely and run HD600 out of my bifrost multibit than suffer Sennheiser's incompetent chain for $2400.

That said, HD660 is to my ears a step down from HD660. I was hoping that it would present a "best of" the two audiophile lines: the naturalness of tone of HD600 series and the accuracy of HD7/800 series. Unfortunately it seems to have achieved neither. The mids are schiit, utter schiit. Someone threw a blanket over them. Vocals in particular are recessed and veiled. The bass is a little more prominent. The treble is as sharp as HD700 or sharper. Out of 820, the entire experience was one of confusion and mystification. HD600 and 800, and yes I might be biased, are to my ears the best that the company has done short of electrostatics.

which is the step down? 600, 650 or 660S

 

[bosiemoncrieff]

Edited sorry for errors. Scotch mod hampered my proofreading

 

[DavidA]

Edited sorry for errors. Scotch mod hampered my proofreading

A nice red does wonders for my proof reading, LOL

 

[L8MDL]

HD600 has the best bass in terms of texture and less dirty and more peaky upper mids. Apart from that both HD650/HD600 are the superior headphone. The HD700’s drivers thrown in the new product aren’t as capable.

You obviously haven't listened to the HD660S. My 600's are now retired.

 

[Jmitchell]

You obviously haven't listened to the HD660S. My 600's are now retired.

Well I own them....what a stupid thing to say.

 

[god-bluff]

Let's see in 20 years where those HD660s fit in the great scheme of things

(Edit... Meaning the HD600 is pretty faultless and if something ain't broke then it don't need fixing. I think the 660 seems a bit of a parts bin mongrel, a phone of the month at present and has a long way to go before it can prove itself as an enduring Classic a la 600)

 

[ScOgLiO]

Wow. I finally had a chance at scratching the surface of (ok, maybe mid-level) high fidelity audio!
My girlfriend was lovely enough to indulge my interest in the HD600 with an amazing graduation gift
Well, got my M.Sc. diploma, got back home and plugged them into my Magni 3...again: wow!
Yes, it's been a while since I had a chance at listening to open-back cans and was "limited" to listening to my HD25 II for quite a while, so my impressions are biased by coming from a closed-back, bass-heavy headphone, but still...what an amazing sound. The instrument separation is awesome, the soundstage is wide and the detail is mindblowing.

I listened to anything and everything in this first encounter with the new Senns, but really I thought I couldn't miss the occasion to go for a live album and experience something new. So I went with "Alchemy" by Dire Straits, i.e. one of my favourite lives from my favourite band ever...I'm repeating myself: wow.
"Once upon a time in the West" kicks in and I'm in the front seat: I hear the roaring crowd just behind me, then the magnificent guitar by Mark Knopfler shakes me, right in front. The thump of the drums is detailed and not lacking at all. The mid and high sections are just sublime: Mark's rather raucous voice is superbly reproduced and the guitars get the importance they deserve in a Dire Straits' track.
"Sultans of Swing" just blows me away for the incredible separation between the instruments and a level of detail that I have never experienced in years of adorement and awe to such a masterpiece. I could distinctively detect the keyboard accompaining the legendary final solo, just beside me at my right, with astonishing clarity and that, given I was transported by Knopfler's unrivalled guitar in the meanwhile, is really saying something.

While I was browsing through my FLAC library I also came across Orjan Nilsen's "Go Fast!" and I have to say I was not disappointed at all: the HD25 II is on paper the best headphone for the job (relatively high-BPM trance track), but the HD600 gave me detail I thought was not present at all in the track and was stong enough in the bass section to make me move!
Overall, I didn't find the HD600 "fatiguing" at all, but rather I was particularly amazed at how well it can reproduce cymbals: simply astonishing, crisp and detailed sound.

I know a lot of you hardcore head-fiers will read at this post thinking "LOL, look at the newbie marvelling for his new mid-tier cans" but hell, I'm enjoying it an aweful lot, even if it's not a hi-end setup. I get there are many other steps in the road to hi-fi, but to me this was a huge leap towards it!

 

[DavidA]

@ScOgLiO, you have a really nice GF

 

[DogMeat]

Wow. I finally had a chance at scratching the surface of (ok, maybe mid-level) high fidelity audio!
My girlfriend was lovely enough to indulge my interest in the HD600 with an amazing graduation gift
Well, got my M.Sc. diploma, got back home and plugged them into my Magni 3...again: wow!
Yes, it's been a while since I had a chance at listening to open-back cans and was "limited" to listening to my HD25 II for quite a while, so my impressions are biased by coming from a closed-back, bass-heavy headphone, but still...what an amazing sound. The instrument separation is awesome, the soundstage is wide and the detail is mindblowing.

I listened to anything and everything in this first encounter with the new Senns, but really I thought I couldn't miss the occasion to go for a live album and experience something new. So I went with "Alchemy" by Dire Straits, i.e. one of my favourite lives from my favourite band ever...I'm repeating myself: wow.
"Once upon a time in the West" kicks in and I'm in the front seat: I hear the roaring crowd just behind me, then the magnificent guitar by Mark Knopfler shakes me, right in front. The thump of the drums is detailed and not lacking at all. The mid and high sections are just sublime: Mark's rather raucous voice is superbly reproduced and the guitars get the importance they deserve in a Dire Straits' track.
"Sultans of Swing" just blows me away for the incredible separation between the instruments and a level of detail that I have never experienced in years of adorement and awe to such a masterpiece. I could distinctively detect the keyboard accompaining the legendary final solo, just beside me at my right, with astonishing clarity and that, given I was transported by Knopfler's unrivalled guitar in the meanwhile, is really saying something.

While I was browsing through my FLAC library I also came across Orjan Nilsen's "Go Fast!" and I have to say I was not disappointed at all: the HD25 II is on paper the best headphone for the job (relatively high-BPM trance track), but the HD600 gave me detail I thought was not present at all in the track and was stong enough in the bass section to make me move!
Overall, I didn't find the HD600 "fatiguing" at all, but rather I was particularly amazed at how well it can reproduce cymbals: simply astonishing, crisp and detailed sound.

I know a lot of you hardcore head-fiers will read at this post thinking "LOL, look at the newbie marvelling for his new mid-tier cans" but hell, I'm enjoying it an aweful lot, even if it's not a hi-end setup. I get there are many other steps in the road to hi-fi, but to me this was a huge leap towards it!

There are plenty of "hardcore Head-Fi-ers" who think that the HD600 is one of the nicest set of headphones out there, especially the higher impedance cans,(when amplified correctly), and who do appreciate their neutrality and detail,much as do you.
There are threads, like this one,dedicated to them.
I am one such individual, who has spent plenty on "better" headphones... but I find myself enjoying my Senns, pretty much loving the 600s above the other Senns, quite often, and choosing them for certain musics that they just do justice to better than pretty much anything else.
I am glad that you love them and I hope that they will always hold a special place in your heart.
To me these cans are special in the same way that the original RS-1 remains special,(and with a superlative sound that many consider that Grado has never matched), in the Grado line.

Congrats on your acquisition, and CONGRATS on the sheer, pure joy of discovering what GOOD sounding gear really gives to you. A lot of people think we are crazy for seeking that..... that joy says we're not.
It's like a epiphany or something.
I hope you always have such joy in what you hear and in your HeadFi journey....



....and a pretty deep wallet.
(once you get school paid off, LOL)


oh. p.s. CONGRATS on finishing your degree!

 

[ScOgLiO]

@ScOgLiO, you have a really nice GF

Oh yeah, I sure am very lucky

There are plenty of "hardcore Head-Fi-ers" who think that the HD600 is one of the nicest set of headphones out there, especially the higher impedance cans,(when amplified correctly), and who do appreciate their neutrality and detail,much as do you.
There are threads, like this one,dedicated to them.
I am one such individual, who has spent plenty on "better" headphones... but I find myself enjoying my Senns, pretty much loving the 600s above the other Senns, quite often, and choosing them for certain musics that they just do justice to better than pretty much anything else.
I am glad that you love them and I hope that they will always hold a special place in your heart.
To me these cans are special in the same way that the original RS-1 remains special,(and with a superlative sound that many consider that Grado has never matched), in the Grado line.

I get the HD600 is pretty much legendary (it's been around this planet almost as much as me LOL) and this very thread shows just that.
Still, I imagined they wouldn't be the end game for many who decide to go for the big guns (well, adding a final zero on the price tag), but it's nice to see they represent a great alternative to that world.
I surely seem to appreciate my 600s and now actually understand why they're considered as reference sound by quite a few fellas

Congrats on your acquisition, and CONGRATS on the sheer, pure joy of discovering what GOOD sounding gear really gives to you. A lot of people think we are crazy for seeking that..... that joy says we're not.
It's like a epiphany or something.
I hope you always have such joy in what you hear and in your HeadFi journey....

Yes, they were pretty much a revelation to me. Again, I was coming from a completely different kind of headphones, so every difference in the sound was very easy to catch and enjoy. Still, I bet I will find more in the days to come, when I'll dig into my music collection a bit more.
It's sometimes hard to explain why we want to buy new gear ("you alredy have headphones, why would you want another pair?" LOL), especially at prices most people can't even associate to stuff one uses to listen to music, given there are incredibly cheaper alternatives (sorry for always going back to the money aspect, guess that's what studying economics does to you ).
But hey, I just feel sorry for their ears, because they can't understand the marvel at catching new details, especially for the first time.

....and a pretty deep wallet.
(once you get school paid off, LOL)

Yeah, that pretty much sums it up haha
Luckily, as a European, my uni was incredible good value for money (tuition fees are heavily lowered by public and private donors) and I don't have any debts to pay, so...extra money for new audio gear, I guess

oh. p.s. CONGRATS on finishing your degree!

Thanks, very kind of you

 

[egokun]

So guys, I'm thinking about the HD600.

In the past I tried the HD650 and found it way too mellow and laid-back for my taste. Also I probably didn't have a capable enough amp to drive it fully, but the sound signature wasn't my cup of tea.
Sometime later, I had the chance to audition the HD600 in a store, coupled with an amp. It sounded incredibly good. Crisp, clear, with pleasant bass, and not at all recessed. I'm used to associating "neutral" with "cold and unengaging", but a properly-amped HD600 apparently sounds nothing like that!

So now this is my question. If I got an HD600, what amp should I get for it?
I'm not willing to spend too much, so I'm looking for something that's preferably below 200 Euro and easily available in Europe with a good return policy.
Also, if that's possible, I'd like to use the same amp for my Audio Technica ATH-AD2000, which is quite a different beast.
Source would be a laptop PC/Mac, or my iPod Touch.

Thanks!

 

[DavidA]

So guys, I'm thinking about the HD600.

In the past I tried the HD650 and found it way too mellow and laid-back for my taste. Also I probably didn't have a capable enough amp to drive it fully, but the sound signature wasn't my cup of tea.
Sometime later, I had the chance to audition the HD600 in a store, coupled with an amp. It sounded incredibly good. Crisp, clear, with pleasant bass, and not at all recessed. I'm used to associating "neutral" with "cold and unengaging", but a properly-amped HD600 apparently sounds nothing like that!

So now this is my question. If I got an HD600, what amp should I get for it?
I'm not willing to spend too much, so I'm looking for something that's preferably below 200 Euro and easily available in Europe with a good return policy.
Also, if that's possible, I'd like to use the same amp for my Audio Technica ATH-AD2000, which is quite a different beast.
Source would be a laptop PC/Mac, or my iPod Touch.

Thanks!

I don't know of many amps under 200 euro that will drive the HD600 well but its not something that I've really looked into. I would think that the MassDrop CTH or LCX might just be under the 200 euro range but I haven't heard them yet and availability in Europe might be a problem. If you don't want to deal with amps there are a few other headphones that might interest you like the HE400i or for me a custom Ypsilon driver build which replaced my HD600 and took everything I liked about the HD600 and improved on it but since they are DIY and not exactly cheap at $300-400 for parts its not something everyone would consider.