[martinrajdl]

I think a lot of people join these forums to get feedback on their gear because there are always others who have more experience with said gear, or know specs better etc. A lot of times too, we second guess whether or not we are getting the most from our equipment. It's very true tho that the question gets asked a LOT. Shoot I asked a few questions early on that had been "asked & answered time again" when I got into audio. We all need a little "reinforcement" at times lol. We are a social creature.

Heh, that's true. I hope I didn't make it sound like I have an issue with that, because I don't. I ask impossible to answer (stupid even) questions ALL THE TIME and all, but I think due to the fact that so many people in the community own these headphones, the question gets thrown around A LOT. 

 

[Argyris]

  Heh, that's true. I hope I didn't make it sound like I have an issue with that, because I don't. I ask impossible to answer (stupid even) questions ALL THE TIME and all, but I think due to the fact that so many people in the community own these headphones, the question gets thrown around A LOT. 

 
We should have a sticky system of some kind that makes the first posts of every page of the HD 600 thread say the following:
 
No, contrary to what you may have read elsewhere, it's NOT true that even the combined efforts of Chuck Norris and James Mattis cannot drive the HD 600. It's actually not that hard. If both A) and B) are true:
 
A) Your extant or prospective source produces enough amplitude without forcing you to max out the volume pot
 
B) You're not hearing excessive background noise or obvious distortion
 
...then you're properly driving the HD 600. Congratulations! You can stop there if you like, or you can go down the rabbit hole that is the personal listening hobby (see most of Head-Fi for more information). If you're unsure if your current source will work, or if you're looking for something you know for sure will work, here's a (non-exhaustive!) list of equipment to consider:
 
<insert list here>

 

[U-3C]

   
We should have a sticky system of some kind that makes the first posts of every page of the HD 600 thread say the following:
 
No, contrary to what you may have read elsewhere, it's NOT true that even the combined efforts of Chuck Norris and James Mattis cannot drive the HD 600. It's actually not that hard. If both A) and B) are true:
 
A) Your extant or prospective source produces enough amplitude without forcing you to max out the volume pot
 
B) You're not hearing excessive background noise or obvious distortion
 
...then you're properly driving the HD 600. Congratulations! You can stop there if you like, or you can go down the rabbit hole that is the personal listening hobby (see most of Head-Fi for more information). If you're unsure if your current source will work, or if you're looking for something you know for sure will work, here's a (non-exhaustive!) list of equipment to consider:
 
<insert list here>

 
 
Lol.
 
First things in the list:

1. Woo Audio WA22: because you paid so much, you wouldn't dare say it doesn't sound good.
 

---

 
But then there is the ever annoying "driving loud doesn't mean it's driving well" argument that is thrown on whoever that mentions A) and B), and newcomers who have no idea who to trust will automatically listen to the new voice, mainly because this person is screaming to correct a statement, so that means the person must know more! Also, because the common belief that 300 ohms are impossible to drive, how can one person possibly say the HD600 are easy to drive? How dare a person say that when everybody says otherwise?
 
A while ago, I mentioned A) and B) to someone who is struggling to buy an amp and was immediately attacked. The attacker then claims that it is such a common problem where almost everyone thinks that driving something loud without distortion means it is driven well, even though it is not the case. I almost wonder where the person is hanging out for his/her audio discussions as my experience is almost the opposite, with me being one of the few people who claims A) and B). ^.^
 
The person then started to throw out pseudoscience claims that...technically is backing up exactly what I am talking about???!! 

 

 

[Argyris]

Without getting into the science aspect of it, I just throw it out there like this: you can believe me, or you can believe the people who say you need to spend hundreds or thousands in additional expense. If you go with them, you might conclude you've found sonic gold you couldn't have otherwise, but if you go with me, you'll save a lot of money!
 
It's everybody's personal call.

 

[snapacap]

Hy guys , i drive the hd 600 with a denon dac 300 usb connected via rca to the bravo ocean as preamp connected via rca to the smsl sapII. Is enough ?? Thanks

Technically, if they get loud enough, you are driving them... I can say that both of those amps don't have the greatest extension, and aren't the clearest. I suspect you could get more clarity and extension with a single, higher power amp.
 
The reality is that powering headphones comes down to preference. For example: I actually like my HD700 more on my Fiio e10 than on my Project Polaris.

 

[DecentLevi]

Hello guys, I just got a pair of HD-600's and am really in need of a bit of advice:
 
Firstly I should mention that I initially got a pair of HD-600's last week that were made around 2011 and extensively burned in. The sound was basically perfect to me: smooth, dynamic, well extended and non-fatiguing highs. However I had to replace this one because it also had a considerable amount of distortion mostly on the left channel on certain bass frequencies at anything over a medium volume.
 
So incoming today was my replacement - another used HD-600 that looked in mint condition on the eBay listing. Actual photos:
 



 
Already having suspicions of the manufacture date due to the odd appearance of this plastic Sennheiser box shown above, I looked thru the packet to discover it was made in October 2006! (with "fabr- nr. 153681" on the outside of the plastic box). The seller seemed either very un-knowledgeable with headphones or was playing dumb when I inquired about it, saying he doesn't know when it was made and didn't remember how often it was used, but very infrequently. I believe he was telling the truth though because the clamping force is still quite firm and all the pads and everything are completely blemish free. Physically comparing it to my other one (that I'm about to send back) from around 2011, I was surprised to see that both have identical design / colors, etc. including the silver voice coil (which I was told is the newest version), and both say "made in Ireland" inside the headband.
 
So here's the hitch: the 'newer' one sounds more shrill, piercing and sharp on the top end, dynamics that manage to be both harsher yet don't 'slam' as hard, and overall voicing that can only be described as moderately lush / fierce / uncontrolled; whereas the 'older' HD-600 sounded more smooth, dynamic and mellowed out on the top.
 
Those are the differences I heard after a critical A/B comparison of the old to the new HD-600, using the exact same source chain with same volume, exact same cable and same loop of several test tracks. So my question is:
- Would any amount of burn in be able to get the 'newer' HD-600 to sound identical to the 'older' one?
   If yes: about how long and what kind of volume is recommended?
- Or would it be likely that the driver of the newer pair is so different that they will never sound the same?
 
NOTE:
when I refer to "newer" I am actually referring to the 2006 pair, as it seems not to have been burned in yet;
by "older" I am actually referring to the 2011 version which has extensive burn-in.
 
I would actually be somewhat surprised if burn-in could make the older pair that's not burned in sound drastically different enough to be more similar to the newer one that is burned in (to make the 2006 pair sound equal to the 2011 pair), because for example with my HD-650, I don't think I'm noticing any changes save for the mods I've done, after at least 2,000 hrs. over 2 years. 
 
THANKS-a-million! 

 

 

[Argyris]

 

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!

Hello guys, I just got a pair of HD-600's and am really in need of a bit of advice:
 
Firstly I should mention that I initially got a pair of HD-600's last week that were made around 2011 and extensively burned in. The sound was basically perfect to me: smooth, dynamic, well extended and non-fatiguing highs. However I had to replace this one because it also had a considerable amount of distortion mostly on the left channel on certain bass frequencies at anything over a medium volume.
 
So incoming today was my replacement - another used HD-600 that looked in mint condition on the eBay listing. Actual photos:
 



 
Already having suspicions of the manufacture date due to the odd appearance of this plastic Sennheiser box shown above, I looked thru the packet to discover it was made in October 2006! (with "fabr- nr. 153681" on the outside of the plastic box). The seller seemed either very un-knowledgeable with headphones or was playing dumb when I inquired about it, saying he doesn't know when it was made and didn't remember how often it was used, but very infrequently. I believe he was telling the truth though because the clamping force is still quite firm and all the pads and everything are completely blemish free. Physically comparing it to my other one (that I'm about to send back) from around 2011, I was surprised to see that both have identical design / colors, etc. including the silver voice coil (which I was told is the newest version), and both say "made in Ireland" inside the headband.
 
So here's the hitch: the 'newer' one sounds more shrill, piercing and sharp on the top end, dynamics that manage to be both harsher yet don't 'slam' as hard, and overall voicing that can only be described as moderately lush / fierce / uncontrolled; whereas the 'older' HD-600 sounded more smooth, dynamic and mellowed out on the top.
 
Those are the differences I heard after a critical A/B comparison of the old to the new HD-600, using the exact same source chain with same volume, exact same cable and same loop of several test tracks. So my question is:
- Would any amount of burn in be able to get the 'newer' HD-600 to sound identical to the 'older' one?
   If yes: about how long and what kind of volume is recommended?
- Or would it be likely that the driver of the newer pair is so different that they will never sound the same?
 
NOTE:
when I refer to "newer" I am actually referring to the 2006 pair, as it seems not to have been burned in yet;
by "older" I am actually referring to the 2011 version which has extensive burn-in.
 
I would actually be somewhat surprised if burn-in could make the older pair that's not burned in sound drastically different enough to be more similar to the newer one that is burned in (to make the 2006 pair sound equal to the 2011 pair), because for example with my HD-650, I don't think I'm noticing any changes save for the mods I've done, after at least 2,000 hrs. over 2 years. 
 
THANKS-a-million! 

 

 

 
Burn in has very subtle effects, if it has any at all. I'll be upfront and say I'm a skeptic of the phenomenon in general, but nonetheless all but the most ardent believers (in magic, mind) will tell you that no amount of burn in is going to reverse a noticeably audible difference like that. What it sounds like is the second unit you received has a more prodigious presence peak (~3.5 kHz). All HD 600s have emphasis here to some degree (it's one of the things Sennheiser changed for the HD 650, as I'm sure as an owner you know), but lately we've been hearing from a few posters that, in direct comparison, some units have it to a greater degree than others.

I wish there were something else I could say. It's always a bummer when you get something that isn't what you expected or feel it should have been, especially when you had something that satisfied your requirements but couldn't be kept for one reason or another.
 
Not to make things worse, but I'm curious. On the first pair (before you returned it), did you check for foreign matter (e.g. hair) on the distorting driver? If it's one thing I've learned after being in this hobby for years, it's that hair has astounding penetrating powers. Within a week of owning my HD 600 (bought new in June 2016) a hair had already burrowed its way through the foam and was producing an intermittent buzzing sound. I took the pad and foam off, figuring there was no way it could possibly be just a hair causing all the racket, but lo and behold there it was. It's happened several times since. The HD 6x0 design seems particularly prone to it.

 

[DecentLevi]

Thanks for the tips. I actually examined the drivers of both pairs without the pads and removed a bit of hair on the faulty one from 2011, but to no effect so the drivers must have been partially blown out from loud volumes. I'm thinking to try overnight burn-in of the 2006 pair with my Liquid Carbon amp (in balanced mode just in case that extra 'powah' may speed the process up) for maybe up to a week, then see if I notice improvements for the better, then otherwise just look for a newer pair.
 
Is there any consensus about which mfg. date of the HD-600's have the 'best' sound, or at least on which ones have different sonic attributes in some way? Or is the newest one better sounding? ... this is all of course speculation that there were variations in drivers used over the years.

 

[bosiemoncrieff]

  Thanks for the tips. I actually examined the drivers of both pairs without the pads and removed a bit of hair on the faulty one from 2011, but to no effect so the drivers must have been partially blown out from loud volumes. I'm thinking to try overnight burn-in of the 2006 pair with my Liquid Carbon amp (in balanced mode just in case that extra 'powah' may speed the process up) for maybe up to a week, then see if I notice improvements for the better, then otherwise just look for a newer pair.
 
Is there any consensus about which mfg. date of the HD-600's have the 'best' sound, or at least on which ones have different sonic attributes in some way? Or is the newest one better sounding? ... this is all of course speculation that there were variations in drivers used over the years.

This is the first I'm hearing of this. I know HD800 started off "fuller" and then became more "airy" (still not sure which mine is, though I think it's "fuller"); K1000 likewise went from bass-heavy to bass-light. 
 
I always thought of HD600 as the default entry-level all-purpose mid-fi can that punched well above its price and sounds good 16 years later.

 

[DecentLevi]

Yeah I'm only speculating that there may have been variations in drivers on the HD-600. But if none I would think burn-in should equalise the two. BTW looks like my 'burned in' pair was actually from 2012-2013 - I wonder what else may make it sound so different from the 2006 pair that was rarely used? And any advice about burn-in time?

 

[DavidA]

  Thanks for the tips. I actually examined the drivers of both pairs without the pads and removed a bit of hair on the faulty one from 2011, but to no effect so the drivers must have been partially blown out from loud volumes. I'm thinking to try overnight burn-in of the 2006 pair with my Liquid Carbon amp (in balanced mode just in case that extra 'powah' may speed the process up) for maybe up to a week, then see if I notice improvements for the better, then otherwise just look for a newer pair.
 
Is there any consensus about which mfg. date of the HD-600's have the 'best' sound, or at least on which ones have different sonic attributes in some way? Or is the newest one better sounding? ... this is all of course speculation that there were variations in drivers used over the years.

The drivers are in two groups (silver and black drivers) but lately many have found there is some variation even with the groups.  Agree with @Argyris that I don't believe any amount of burn-in will give you that drastic of a change in the 2006 model.
 
As for the distortion, you might want to open it up completely to check for a hair or two.

 

[DecentLevi]

Hello again @DavidA, any advice on how to tell which has the silver or black driver? After removing the pads I only see a transparent silicon like driver but don't see any silver or black. Where do I look, and how do I take it apart without ruining it? (if you don't mind to possibly illustrate, or share links) THANKS!

 

[DavidA]

  Hello again @DavidA, any advice on how to tell which has the silver or black driver? After removing the pads I only see a transparent silicon like driver but don't see any silver or black. Where do I look, and how do I take it apart without ruining it? (if you don't mind to possibly illustrate, or share links) THANKS!

Take a look at this video:

 
Info on dirver revisions:
http://www.innerfidelity.com/content/very-important-sennheiser-hd-580-hd-600-and-hd-650-page-2#YdihjIEWw3efgDF0.97
 
Hope this helps
D

 

[ProtegeManiac]

 
Already having suspicions of the manufacture date due to the odd appearance of this plastic Sennheiser box shown above, I looked thru the packet to discover it was made in October 2006! (with "fabr- nr. 153681" on the outside of the plastic box). The seller seemed either very un-knowledgeable with headphones or was playing dumb when I inquired about it, saying he doesn't know when it was made and didn't remember how often it was used, but very infrequently. I believe he was telling the truth though because the clamping force is still quite firm and all the pads and everything are completely blemish free. Physically comparing it to my other one (that I'm about to send back) from around 2011, I was surprised to see that both have identical design / colors, etc. including the silver voice coil (which I was told is the newest version), and both say "made in Ireland" inside the headband.
 
So here's the hitch: the 'newer' one sounds more shrill, piercing and sharp on the top end, dynamics that manage to be both harsher yet don't 'slam' as hard, and overall voicing that can only be described as moderately lush / fierce / uncontrolled; whereas the 'older' HD-600 sounded more smooth, dynamic and mellowed out on the top.
 
Those are the differences I heard after a critical A/B comparison of the old to the new HD-600, using the exact same source chain with same volume, exact same cable and same loop of several test tracks. So my question is:
- Would any amount of burn in be able to get the 'newer' HD-600 to sound identical to the 'older' one?
   If yes: about how long and what kind of volume is recommended?
- Or would it be likely that the driver of the newer pair is so different that they will never sound the same?
 
NOTE:
when I refer to "newer" I am actually referring to the 2006 pair, as it seems not to have been burned in yet;
by "older" I am actually referring to the 2011 version which has extensive burn-in.

 

Sounds like my 2007 HD600 that I bought in 2009. Earpads were worn out. Replaced them and the shrill highs were gone; did the headband adjustment (bent the headband outwards to relax the clamp) and the bass tightened up.

 

When those pads wore out I gutted them and mounted the HM5 earpads on them. Cymbals moved back (away from my head) and bass is slightly deeper sounding. You might want to get these instead of the original earpads. I'm using the angled velours but there's a hybrid velour-pleather angled version.

 

[martinrajdl]

Already having suspicions of the manufacture date due to the odd appearance of this plastic Sennheiser box shown above, I looked thru the packet to discover it was made in October 2006! (with "fabr- nr. 153681" on the outside of the plastic box). 

Hi, where on the box did you find the manufacture date. I also had mine in this box, and on the bottom there is a sort of serial number, but not a date. Thanks