[astark]

  +1 Yes! So many great tubes - so little time.
 
It comes down to personal preferences - some love the Amperex D Getter Pinched Waists - for me way to woolly.  Extremely euphonic IMHO.  But fun as well for occasional listening.  I'm a tone guy - so for me the number one attribute is a rich natural tone.  But it must not come with an unnatural tonal balance.  I love detail as well.  It's the retrieval and reproduction of those deep layers of sound that produce, at least in my three systems (one HP and two speaker), a truly amazing sound stage.  It's my belief that the unveiling of these low level ambient clues help the ear/mind project a true 3D holographic effect.  Think point sources projecting in a deep and wide sound field, not staggered card board cut outs.  It's the revealing of the back and side reflected sounds that trick the ear/mind into this effect.
 
It's what I've been intensely searching for - for over 20 yrs.  These HGs for me were the key that unlocked the door.  That this key could come from a vintage russian space program tube is pretty amazing.
 
But as Steve says, my system is different from everyone else's.  Back when I started posting about this amazing 'audio discovery' - people were highly skeptical.  No fancy gold pins - no published audio lore and legend.  I was flamed badly!  So these tubes had an uphill climb, most of the folks who had tried them, had only listened to the mediocre '80s or '90s versions.  Or worse mismatched untested pairs.  No one I was aware of had really delved deeply into the better 70's certainly not the best of best.  So this was blazing new trails.  I needed to see if others, in different systems, with different ears and tastes, would have a similar experience as me.  Now almost 2 years later - the overwhelming consensus is Yes!
 
This is ground breaking audio research.  For 15yrs I've been researching, buying and rolling 6922 type tubes - in lots of gear pre-amps, amps, DACs,etc...  The best of these 6N23P's do things to a degree I've never heard before.  That sweeping 'flow' factor for one, the deep detail retrieval the other, all with a wonderful rich natural tone.
 
All that said - there are other tubes I really like as well.  The Amperex USN-CEP 6922/7308 white prints (the most neutral of all Amperex's I've heard), the '60s Telefunken E88CC, the Siemens early 60's CCa gray shields.  These are my all time favorites.  I'm revisiting the Philips/Miniwatts/Valvo's and so far it looks like I'll be adding them to the list.
 
Sorry for the long post - but for those new here and to tubes, I thought it important to bring them up to date.  We live in wonderful times, to have all these great tubes to experience!
 
Cheers!

and Happy Rolling!

 

Being new to headphones, amps and tubes I greatly appreciate your sharing of knowledge and opinion to people like me.
 
And about these Russian tubes, I'm listening to Porcupine Tree Stupid Dream right now with some Sennheiser HD600 headphones plugged into a first version Lyr connected to an Oppo 103. I was impressed with the stock Schitt provided GE tubes but wondering what alleged upgrade tubes might sound like, so I started privately messaging Bob and ultimately ordered a set of 74 Reflektors SWGP with silver shields.
 
I received my new tubes yesterday and at first thought they did not sound as good as the GE's had, but after burning in for twenty five hours now I find they already sound much better than my old ones did. I don't know really how to describe it but there seems to be parts of the music I had not heard before, separate, kind of distinct and there is more separation too. In fact, its like there are little tings or whispers of sound not present when listing with the GE's or something that I am now hearing, sort of like more complex in a way if that makes sense, and I really like these new Russian tubes.
 
Now I know I still have a ways to go until broken in properly but wanted to offer this up for now with a thank you for sharing your experience and opinion, it is greatly appreciated.

 

[rb2013]

 
Being new to headphones, amps and tubes I greatly appreciate your sharing of knowledge and opinion to people like me.
 
And about these Russian tubes, I'm listening to Porcupine Tree Stupid Dream right now with some Sennheiser HD600 headphones plugged into a first version Lyr connected to an Oppo 103. I was impressed with the stock Schitt provided GE tubes but wondering what alleged upgrade tubes might sound like, so I started privately messaging Bob and ultimately ordered a set of 74 Reflektors SWGP with silver shields.
 
I received my new tubes yesterday and at first thought they did not sound as good as the GE's had, but after burning in for twenty five hours now I find they already sound much better than my old ones did. I don't know really how to describe it but there seems to be parts of the music I had not heard before, separate, kind of distinct and there is more separation too. In fact, its like there are little tings or whispers of sound not present when listing with the GE's or something that I am now hearing, sort of like more complex in a way if that makes sense, and I really like these new Russian tubes.
 
Now I know I still have a ways to go until broken in properly but wanted to offer this up for now with a thank you for sharing your experience and opinion, it is greatly appreciated.

+1 Hey Man Thanks for the kudos!   Jamming on an old Rory Gallagher LP right now as I write this - 'Blue Print' - awesome blues guitar.
 
It'll take a while for your mind to get used to the addition information being thrown at it.  All those subtle ambient sounds revealed can really give the old nogg'in a twist.  At a certain point, you'll find yourself sort of swept away by the sound - you'll be fixating on some aspect of the sound - like a background keyboard, or an awesome bass line and then the flow just takes over.  Very memorizing - almost hypnotizing.  The first time a bit startling!  I've termed that the 'flow' factor.
 
The other thing really good tubes do well like the '75 HGs and your '74s - they scale incredibly well. When the music gets very complex and loud - with all kinds of layers - these tubes never hit the wall in terms of congestion.  The details never turn muddy and obscure - if you can follow all that's happening - just amazing.  Almost overwhelming at times.
Having a beer in hand for a quick chug helps at times like this! 
 
Cheers!

PS Speaking of awesome guitar just ordered the LP version of Black Keys 'Turn Blue'
 

 

[rb2013]

  My understanding is that the Amerex OG are very warm and mid centric. I don't have any personal experience with them. 
As for the Voskhod, I like everything about it except the bass with my LCD-2.  But I think it would work well with those with HD800 or those who want some bass boost.

What year Voskhods are you listening to? 

 

[sfo1972]

I would like to echo what astark pointed out regarding help from the veterans on this forum. It has been great to hear the varying opinions and thoughts regarding different tubes. Being new to tube rolling its difficult to know where to start. A few hours on this forum skimming the thread provides a great "education" regarding tube rolling, what to look for and what to avoid.
 
I agree that its all about taste at the end of the day, nonetheless, it is very helpful to avoid costly mistakes along the way to discover what you like and what you dislike when it comes to tubes. It is also great to get some suggestions and advice based on the sound signatures that we are looking for.
 
So thanks to all those who provide help and guidance on this forum to all of us curious tube rollers. Including Rb2013, satwilson, ThurstonX, Guidostrink, & others.
 
Cheers

 

[sling5s]

What year Voskhods are you listening to? 

I might have spoken or written too soon.  At first listening, I thought it's bassy and mid forward.  But having it burned in some more, it just changed.  It's so much more clearer, cleaner, so much more open.  The Siemens are refined, smooth, airy and open. But the Voskhods are more lively, engaging, musical and forward.  At this rate, these may become my favorite tubes. The bass can at times still be over powering but it's much more tighter and controlled than before. 
 
To my ears the Voskhods that I have have a upper and mid bass emphasis along with a mid and upper mid emphasis. 
To me this is what makes the tubes so fun and musical. 
 
Early 70's single wire grey shield. It's all I know. 

 

[korzena]

  I might have spoken or written too soon.  At first listening, I thought it's bassy and mid forward.  But having it burned in some more, it just changed.  It's so much more clearer, cleaner, so much more open.  The Siemens are refined, smooth, airy and open. But the Voskhods are more lively, engaging, musical and forward.  At this rate, these may become my favorite tubes. The bass can at times still be over powering but it's much more tighter and controlled than before. 
 
To my ears the Voskhods that I have have a upper and mid bass emphasis along with a mid and upper mid emphasis. 
To me this is what makes the tubes so fun and musical. 
 
Early 70's single wire grey shield. It's all I know. 

It was me asking you about your impressions and comparisons between the tubes for LCD-2. Thanks!
 
It's an interesting development with the Russian tubes. I wonder how it will go on as the time passes.

 

[sling5s]

  It was me asking you about your impressions and comparisons between the tubes for LCD-2. Thanks!
 
It's an interesting development with the Russian tubes. I wonder how it will go on as the time passes.

To use a Grado analogy again: 
Listening to the Siemens is like listening to HD800 for me.  I appreciate all the technical abilities.
Listening to the Voskhod is like listening to a pair of Grado RS1.  My head is bopping and feet tapping. 
 
Kind of like that.  The Voskhod does vocals and guitars really well. 

 

[rb2013]

  I would like to echo what astark pointed out regarding help from the veterans on this forum. It has been great to hear the varying opinions and thoughts regarding different tubes. Being new to tube rolling its difficult to know where to start. A few hours on this forum skimming the thread provides a great "education" regarding tube rolling, what to look for and what to avoid.
 
I agree that its all about taste at the end of the day, nonetheless, it is very helpful to avoid costly mistakes along the way to discover what you like and what you dislike when it comes to tubes. It is also great to get some suggestions and advice based on the sound signatures that we are looking for.
 
So thanks to all those who provide help and guidance on this forum to all of us curious tube rollers. Including Rb2013, satwilson, ThurstonX, Guidostrink, & others.
 
Cheers

+1 Thanks for the kudos

 

[korzena]

 
To use a Grado analogy again: 
Listening to the Siemens is like listening to HD800 for me.  I appreciate all the technical abilities.
Listening to the Voskhod is like listening to a pair of Grado RS1.  My head is bopping and feet tapping. 
 
Kind of like that.  The Voskhod does vocals and guitars really well. 

Where does Telefunken stand in this comparison?

 

[sling5s]

The telefunken are like the siemens but more musical.  It has more midrange warmth.  But it's not as mid forward (in upper mids) or bass (mid and upper bass) boosted as the Voskhod. 

 

[rb2013]

  I might have spoken or written too soon.  At first listening, I thought it's bassy and mid forward.  But having it burned in some more, it just changed.  It's so much more clearer, cleaner, so much more open.  The Siemens are refined, smooth, airy and open. But the Voskhods are more lively, engaging, musical and forward.  At this rate, these may become my favorite tubes. The bass can at times still be over powering but it's much more tighter and controlled than before. 
 
To my ears the Voskhods that I have have a upper and mid bass emphasis along with a mid and upper mid emphasis. 
To me this is what makes the tubes so fun and musical. 
 
Early 70's single wire grey shield. It's all I know. 

The dates are sometimes hard to read - I use a small LED flashlight.  The date is right below the rocket logo.  If you want to post a picture I can help identify them for you.
 
Sounds like they're opening up.  As they burnin they'll go through some changes - sometimes retrograde backwards in SQ.  Kinda frustrating - be patient and keep going - they will get better.  Sometimes much better.  The biggest changes I have noticed is they open up, become less forward, the bass tightens, and they smooth-out.
 
For some reason the 6N23P's take the longest to burnin of any tube type I've had.  Maybe because they are beefier - the glass is definitely thicker then the US or Euro tubes.

 

[sling5s]

 
The dates are sometimes hard to read - I use a small LED flashlight.  The date is right below the rocket logo.  If you want to post a picture I can help identify them for you.
 
Sounds like they're opening up.  As they burnin they'll go through some changes - sometimes retrograde backwards in SQ.  Kinda frustrating - be patient and preserver - they will get better.  Sometimes much better.  The biggest changes I have noticed is they open up, become less forward, the bass tightens, and they smooth-out.
 
For some reason the 6N23P's take the longest to burnin of any tube type I've had.  Maybe because they are beefier - the glass is definitely thicker then the US or Euro tubes.

Thanks. 

 

[scizzro]

Has anybody found a good way to remove tubes without damaging the silkscreen? I have really thick fingers and find it pretty difficult - On the stock tubes, I wrapped a rubber band around the tube, pulled it tight, and wiggled it back and forth while pulling up. I would be nervous to try that on a good quality tube...

 

[MWSVette]

I bought a tube puller on ebay for about $9.00.  Works great. 

 

[ThurstonX]

  Has anybody found a good way to remove tubes without damaging the silkscreen? I have really thick fingers and find it pretty difficult - On the stock tubes, I wrapped a rubber band around the tube, pulled it tight, and wiggled it back and forth while pulling up. I would be nervous to try that on a good quality tube...

 
Socket savers will help you avoid that.