[tincanear]

Some (but not all) hardware balanced DAC's using two DAC chips can provide 1 extra bit of resolution (provided that the chips have sufficiently low non-linearity like the mondo expensive ADI chips used in yggy with 1 LSB non-linearity, digital filter feeds each DAC chip separately, etc. That's how yggy achieves 21 bits of resolution using two 20 bit DAC chips.

Balanced, can, in some situations (but not always) reduce the effects of ground current noise (loop is thru multiple devices, the AC line power grounding, signal grounds between devices).

 

[ImagesbyMurray]

Ok I’ll just take my electrical engineering degrees and go elsewhere. This is why I kept away from this site for a good long while. I’m leaving. Peace

I think there is a lot of confusion regarding Balanced / Unbalanced. As Ableza correctly notes there is no sonic benefit per se between the two architectures. It is the conversion between a balanced / unbalanced interface that is really in question here. Jason's Nexus topology takes care of the conversion of an unbalanced source to balanced correctly (No N/N+1 error). Here's his explanation. Going from balanced to unbalanced is a simple sum, no possible error being introduced here.....

I chose a Freya S precisely because of it's Nexus architecture, my sources are currently unbalanced, feeding a pair of Vidars. Because of this - I'm running X1 active. After receipt of my Yggy, and balancing my Video source via transformer, I'll be free to try passive.......

 

[valiant66]

To generate the same magnitude of output, balanced generates two channels of opposite sign. This means that idiosyncratic noise in the output is reduced compared to one channel in single-ended. If the noise between channels is independent, statistically trained folk will be able to do the back of the envelope calculation of a noise reduction of 30%. That's not huge, but it is a benefit.

I'm going to adjust Ableza's signature quote: "Inaudible is inaudible and you don't get extra brownie points for making it twice 30% as inaudible as another solution."

If I'm running 30m Mic cables across a stage with all kinds of electrical signals crossing each other I absolutely want balanced. If I'm running a 30ft cable past all kinds of electrical outlets to my sub, I'll consider balanced if there's hum. If I'm running a 30in cable from my preamp my power amp, there's no electrical reason for balanced.

Plenty of bragging rights though. If it makes you happy to tell me how many more monies you paid for your balanced interconnects than I did for my single ended ones, please feel free. Whatever floats your boat.
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[StimpyWan]

I'm pretty sure it must still be selling well. Schiit has no problem retiring under-performing products.
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I hope no-one spills the beans on me then, because I've been an "under-performing product" for years...! Though, I do wonder what retirement would feel like...?

 

[valiant66]

It's good to hear that a piece of gear doesn't have to be the latest and greatest. That it can still sound good, as long as it was a good design to begin with!

My Quad 405 still sounds great. So do my Rogers LS3/5As. Both were made in the 70s. Just because a Schiit DAC was made more than 7 minutes ago doesn't mean it is bad or needs retiring.

EDIT: but in the end this is up to @Baldr and @Jason Stoddard - they have a bunch of new products coming down the pike. If there is no v2 then we'll have our answer.
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[Ripper2860]

I'm pretty sure it must still be selling well. Schiit has no problem retiring under-performing products.
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I object!!! Your honor, this is pure hear-say and speculation. I demand that it be stricken from the record!!

BTW -- I checked the Internet Archive and it seems that Gungnir is a wee bit older than 7 minutes.

I don't recall ever saying it sounded bad. Sales and how it sounds is not a guarantee of its continued presence as-is. Original BF Multibit sounded pretty good, too, if I recall. And I suspect it also sold pretty well. I'm sure Mike is chomping at the bit to do some amazing things w/ a DAC at the Gumby price-point!!

This horse is dead and I shall cease beating it.

 

[AndreYew]

People with EE degrees should also know that balanced doesn't mean differential signalling (ie. transmitting a + and - version of the same signal down two wires). It just means the impedances from each balanced leg to ground is equal or balanced. This is what gives it common-mode noise rejection. And as mentioned, this doesn't cancel all noise since that will depend to what frequencies the common mode impedances are matched to. With only resistors, that's basically near DC due to parasitic effects as you get higher in frequency (eg. inductance). It is true that balanced and differential signaling are often used together in audio, so a lot of people assume that they're one and the same.

One could also argue for combining or summing differential signals as close to the source as possible since there will be fewest downstream parasitic effects that may make the signals asymmetrical, so there are reasonable arguments favoring summing "inherently balanced" devices for single-ended output.

Differential signalling itself does not cancel distortion or noise either. Mathematically, you are turning an even order function (ie. single-ended) into an odd order function. To the extent that the distortion on either side is equal, they will cancel, otherwise they're just being transformed into odd-order distortion, cf. matching complementary semiconductor devices and their transconductance curves in a push-pull design.

 

[davidflas]

I love my Gungnir, I’ve had it since before multibit was even an option. It even had USB gen 1. I’ve upgraded to multibit since then, and plan to get the Unison upgrade soon. I just got a Freya S, and picked up a pair of Monoprice XLR cables. I‘m not technically savvy, but it sounds great to me. Long live the OG Gungnir!

 

[Plautus001]

That you can solve by buying those cds you really like from Bandcamp

Marking plagiarism... err student papers can be mind numbing at times and my mind wonders....

Listening to Tidal today (my three month subscription is ending soon and my Roon subscription ended last week) I had these thoughts:

• Tidal on it's own does sound better than Spotify, but not in a life changing way. ("HiFi and "Master")
• Roon makes Tidal sound much better - huge difference
• Spotify is far better than Tidal at music suggestions and UI - I barely use Tidal on it's own
• Roon is good at music discovery, but not Spotify good

I might go back to Roon someday, but combining Roon + Tidal is just too much for my budget

I need to find a way to make Spotify sound better on it's way to the Modi 3 (hopefully I can buy a Modi Multibit with Unison or Modious Multibit someday....

Systems I used today:

1. Modi 3 > Asgard 3 > NightOwl and DT770 80 Ohm
2. Topping D30>Darkvoice>HD6XX and DT770 80 Ohm

 

[438555]

Marking plagiarism... err student papers can be mind numbing at times and my mind wonders....

Listening to Tidal today (my three month subscription is ending soon and my Roon subscription ended last week) I had these thoughts:

• Tidal on it's own does sound better than Spotify, but not in a life changing way. ("HiFi and "Master")
• Roon makes Tidal sound much better - huge difference
• Spotify is far better than Tidal at music suggestions and UI - I barely use Tidal on it's own
• Roon is good at music discovery, but not Spotify good

I might go back to Roon someday, but combining Roon + Tidal is just too much for my budget

I need to find a way to make Spotify sound better on it's way to the Modi 3 (hopefully I can buy a Modi Multibit with Unison or Modious Multibit someday....

Systems I used today:

1. Modi 3 > Asgard 3 > NightOwl and DT770 80 Ohm
2. Topping D30>Darkvoice>HD6XX and DT770 80 Ohm

I wish I could get Roon to use a Spotify source, so I could use Roon’s DSP for streaming. Not willing to buy a second streaming service when the rest of the family uses Spotify

 

[Plautus001]

I wish I could get Roon to use a Spotify source, so I could use Roon’s DSP for streaming. Not willing to buy a second streaming service when the rest of the family uses Spotify

Exactly.... we're on the Family plan for Spotify.... I already have multiple video streaming services... sigh

by the way, Prime Music HD does not sound as good as Tidal to my ears...

 

[JohnnyOps]

Ah, but Qobuz!

 

[davidflas]

Ah, but Qobuz!

Agree!

 

[Plautus001]

Ah, but Qobuz!

Qobuz is not in Canada... my guess is similar to Tidal?

I did try Deezer... not as good as Tidal...

 

[davidflas]

Qobuz is not in Canada... my guess is similar to Tidal?

I did try Deezer... not as good as Tidal...

Similar in that it offers CD and higher quality music, but without the MQA element.