Schiit Happened: The Story of the World's Most Improbable Start-Up
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Derrick Swart

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speakers interact a lot with amp especial the pushpull that have negative feedback ,the signal is take from spk and send to input ,normally have a coil for load stability a zobel cell that interact too
A zobel cell? Is dat a new Schiit Audio buzzword?
 
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post-14872013
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Derrick Swart

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:L3000:
The day 6 Moons becomes a reliable source for technical information is the day I eat my hat and resign from all things audio.

Rather than get into a discussion of DF and its importance (or lack thereof) to audio amplifier performance, I will bow out of this discussion by referring you to a more technical resource, although one still written in layman's language: https://trueaudio.com/post_013.htm Perhaps this will help you, perhaps not.
Yes dump the DF:L3000:
 
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nicoch46

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well class is indirect relate to dumping simple because more bias ie class A the lower is distortions and the not need to high feddback that direct rise the dumping...

well 6moon review is quite instructive relate to pratical sound of interface ,my full range on OB with mono amp at back ie short cable is quite sensitive to dumping , my tube dumping 3 rise the Qes ie the total Q of good 30% not small , range 3 to 20 give more then 100 is correct that's logical, because they should have excessive bass if their damping factor is very low and if the loudspeaker is designed for a high damping factor. The Q factor of the fundamental resonance becomes higher than the loudspeaker designer expected, hence you get some peaking around the resonant frequency.
adding an 8ohm in series work like a current amp
this is serius tech link http://sound.whsites.net/project56.htm
 
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KoshNaranek

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The day 6 Moons becomes a reliable source for technical information is the day I eat my hat and resign from all things audio.
Agreed. That website is an unreadable mess. I cannot even parse it.
 
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jmimac351

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Damping factor is a measurable characteristic, of course. But its effect is theoretical and there is very little evidence indicating that large DF is any better sounding than DF of 50. There is plenty of speculation and insistence, but very little science. And again, amplifier class is independent of DF.
As for my speakers, Merlin Music VSM and Merlin Music TSM Black Magic, they need an amp with low DF / very little negative feedback, if any. It's why it's much easier to make those speakers sing with tubes. In the past (and sometimes even now) "new" owners who don't realize the importance of matching the proper amp with Merlin speakers complain about them sounding "thin". I suspect some then look at the drivers used in the speakers and figure "ah, of course, a 2-way speaker with a 6.5" woofer, of course it has no low end". It's just that they know so much that isn't so. And, they don't know what they don't know. When paired with the right amp, they will bend your brain with what they are able to do, and how full they can sound. You can look for a sub which isn't there. I've owned my VSMs for 20 years and started off making the same mistakes for amp pairing. Sure, listen to and stick with what you like is great; however, you have to play to how the speaker is designed, which is a damped design. If you put damped speakers in a "damped" system they will sound thin. My point is, things like negative feedback and DF absolutely do matter, and hopefully people understand what you're trying to pair together to give yourself a good shot at being happy versus being another seller of audio gear. Anyone who thinks negative feedback doesn't matter should listen to my Joule-Electra VZN-80 OTL amp. It has knobs on top for easily adjusting feedback to "Clearly audible, right now" differences. As I said, it's easy to get there with tubes. It's much more challenging with SS. Nelson Pass and his First Watt SIT-3 may be real close to a more friendly alternative to an OTL tube amp (still not much power, though). I haven't heard it, but I'd bet my speakers would LOVE it because of the way it was designed and its specs. The First Watt SIT-3 DF is 50. I own a Joule-Electra VAMP Integrated amp with DF of 13. Sometimes there are a few clues why some junk sounds better together than other junk.

There is a reason why Aegir needs to exist, and not just Vidar. Why would Schiit bother to make such a low power amp, and charge more than Vidar for it? Who would be dumb enough to buy a lower power amp when you can get all of that Vidar power for less money? Why would someone possibly be interested in that??? My hunch is that damping factor / feedback is going to be part of the Why. My guess is that Aegir DF comes in under 100, but not under 50. Oh, and the other part of "Why?" is that many people have experience with stuff like that just plain sounding more musical...

We'll see.
 
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post-14872368
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dieslemat

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Zobel Network on Merlin TSM Black Magic.


What sorcery is this? Controlls on the crossover?

Edit: please ignore. I read your comments above. Thanks for sharing
 
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jmimac351

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My extended comments above weren’t referring to the RC / Zobel networks. The speakers were refined over the course of 20 years or so and those RC networks were one of many tweaks (some large, some small) Bobby made.

See below for info on either speaker. Click “Read More” on either and scroll down to “RC Network” for a description of what they do.

https://sigsound.com/product-lines/merlin-music-systems/
 
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post-14872478
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Xcalibur255

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You may want to have a look at Blumenstein Audio Orca 3” full range. Rated efficienty of 91.5 dB, they are reported to work very well (and loud) with the Bottel Head 2W SEX tube amplifier.

[edit] may not have the bass you are looking for with out their Benthic sub.
I need to get under 40hz if possible since I do not intend to run a sub. I actually took a close look at the Blumenstein Triton, but something makes me hesitate on that one.
 
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Xcalibur255

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To my ears the Zu Omen speakers image very well - the speakers really disappear and if you close your eyes you can really imagine the singer(s) and instruments before you. YMMV, as always.
The tough question is: do they do this when they are only 5 feet apart and you're sitting 4 feet away from them ("inside the triangle" in other words). I know this is a bit of an odd duck arrangement, but I've grown to really love the sound and want to take it to the next level now. The Onix speakers are great, but we're talking about a 12 year old pair of speakers that were $219 new. Yggdrasil makes these old girls sound a LOT more expensive than that, but the cost limitations in the drivers definitely do show themselves when being pushed by nice upstream gear. I decided it's time to move on, but I want to keep the nearfield listening magic intact.
 
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Derrick Swart

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I need to get under 40hz if possible since I do not intend to run a sub. I actually took a close look at the Blumenstein Triton, but something makes me hesitate on that one.
40Hz spec or in room? How big is your room?
 
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Pietro Cozzi Tinin

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The day 6 Moons becomes a reliable source for technical information is the day I eat my hat and resign from all things audio.
Don't. I know what's under there.
 
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Derrick Swart

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six in the morning and still no Aegir announcement !!???!!!!
I am not a fool. At least I think. April first is gone but the 799 bucks burnin' in my pocket are screaming Ægir!!!! 230V please!
 
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