Smithington
100+ Head-Fier
- Joined
- Nov 20, 2014
- Posts
- 141
- Likes
- 96
HTH - Different angle...
Who's copy of 'The Score' is that?! I think that's the biggest controversy in the pics of SOL
Schiit Happened: The Story of the World's Most Improbable Start-Up
- Thread starter Jason Stoddard
- Start date
-
- Tags
- schiit audio schiit-audio
Who's copy of 'The Score' is that?! I think that's the biggest controversy in the pics of SOL
Indeed, it's an odd looking duck. I sincerely hope the vinyl-lovers get a kick out of it. @Jason Stoddard is right - it won't be for everyone. Me? As long as Schiit doesn't start marketing 8-track or cassette tape players, I'm good (yeesh, individuals who pine for the cassette-deck technology make me bite bite my tongue).
I'm guilty of looking and the Sol photos from the Schittr meet and going...... uh..... hmmm..... well,....... Thankfully, I followed an old-Estonian addage: if one's about to say something critical, take a sip of water, hold it, then swallow (think-then-respond). I might be butchering it (and the online Esti's will howl foul), but the idea's sound. I won't be an armchair quarterback!
+1. 'nuff said.
-1. I lied. Add RBG lighting that flashes to the beat!
My ModiMultibit can't be flashed, right? I'm assuming I can't send my unit in for a 1-time-upgrade in the future, right? Oy....
Firmware updates. For my ModiMB? Oh man, that's a can of worms.When my beer fund gets flush (again), I'm going to jump up to the Gungnir. Adapt-a-clock?! BBG-indicators?! Multibit ver 2.x?! 100% want, 0% need, eh.
To my knowledge Schiit has never offered upgrades to their low priced Modi DACs, they even note on their website that Modis are not upgradeable. They don't have the newest Gen 5 USB which is available only on the Bifrost and up. If you want a DAC which is upgradeable you need to consider buying a Bifrost instead of a Modi. This is an example of you do get what you pay for. Modi Multibit is a great low cost DAC but even after adding an Eitr to get the Gen 5 USB it does not equal the sound quality of the Bifrost Multibit.
Last edited:
Thermometer DACs are more linear (and as @soekris mentioned paralleling resistors reduces noise) and the resistor differences tend to average out, unfortunately while a 20 bit R-2R ladder DAC is self-decoding and requires ~ 20 switches and 40 resistors (mono), a 20 bit thermometer DAC needs ~ 1 million switches and resistors and the decoding from binary to thermometer is not included, see below for a 4 bit version of a decoder, there are frames titled - 2bit DEC, 3bit DEC and the full picture - 4bit DEC
As you will notice for each new bit frame moving to the right a new level of decoding is added and the number of outputs is doubled, continue for another 16 levels and ~1 million outputs and you have your 20 bit decoder to operate your million switches and resistors.
You'll need 4 of those for a balanced 20 bit DAC
That's why it's only done for 6 bits in Yggy's chips.
By using a thermometer DAC for the 6 MSBs the errors in the R-2R DAC are pushed down 36dB
(well that's my take on it)
Last edited:
golfbravobravo
Headphoneus Supremus
Archimago is calling down the audio gods again 
. This hits the spot for me: http://archimago.blogspot.com/2019/02/musings-computer-audio-mythos-comment.html
And it made me smile!
Cheers
. This hits the spot for me: http://archimago.blogspot.com/2019/02/musings-computer-audio-mythos-comment.htmlAnd it made me smile!
Cheers
valiant66
Headphoneus Supremus
Look at the Oracle Delphi for an example of a turntable with a y-shaped chassis that has a conventional looking dust cover. No comparison pricewise, of course,even used,
https://www.oracle-audio.com/delphi-mkvi-second-generation
Other technological differences too.
.
earnmyturns
Headphoneus Supremus
Archimago asks good questions, and super-duper clocks for Ethernet and USB audio -- both async protocols -- is magic beans, but he's never addressed properly, in that posting or earlier ones, the question of electrical noise carried by USB wires (or other digital electronic) sources into DACs. The "bits are bits" dogma works fine for reasonably designed purely digital circuitry, but it falls apart when the bits, electrically encoding as noisy signals go into controlling the generation of an analog signal with a dynamic range > 100dB, meaning < 20uV relative to a 2V 0 dB output level.Archimago is calling down the audio gods again
rkw
Headphoneus Supremus
For those of you who are not on Windows today and might miss this, a cool Bing wallpaper.
Electron microscope image of stylus on record, for the occasion of the Grammy Awards today.
Electron microscope image of stylus on record, for the occasion of the Grammy Awards today.
ScottFree
1000+ Head-Fier
- Joined
- Apr 1, 2008
- Posts
- 1,355
- Likes
- 1,793
I read that post carefully. There was nothing about Kelvin vs. R-2R DACs in it.
The discussion was not about hardware upgrades. It was about firmware updates.
Yes, I realize that an n-bit thermometer DAC requires 2^n resistors. This Wikipedia article helped me understand better what you said: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Resistor_ladder#Accuracy_of_R–2R_resistor_laddersThermometer DACs are more linear (and as @soekris mentioned paralleling resistors reduces noise) and the resistor differences tend to average out, unfortunately while a 20 bit R-2R ladder DAC is self-decoding and requires ~ 20 switches and 40 resistors (mono), a 20 bit thermometer DAC needs ~ 1 million switches and resistors and the decoding from binary to thermometer is not included, see below for a 4 bit version of a decoder, there are frames titled - 2bit DEC, 3bit DEC and the full picture - 4bit DEC
As you will notice for each new bit frame moving to the right a new level of decoding is added and the number of outputs is doubled, continue for another 16 levels and ~1 million outputs and you have your 20 bit decoder to operate your million switches and resistors.
You'll need 4 of those for a balanced 20 bit DAC
That's why it's only done for 6 bits in Yggy's chips.
By using a thermometer DAC for the 6 MSBs the errors in the R-2R DAC are pushed down 36dB
(well that's my take on it)
"Small inaccuracies in the MSB resistors can entirely overwhelm the contribution of the LSB resistors." "Resistors used with the more significant bits must be proportionally more accurate than those used with the less significant bits" "The required accuracy doubles with each additional bit"
So, they increased the accuracy by going with this R-2R/Kelvin design. For such a high bit count it may be the only way.
Regarding the discrete R-2R DACs the article states: "For a 10-bit converter, even using 0.1% precision resistors would not guarantee monotonicity of output. This being said, high resolution R-2R ladders formed from discrete components are sometimes used, the nonlinearity being corrected in software."
Last edited:
porchwizard
100+ Head-Fier
I think it's cool as schiit. Thanks for the pics!
I hope my spiel helped you get your foot in the door of segmented DACs.
The Wikipedia article doesn't include thermometer DACs (outside the article scope) and the profusion of simple gates required for it, something in the order of 2 * ((2^n) - 1)
p.s. Soekris higher end DACs (and the DIY dam1021-12) use discrete 0.01% resistors, but I don't know what else he does to get 24+ bit monotonicity.
Last edited:
