Same Old Schiit? Balanced Research and Valhalla Amp Giveaway
Aug 22, 2011 at 8:21 PM Post #166 of 217
Do you have balanced headphones? If so, which ones?
none.
If not, are you looking at balanced headphones or a balanced amp in the future?
at the moment i am looking into getting some lcd-2s and get those a balanced headphone cable, but im not sure where to start, but i already have your lyr amp and thats great so if you bring out balanced i will know what to buy next.
For balanced headphone output, how important is it to have dual three-pin XLRs as well as a 4-pin XLR?
i have been reading most of the posts in this thread and it seems like most people want 4-pin XLR, i don,t know what the differences are so i can,t say.
For a balanced amp, how important is it to also have single-ended outputs?
i think that if people are going to buy an balanced amp they should have the cables to go with it, you guys keep prices down and still bring out great gear i think adding a single-ended output is a bad idea if its ment to be a balanced amp.
If single-ended is important, is the quality of the single-ended outputs as important as the balanced outputs, or is this more of a “utility” thing so you can use all kinds of different headphones?
if you do go ahead and add one then it should be just as good as the 4-pin XLR out so you can compare.
 
Aug 22, 2011 at 10:23 PM Post #167 of 217
Do you have balanced headphones? If so, which ones?
- Not at the moment, but my T1 is recabled with an adapter end to take balanced should I choose to in the future.
If not, are you looking at balanced headphones or a balanced amp in the future?
- Yes, but probably not in the near future.  Still training my ears to discern differences in my current setup as is.
For balanced headphone output, how important is it to have dual three-pin XLRs as well as a 4-pin XLR?
- Not important unless one has an audible advantage over the other.  I figure if someone is already going so far to get a balanced setup, reterminating another cable isn't that big a deal.
For a balanced amp, how important is it to also have single-ended outputs?
- Not important.
If single-ended is important, is the quality of the single-ended outputs as important as the balanced outputs, or is this more of a “utility” thing so you can use all kinds of different headphones?
- If going down the utility route, might as well have the 3 and 4 pin XLRs then.
 
Aug 23, 2011 at 12:24 AM Post #168 of 217
 
Do you have balanced headphones? If so, which ones?

 

No, but if the right amp came along, I might consider sending my D2000s to a modder to fix it up as so.

 

If not, are you looking at balanced headphones or a balanced amp in the future?

 

Not really.  If there wasn't extra work involved, I'd consider it.

 

For balanced headphone output, how important is it to have dual three-pin XLRs as well as a 4-pin XLR?

 

I suppose it'd matter more to me if I had tried either one.  I'd go with dual because it's cooler looking.

 

For a balanced amp, how important is it to also have single-ended outputs?

 

Very.  Not having them will probably cost you a lot of would be buyers that have all their headphones setup for balanced setups.

 

If single-ended is important, is the quality of the single-ended outputs as important as the balanced outputs, or is this more of a “utility” thing so you can use all kinds of different headphones?

 

Of course it's important.  What happens if you buy a set of headphones?  I mean who wants to wait to get them modded to use with their prime amp?

 
Aug 23, 2011 at 1:41 AM Post #169 of 217
Do you have balanced headphones? If so, which ones?
I have the Beyerdynamic T1, Sennheiser HD600, Grado SR-80i, and a 4-pin mini XLR modded K702.

 

If not, are you looking at balanced headphones or a balanced amp in the future?

I would really love to hear a tube based balanced headphone amp. Tubes all the way man!

 

For balanced headphone output, how important is it to have dual three-pin XLRs as well as a 4-pin XLR?

I'd prefer a 4-pin XLR for the output as it's less clutter and easier to work with. Plus 3 pin hos no advantages over a 4-pin XLR. Though having both wouldn't be bad either.

 

For a balanced amp, how important is it to also have single-ended outputs?

I don't think SE outputs are needed but they would be a cool bonus.

 

If single-ended is important, is the quality of the single-ended outputs as important as the balanced outputs, or is this more of a “utility” thing so you can use all kinds of different headphones?

I would say it would be important but not as important as the balanced output. I would say it's a "utility" thing but would make the amp more compatible with other components.


Quote:
 
Hey all,
 
We’re getting ready to finalize the feature set for a possible upcoming balanced amp, and we thought you might want to let us know what you think about balanced amps, what features you want, if it should include the kitchen sink, if it should be priced under $50*, etc. 
 
To sweeten the pot, everyone who responds before August 31, 2011 will be entered to win a Valhalla (triode OTL) headphone amplifier. We’ll announce the winner, chosen by random drawing, on September 2.
 
Here are the questions:
 
Do you have balanced headphones? If so, which ones?
If not, are you looking at balanced headphones or a balanced amp in the future?
For balanced headphone output, how important is it to have dual three-pin XLRs as well as a 4-pin XLR?
For a balanced amp, how important is it to also have single-ended outputs?
If single-ended is important, is the quality of the single-ended outputs as important as the balanced outputs, or is this more of a “utility” thing so you can use all kinds of different headphones?
 
Thanks in advance for your responses! 
 
All the best,
Jason
 
*Note: This is a joke. Doing balanced right (balanced from input to output, *good* quad pot, true differential output stage, etc.) ain't cheap. Please don't tell all your friends "Schiit is gonna do a balanced amp for $50!" Because that's not gonna happen.


 
EDIT: Fixed typos and added one headphone I forgot! I also misread a question and changed my answer. 
 
 
Aug 23, 2011 at 2:10 AM Post #170 of 217
 
I must first say that it is Very cool of you to be running this Giveaway.  you get information, and you pay for it.  Very cool.  Now..

 

1.  Do you have balanced headphones? If so, which ones?

-No, but I have a pair of Sennheiser HD-650's that I am interested in running balanced.  simple as getting a new cable.

 

2.  If not, are you looking at balanced headphones or a balanced amp in the future?

-I would not get the headphones balanced unless I had the amp to do it right.  So, yes, If I found the right amp, I would do it.

 

3.  For balanced headphone output, how important is it to have dual three-pin XLRs as well as a 4-pin XLR?

-It is not important to me.  I do not have a collection of balanced cans.  But, If I already had a balanced set, It would be very important for me to get an amp that is already capable of utilizing my setup.  I would not recable cans so that I could use a specific amp.  It would be very nice if the amp came with an adaptor to accommodate either connection.

 

4.  For a balanced amp, how important is it to also have single-ended outputs?

-It would be pretty important, and a nice feature to me.  Even if people own balanced cans, they surely own at least one pair of single ended cans.  If someone was looking for "the" amp to set in their space, I would think NOT having the single ended output option would be a deterrent.

 

5.  If single-ended is important, is the quality of the single-ended outputs as important as the balanced outputs, or is this more of a “utility” thing so you can use all kinds of different headphones?

-The single ended output should not be an afterthought.  It should be of the same quality and build as the rest of the amp.  To put something less would be an insult and a display of "cutting corners".  Not something that listeners look for.  There are already too many of those types of amps.

 
Aug 23, 2011 at 3:00 AM Post #171 of 217
 
1. Balanced Headphone: LCD2 (currently in the shop with Audeze for replacement)
2. I hate having 2 3-pin XLR inputs. I am perfectly happy with a single 4-pin. 
3. Having SE output is very important, though, so as to make it more versatile. Most of my headphones are not balanced and I would like to be able to use the amp with my other cans as well.
4. The quality should be the same more or less. Balanced will still sound better but I'm not expecting it to be a watered-down output that is "just there." I would like to be able to use the full power of the amp's internals, otherwise it would only see use when using the balanced set and thus would not be as loved as another amp would.
 
 
Aug 23, 2011 at 9:03 AM Post #172 of 217
1) I don't currently have any balanced headphones but am planning on getting LCD-2s and would run them balanced if the right amp came along.
2) Just 4-pin XLR is fine with me since I don't have a collection already.
3) Having a good SE output is very important to me. I'm hoping to avoid collecting amps, so one that can do everything well will make a big difference in my purchasing decisions. I'd also echo above comments that it makes it much easier for others to try out your setup if they can use their cans with it.
 
Aug 23, 2011 at 2:22 PM Post #173 of 217
 
Do you have balanced headphones? If so, which ones?

I have a pair of Sennheiser HD650 headphones. They aren't balanced, but I would have them balanced if I were able to get my hands on a quality balanced amp.

 

If not, are you looking at balanced headphones or a balanced amp in the future?

I would get my headphones balanced if I had an appropriate amp or the money to upgrade my whole system.

 

For balanced headphone output, how important is it to have dual three-pin XLRs as well as a 4-pin XLR?

I don't personally care about this. Having more options is usually nice, but it isn't always needed. You could perhaps look into making different models, or one model that that uses a modular designed.

 

For a balanced amp, how important is it to also have single-ended outputs?

It would be very nice to have a single-ended output. It would make it easier to try new headphones, or upgrade my system without needing to recable my headphones.

 

If single-ended is important, is the quality of the single-ended outputs as important as the balanced outputs, or is this more of a “utility” thing so you can use all kinds of different headphones?

It would be very nice if the single ended output had equal quality to the balanced outputs for the reasons described above. I would once again suggest multiple models or a modular design.

 
Aug 23, 2011 at 4:46 PM Post #174 of 217
- Do you have balanced headphones? If so, which ones?

Yes. Audio-Technica AD2000. (Not that it benefits from balanced drive, but it's how I ended up re-cabling it regardless.) I've had plenty of other balanced headphones previously though (that I ended up selling for one reason or another) that include: AKG K701 & K340, Audeze LCD-2, Audio-Technica W5000, Grado HP1000, Sennheiser HD650, and Sony Qualia 010. (As well as others I've heard at meets.)

- If not, are you looking at balanced headphones or a balanced amp in the future?

No, not really looking into further dynamic balanced headphones (with the exception of maybe two others) and I already own a balanced amp right now. (And I also owned 3 other balanced amps previously.)

- For balanced headphone output, how important is it to have dual three-pin XLRs as well as a 4-pin XLR?

Speaking for myself, not very important, as it'd be a minor thing to get either a re-cable or an adapter. However, I'd imagine that most people who already have balanced headphones will mostly have them with dual 3-pin XLRs. But at the same time, I don't think it'd be too hard to offer both XLR output jacks, right?

- For a balanced amp, how important is it to also have single-ended outputs?

Not very important, but a good thing to have regardless.

- If single-ended is important, is the quality of the single-ended outputs as important as the balanced outputs, or is this more of a “utility” thing so you can use all kinds of different headphones?

I consider single-ended output more of a utility thing. IMO, a balanced amp should be optimized for the balanced output, otherwise I don't see the point of doing a balanced amp at all.

- Additional Comments:

I want to add some other feedback on the subject of balanced amps if you're truly soliciting customer input:

The only reason I'd personally replace my current balanced amp, the HeadAmp GS-X, with anything else would be for higher output power (i.e., >2W @ 32 Ohms in balanced mode) to drive a wider variety of headphones. I would expect no loss in features either, with the exception of the pre-amp output, as I don't currently use that. That means I'd expect XLR loop output, 3-position gain switch (unity, Med, & High), and stepped attenuator. I also prefer a dual-chassis form factor to minimize noise in the amp section. (Wouldn't really need the unbalanced output).

I prefer balanced amps that are balanced from input to output (including the power supply) - no phase inverters, so a balanced source would be required. Discrete topology, push-pull operation, and Class A biasing would be really nice too. I wouldn't mind paying for these features/implementations either - IMO, anyone who seriously wants to "go balanced" should be prepared to pay for it anyway. I would expect a minimum price of $1.5K on a balanced amp with these features - anything less than that approximate cost would likely have me second-guessing it. Er scratch that actually - considering the cost of the Asgard, Valhalla, & Lyr, I guess my minimum from Schitt would be $1K.
tongue.gif


I started down the path of balanced equipment just over 4 years ago and invested into multiple options (primarily source components) and the thing I'd like most to see is a worthy successor to the HeadAmp GS-X (as it was recently discontinued) while offering something just a bit more. Higher output power would be just the ticket IMO. No you don't need to do the level of B22 output power, just something in between.
 
Also, not really directly related to the point of this thread, I personally don't really see the need for balanced equipment in general. IMO, balanced is overrated and I'd prefer to see a really good single-ended amp over a balanced one. IMO there just aren't enough dual-differentially balanced sources in the world to justify balanced amps & headphones, especially when most headphones have to be manually re-terminated (i.e., don't have detachable cables) and some of them don't even benefit from balanced drive (in my experience it's always been the low-impedance, efficient headphones that didn't benefit).
 
Btw, I reviewed most of the posts in this thread and the people who don't currently have any balanced equipment vastly outnumber the people who do, or did. I think that says something about balanced equipment.... (as well as something about certain people's motivations for posting in this thread)
 
Aug 23, 2011 at 6:00 PM Post #175 of 217
 
Do you have balanced headphones? If so, which ones?  Not at the moment.

If not, are you looking at balanced headphones or a balanced amp in the future? Well i have the w1000x and the UE IEMs. Both are not too balanced, but i am thinking about looking into balanced phones or moding my w1000x s.

For balanced headphone output, how important is it to have dual three-pin XLRs as well as a 4-pin XLR? 4 pin

For a balanced amp, how important is it to also have single-ended outputs? not too important.

If single-ended is important, is the quality of the single-ended outputs as important as the balanced outputs, or is this more of a “utility” thing so you can use all kinds of different headphones? quality is of course, the most important. thats why we always bother looking for higher audio quality.

 
Aug 23, 2011 at 10:43 PM Post #176 of 217
1). "Do you have balanced headphones? If so, which ones?"

HD650s Tam Audio recable. Have Matrix Quattro Amp

 

2). "If not, are you looking at balanced headphones or a balanced amp in the future?"

As above. Am looking for a balanced DAC or a DAC/Amp combo

 

3). "For balanced headphone output, how important is it to have dual three-pin XLRs as well as a 4-pin XLR?"

My cable has double TRS. Whatever is chosen it is important to me that Schiit produce their own cables or sell the recommended cable via their website. The issue of the non-availability of affordable 4 pin XLR cables (I can't solder) was what made me choose the Matrix. The double TRS with auto-detect is an elegant solution by the way - have you considered it?

 

4). "For a balanced amp, how important is it to also have single-ended outputs?"

Not important while I'm using it but it makes a big difference when it comes time to sell.

 

5). "If single-ended is important, is the quality of the single-ended outputs as important as the balanced outputs, or is this more of a “utility” thing so you can use all kinds of different headphones?"

Happy with 'utility' SE if this is made clear in the manual

 

XLR pre-outs desirable.

 

Cheers

 

ES

 
Aug 23, 2011 at 11:27 PM Post #177 of 217
 
Do you have balanced headphones? If so, which ones? None yet.

 

If not, are you looking at balanced headphones or a balanced amp in the future? Yes. I'm looking at the DT990 with 600 ohm drivers as a start. I intend to either buy them already re-cabled for XLR (4 or 3) and move on to higher-end cans when I am able to. I'll be spending a lot more on an amp and DAC than headphones at first so I can upgrade more easily. I've been eyeing that Valhalla, but I would definitely go for one that is balanced if I could possibly afford it.

 

For balanced headphone output, how important is it to have dual three-pin XLRs as well as a 4-pin XLR? For me, not very since I am just beginning to empty my wallet because of Head-Fi. I don't have any allegiances to either, yet.

 

For a balanced amp, how important is it to also have single-ended outputs? Preferred, but no deal breaker.

 

If single-ended is important, is the quality of the single-ended outputs as important as the balanced outputs, or is this more of a “utility” thing so you can use all kinds of different headphones? Quality. Since people go so far out of their way to get as close as they can to perfection, I believe quality is more of a priority.

 
Aug 24, 2011 at 12:29 AM Post #178 of 217
1.Do you have balanced headphones? If so, which ones?
 
I currently own a few headphones, none of them balanced so far because i currently don't own a balanced amp. I own a balanced earphone though which is my JH16 with TWAG V2 terminated with RSA balanced.
 
2.If not, are you looking at balanced headphones or a balanced amp in the future?
 
Yes, I'm looking to recable my sextett and HD650 to balanced if i get a balanced amp,
Edit: would be really nice if that balanced amp would be something that can power orthodynamics as i hope to go down that road in the future. (*wink cough* balanced lyr)
 
3.For balanced headphone output, how important is it to have dual three-pin XLRs as well as a 4-pin XLR?
 
It doesn't really matter for me, because it only changes the way in which i have to have my cables terminated.
 
4.For a balanced amp, how important is it to also have single-ended outputs?
 
I think it would be very very nice to have single ended outputs, as in please please please put them in. I want to be able to use my other stuff as well as other's stuff on it.
 
5.If single-ended is important, is the quality of the single-ended outputs as important as the balanced outputs, or is this more of a “utility” thing so you can use all kinds of different headphones?
 
It's very important for me to have a good quality single ended output. I see this as a way for me to enjoy my other headphones without recabling them, some of my headphones i would never recable due to fear of damaging them, such as my K501.
 
 
Aug 24, 2011 at 1:23 AM Post #179 of 217
 
Do you have balanced headphones? If so, which ones?

HE-5LE

 

 

If not, are you looking at balanced headphones or a balanced amp in the future?

Almost balanced with a 4-wire cable (I can attach my own XLR plug easily): HD650, modified Fostex T50RP, SR125, recabled M50

(Although for the last two, I wonder how practical it will be to drive them balanced since they are quite sensitive.)

 
I don't currently own a balanced amp, but I do plan to own one in the future.
 

 

For balanced headphone output, how important is it to have dual three-pin XLRs as well as a 4-pin XLR?

I don't care for 3-pin XLRs.

4-pin is the way to go IMO. Easier and cheaper for me to convert my single-ended headphones to balanced that way.

 

 

For a balanced amp, how important is it to also have single-ended outputs?

Nice to have if it doesn't add much to the cost, but not important. And if I win the Valhalla, then there's a quality single-ended output right there! :)

 

 

If single-ended is important, is the quality of the single-ended outputs as important as the balanced outputs, or is this more of a “utility” thing so you can use all kinds of different headphones?

Single-ended output on a balanced amp is not important to me. But if it were to be included, I would want it to be good quality.

My ranked preference--

1st: Quality balanced only

1st: Quality balanced + quality single-ended

3rd: Quality balanced + meh single-ended

 

 

 

 
Aug 24, 2011 at 2:54 AM Post #180 of 217
Do you have balanced headphones? If so, which ones?

Ultrasone PRO 900 

For balanced headphone output, how important is it to have dual three-pin XLRs as well as a 4-pin XLR?

Dual 3-pin seems like a bit much


For a balanced amp, how important is it to also have single-ended outputs?

Not important


If single-ended is important, is the quality of the single-ended outputs as important as the balanced outputs, or is this more of a “utility” thing so you can use all kinds of different headphones?

if you're going to add anything quality is a big factor
 

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