[Articnoise]

 
Well, I am not a computer expert at all and sometimes I struggle to keep up with discussions I see on these boards. But my plan is to run Roon Server (not Roon Core) on a late 2015 iMac with a Skylake Quad Core 3.2 GHz Intel Core i5 processor (6500). My friend transitioned from Roon Core to Roon Server on his Mac and believes it has made his system more stable. If you are not familiar with Roon Server, this might be helpful:  https://community.roonlabs.com/t/how-do-i-move-my-library-over-to-roonserver/3195.
 
I will try the Roon/HQP/NAA mode on the microRendu and will run HQP on the same iMac that I'm running Roon Server on. So, if you are looking at the diagram that Roy helpfully provided from Andrew Gillis, I would be combining the functions of the Sonic Transporter and the Mac Mini. As in the diagram, my music would be on an external hard drive connected to my iMac. The question that I have is whether my late 2015 iMac is completely up to the task, since I am also using it as my primary office computer. My hope is that it will be sufficiently powerful to do the job and that the microRendu in HQP/NAA mode will provide sufficient isolation so that the music signal remains as pure as possible upon leaving the microRendu. 
 
The only other change that I would have in my system, compared to the diagram, is that I would be running Roon Remote on a MacBook Pro laptop, rather than an iPad, since the only iPad we have is too old to run Roon. iPad is probably preferable but it's not a big deal for me. 
 
As Andrew Gillis states, I would be wary of running Roon on a NAS. My friend stores his music on a NAS, but he runs Roon Server and HQP on a quad core MacBook Pro. He has experienced some hiccups when playing DSD but he thinks that might be because he is also using optical fiber to insulate his ethernet connection (some people have reported similar problems when using fiber). He'll probably remove the fiber and see what happens. 

 

Thank again!

 

If I get you right you will have your iMac to work both as a server for the software and to get access to your external hard drive. You will when connect the iMac to a modem/router. The mR is connected to the modem/router in one end with an Ethernet cable, so separated so to speak. The mR is in the other end connected to the DAC or DDC. Looks easy. I guess I can do the same but instead of iMac use my PC. I’m still a bit worried about the noise from the iMac or in my case PC? Some pollution can travel thru the power cord and affect amp and DAC that way. Well I will see if I can use another outlet for the PC or something.

 

[shuttlepod]

   

Thank again!

 

If I get you right you will have your iMac to work both as a server for the software and to get access to your external hard drive. You will when connect the iMac to a modem/router. The mR is connected to the modem/router in one end with an Ethernet cable, so separated so to speak. The mR is in the other end connected to the DAC or DDC. Looks easy. I guess I can do the same but instead of iMac use my PC. I’m still a bit worried about the noise from the iMac or in my case PC? Some pollution can travel thru the power cord and affect amp and DAC that way. Well I will see if I can use another outlet for the PC or something.

Well, Articnoise, I think that you and I would be using the iMac/PC for the same thing (to run Roon Server, run HQP, and access files on an external drive), and we have the same concerns. One difference may be that my computer and router will be located a long way from my audio system (they are in opposite corners of the house), and so there is a long run of ethernet cable through my attic that goes to a wall outlet near my audio system, where I will connect a short run of ethernet cable to a switch, and then another short run to the mR. The computer and hard disk will be plugged into an old PS Audio 300 power regenerator that I've repurposed in my office. 
 
As far as noise that the computer might generate that could travel down the ethernet line (or any noise that the ethernet line might pick up from other sources), my hope is that the mR goes a long way towards isolating that noise from the dac. This is what people are reporting, and Roy on this thread has said it betters any server he's heard with the DAVE, so that's a very strong and credible statement. If the Roon/HQPlayer/NAA mode can provide some additional isolation, then that's one more stake in the heart of computer noise. My friend Ken has told me the difference between running Roon/HQPlayer/NAA and running Roon/RAAT is like the difference heard when upgrading to a significantly better USB cord. That analogy, of course, is already dated as Roy recently compared lots of USB cords in his DAVE/mR setup and found only very small differences. But if you think back to just last year and you've experienced what a good USB cable upgrade can do, then you can appreciate the difference that HQPlayer can reportedly make.  Bear in mind my friend is using a Chord Mojo; with the DAVE, these differences may be smaller or may vanish. Perhaps Roy can enlighten us after he experiments with HQP (I'm just assuming you're headed down that road, Roy). 
 
Once again, I'm just reporting what some others say; I have not done these comparisons myself -- yet. 

 

[romaz]

 

I’m still a bit worried about the noise from the iMac or in my case PC? Some pollution can travel thru the power cord and affect amp and DAC that way...

  As far as noise that the computer might generate that could travel down the ethernet line (or any noise that the ethernet line might pick up from other sources), my hope is that the mR goes a long way towards isolating that noise from the dac. 

"Isolation" is one of the chief benefits of the Roon end point concept and I think the mR implements it better than anything I have yet to hear.  In my quest to build the "ultimate music server" just 8 months ago, I spoke with a variety of people including the likes of Paul Pang, John Baetis, Phil Hobi and Paul Hynes and it always boiled down to issues of "timing" and "noise."  Timing (or jitter) has become a non-issue with the DAVE but unfortunately, I am finding that noise has been more difficult to address.  
 
Unfortunately, a PC server environment is an extremely noisy place.  As I opened up my $9,000 CAD CAT late last year hoping to mimic some of the methods it used to address RF noise, I was impressed by how every bit of wire, all the chips, the sticks of RAM, the SSDs, SATA data and power cables and the entire inside of the chassis were wrapped in RF-dissipating paper.  Point-to-point wiring was employed to keep wire lengths to a minimum and there was zero bare wire exposed.  It was either insulated or wrapped in paper.  I was told hard drives and SSDs were a horrible source of noise and should be fed an independent source of power,  I was told the USB card should have an independent feed of clean power also and isolated from the rest of the system and so the power supply on this server was a custom 4-rail power supply that fed independent clean power to the SSDs, the CPU/system board and the USB card that connected to the DAC.  On top of that, I even applied an expensive Entreq grounding box with an expensive grounding cable to ground the signal and remove any RF that somehow crept into the signal and then installed a USB Regen fed by an independent power supply and combined with a well-shielded USB cable.  To combat network noise, I employed optical isolation and a fairly expensive SOtM shielded CAT 6 cable along with a separate RF filter.  Obviously, this amounted to thousands of dollars of money not just for specialized parts but also the labor required to apply all of these measures and while this setup very easily bested a basic Mac or PC, the mR I have now utilizing a $50 iFi power supply and stripped of any fancy cabling still sounds better than my highly optimized CAD CAT ever did.  
 
As you know, I also have the sonicTransporter with internal SSD storage and so I was eager to see if this made a difference.  I even connected the sonicTransporter to an HD Plex linear PSU and powered it with an expensive High Fidelity CT-1 mains cable.  Because I had a few AQ Jitterbugs lying around, I installed 2 of those into the free USB ports as well.  How does this compare against my noisy Mac (with a 12-core Xeon) connected to the wall with a standard mains cable which is then connected to a noisy router 50 feet away and to a standard Seagate NAS 20 feet away?  I can detect zero difference.  That is how well the mR is isolated.
 
I know this is all hard to believe and so you will want to do your own testing but I would strongly suggest that you not go out and buy a lot of expensive peripherals just yet.  Wait until you get your mR and hear for yourself how good your stock setup sounds before you try to improve it.

 

[Articnoise]

Thanks Roy and Jon can’t wait to hear the mR in my system.

 

Btw I have used the HQP desktop (native sample rate PCM) for two year and it gives me a clearer and more refine sound than all other media player I have tried. 

 

[jelt2359]

Does the microrendu benefit from something like the Mutec 3+ USB?

 

[romaz]

Does the microrendu benefit from something like the Mutec 3+ USB?

I'm not familiar with this device although it would be interesting to see if it would make a difference.  The microRendu already incorporates an improved version of the USB Regen (both the microRendu and USB Regen were created by the same guy, John Swensen) that has more tightly regulated ultra low noise power and an even lower jitter clock than the original.  There have been reports by some on CA that stacking USB Regens has provided improved SQ in some systems but with the microRendu, unless you are using a reclocking device that has an even better clock and even lower noise (<1uV), there's a good chance that device would actually "dumb down" the microRendu and lead to worse SQ.

 

[Acrobat77]

I feel a device like the Mutec MC-3+USB as a USB to S/PDIF or AES3 converter sometimes rather "helps" the DAC more than the source. But of course it can do both too. In this case a great source like the microRendu together with a Mutec makes a great combination and bypasses the DAC internal USB receiver which seems to help things forward in many cases even with well known HQ DAC's.

I'm very happy with the combination into the AES/EBU input of my Devialet D250. The microRendu has replaced my DIY music server. (FYI, full system details here: http://www.head-fi.org/t/803111/xmos-xu208-usb-bridges-the-latest-gen-has-arrived/2385#post_12637648)

 

[romaz]

I feel a device like the Mutec MC-3+USB as a USB to S/PDIF or AES3 converter sometimes rather "helps" the DAC more than the source. But of course it can do both too. In this case a great source like the microRendu together with a Mutec makes a great combination and bypasses the DAC internal USB receiver which seems to help things forward in many cases even with well known HQ DAC's.

I'm very happy with the combination into the AES/EBU input of my Devialet D250. The microRendu has replaced my DIY music server. (FYI, full system details here: http://www.head-fi.org/t/803111/xmos-xu208-usb-bridges-the-latest-gen-has-arrived/2385#post_12637648)

I'm glad it's working for you.  I have heard the Devialets sound best through AES/EBU.  Did you find it improved SQ through USB on your Devialet?

 

[romaz]

Finally, Chris Connaker's Part 2 review of the microRendu:
 
http://www.computeraudiophile.com/content/705-sonore-microrendu-review-part-2/

 

[TheAttorney]

I couldn't resist any longer and have put an order for the mR - from a UK dealer, as the price seemed to be in the same ballpark as direct from SGC (once shipping and import duties are taken into accoun).t.
 
This with the iFi power supply. I'll be interested to hear impressions of how the Paul Hynes power supply can take the mR further. Particularly in the light of Sonore recently announcing their own special power supply.

 

[romaz]

  I couldn't resist any longer and have put an order for the mR - from a UK dealer, as the price seemed to be in the same ballpark as direct from SGC (once shipping and import duties are taken into accoun).t.
 
This with the iFi power supply. I'll be interested to hear impressions of how the Paul Hynes power supply can take the mR further. Particularly in the light of Sonore recently announcing their own special power supply.

I don't think you'll regret it.  The risk is very low to find out.  Even with the basic iFi, I have yet to meet someone who hasn't noticed a significant step up compared to their current source but it could happen and if it does, I certainly would like to know what beats the mR.
 
I met a gentleman who has a complete Audionote system (2-channel) worth over $200k.  He is 90% vinyl and he wants to hear my mR/DAVE combination because his >$30k Audionote CD player/DAC can't touch his vinyl setup and so this one will be interesting because his system is one of the finest I have ever heard.  I will wait, however, until my Paul Hynes supply arrives before subjecting the mR to comparison against his vinyl rig.  I know the presentation will be "different" and so the question will be which is the more engaging.
 
My Paul Hynes arrives hopefully in 2-3 weeks and I have very high expectations.  It may suit you better living in the UK since the Sonore Signature PSU is 120V only and there is a $300 upcharge to convert it to 230V.  If you target a Paul Hynes, consider the SR5 with 7V output.  I suspect it will probably be the equivalent of the Sonore in terms of SQ upgrade and according to Chris Connaker, this upgrade is significant (he compared it as being equivalent to the difference between the Sonicorbiter SE and the mR).

 

[Narayan23]

Excuse my ignorance but does the microrendu require connection to a modem / router in every scenario? I live in a flat where the router is two rooms away from mine and connecting to it is not possible, is there any viable alternative?

 

[romaz]

  Excuse my ignorance but does the microrendu require connection to a modem / router in every scenario? I live in a flat where the router is two rooms away from mine and connecting to it is not possible, is there any viable alternative?

This is a fair question.  You don't need to connect it to a modem if you're not going to stream from the internet (i.e. Tidal) but you do need to connect it to a router because the mR needs to be assigned an IP address.  There are ways around this but you would need command line access from Sonore which Jesus or Andrew will not readily allow.
 
It is certainly possible to have more than 1 router in a home and they are not very expensive.  If you cannot access the router that is two rooms away, buy a second router and dedicate it to your listening room.  You will need to set it to DHCP (from what I have read, the mR cannot be assigned a static IP address).  You would connect the mR to this new router and then your server and/or NAS would also connect to this router.  This router will then assign each device an IP address and it becomes easy from there.

 

[Topspin70]

 Excuse my ignorance but does the microrendu require connection to a modem / router in every scenario? I live in a flat where the router is two rooms away from mine and connecting to it is not possible, is there any viable alternative?

This is a fair question.  You don't need to connect it to a modem if you're not going to stream from the internet (i.e. Tidal) but you do need to connect it to a router because the mR needs to be assigned an IP address.  There are ways around this but you would need command line access from Sonore which Jesus or Andrew will not readily allow.
 
It is certainly possible to have more than 1 router in a home and they are not very expensive.  If you cannot access the router that is two rooms away, buy a second router and dedicate it to your listening room.  You will need to set it to DHCP (from what I have read, the mR cannot be assigned a static IP address).  You would connect the mR to this new router and then your server and/or NAS would also connect to this router.  This router will then assign each device an IP address and it becomes easy from there.

I face a similar scenario. This is just what I was hoping to hear. I don't plan to stream so no need for internet access. But what about initial set up of the mR? Do I need Internet?

 

[romaz]

I face a similar scenario. This is just what I was hoping to hear. I don't plan to stream so no need for internet access. But what about initial set up of the mR? Do I need Internet?

You don't need internet access for initial setup but you would need it to upgrade firmware.  Roon would not be an option unless you at least had occasional internet access but JRiver or MPaD would be.