Resonessence Labs Concero discussion/review thead
May 22, 2013 at 4:40 PM Post #632 of 2,480
I think I need to disable my Headfi account for a while so I can just enjoy my setup.  Concero -> Bottlehead S.E.X. -> HD800 (balanced and Anaxilus modded) makes me very happy.  A truly great value/mid-fi rig.  I don't want to hear about better products that are just a little bit more expensive any more :)
 
May 22, 2013 at 4:59 PM Post #633 of 2,480
Quote:
I'm gonna take a wild guess and say a 5V socket for separate linear power supply/battery.

 
I was thinking this too and I'm hoping that's what we'll see. Makes sense given than the Concero HP also needs to drive a headphone amp.
 
May 22, 2013 at 5:12 PM Post #634 of 2,480
Quote:
 
I wish this could be it! To unleash the amp's power!
I don't see how relevant it would be on the HD version though, power "quality" aside?

It would make sense if the buyer want to "maximize" the Concero, but don't have enough finance at the moment of purchase.
 
Let's be honest, a slightly better Dac chip, and DSD support/or HP out isn't worth the extra dosh. The upgradability might ease your mind on that though =p.
 
It reminds me of the weird pricing of the Chord QuteHd I had, by itself it's a competent 1300 bucks dac; you can improve the sound by adding transport (Ap2), and feed it with a PSU. The cost however isn't worth the performance gain (compare to buy a new dac). But if you think about it, the PSU could be use for other dac or to power your own DIY amp/preamp/dac; so is the transport. 
 
Also it's not like you can't use separate PSU with the (current) Concero =p, just need a few workaround. I used this to have some fun with the Eximus Dp1 (the USB input also use V-bus power)
 

 
May 22, 2013 at 5:18 PM Post #635 of 2,480
Quote:
Any clues? 
size]

 
Are you allowed to say if it's on the software side or the hardware side? Is it exclusive to the HD and HP, or will it also extend to the original Concero?

 
Hardware side, which translates to new models only. A hint? It's something that no other DAC on the market currently has. 
bigsmile_face.gif

 
Quote:
I think I need to disable my Headfi account for a while so I can just enjoy my setup.  Concero -> Bottlehead S.E.X. -> HD800 (balanced and Anaxilus modded) makes me very happy.  A truly great value/mid-fi rig.  I don't want to hear about better products that are just a little bit more expensive any more :)

 
Nah, just be happy with what you've got and read for fun - that's a great setup!
 
May 22, 2013 at 5:22 PM Post #636 of 2,480
Quote:
 
Hardware side, which translates to new models only. A hint? It's something that no other DAC on the market currently has. 
bigsmile_face.gif

 
 
Nah, just be happy with what you've got and read for fun - that's a great setup!

Hmmm, how about using the Ess 9018 in current output mode? and the output stage needs to be of low impedance which acts as a headphone amp also? (or maybe the opposite, voltage output mode without an i/v stage)
 
I like this guessing game 
bigsmile_face.gif

 
May 22, 2013 at 5:59 PM Post #638 of 2,480
Quote:
Hmmm, how about using the Ess 9018 in current output mode? and the output stage needs to be of low impedance which acts as a headphone amp also? (or maybe the opposite, voltage output mode without an i/v stage)
 
I like this guessing game 
bigsmile_face.gif

 
Me too!
 
You're not right, but that's actually pretty close to how the ES9023 in the original Concero model works. It's got a 2Vrms line driver built in - normally used to drive the RCA outs but I've seen it configured for headphones a few times. 
 
May 23, 2013 at 6:49 AM Post #640 of 2,480
Maybe it has a LIGHT ORGAN built-in?
tongue_smile.gif

 

 
May 23, 2013 at 9:50 AM Post #641 of 2,480
Excellent review as usual Project 86.  I purposely did not read your great writeup until I had a chance to listen to the Concero myself and write it up for my blog.
 
I appreciate all the premier review work you are doing on new dacs.  It is a great help to the community.
 
cheers
 
May 24, 2013 at 2:02 AM Post #643 of 2,480
PREFACE
The reason why I chose this combination of Headphones is because all of them are unique to each other. Another reason was because they were readily available.
Amp choice was the Mjolnir as I felt my EF-5 Hybrid amp will not work as well with both the LCD-3 and HD800 (which was true) as it does with the HE-500. Also, I felt using S/S amps is better when comparing various headphones, especially with the cable selection I was presented with.
 
IMPORTANT: I can't remember if I mention this in the below, but THESE IMPRESSIONS ARE BASED OFF THE X-SABRE AND THE CONCERO, ONLY. This meaning that whatever I wrote below is there as a comparison to the other device so THIS DOES NOT REFLECT THE OVERALL SOUND OF THE ACTUAL PRODUCT, BUT IS THERE, AGAIN, AS A TOOL OF DESCRIBING. If I said something about the Concero sounding more warm, this does not mean the Concero is a warm sounding DAC generally speaking.
 
Also, I used IIR filter on the Concero primarily as it sounded a bit more engaging and forward.
 
 
EQUIPMENT:
Audeze LCD-3
Sennheiser HD800 (Anax Mod)
Hifiman HE-500 (Jergpads)
 
Matrix X-Sabre
Resonessence Labs Concero
 
Schiit Mjolnir
 
Various DHC and HPL cables
 
Only used 1/4" connections for fair game sake and to eliminate any benefits balanced connections may offer.
FLAC and WAV used, ranging from 44.1-192k and 16-24bit.
Foobar2k+WASAPI
 
 
 

 
 
 
DAY 1
 
HE-500 w/ X-Sabre + Mjolnir (compared to the Concero)
Certainly more relaxed than the Concero. The X-Sabre is known for its smoothness and as a relatively calm DAC, which I concur. The HE-500 portrays fantastically detailed midrange and treble and I feel this combo works to each others favour. Besides the Mjolnir adding more attack and a sense of immediacy, I felt the X-Sabre was communicating well with the HE-500 in terms of trying to replay music in an honest and natural way. If I had to pick the X-Sabre apart, I did find one or two things that bothered me a little. Somewhere in the middle treble area, there was definitely something weird going on. It’s almost like tiny glare, but sort of isn’t. Really difficult to describe what I was hearing. The Concero did not have this issue. (DAY 2 report: I concluded that it’s not really a glare problem, but more of a decay issue. The treble can sound a little “slow” and this caused my issue with the treble. Also, the bass doesn’t sound as defined as the mids or treble, it just wasn’t as tight or refined as the Concero. Impact was certainly there, just couldn’t hold it together well enough. Shame. Also felt a little lack of engagement compared to the Concero, but that doesn’t surprise me as the X-Sabre is a more polite sounding DAC. To add to the polite characteristic, it was a very smooth sounding DAC in many areas. If I had to generalize, the bass and treble is fairly flat and the mids is slightly brought down.
 
Conclusion with the X-Sabre + HE-500
With the HE-500, it sounded pretty darn good. The X-Sabre was definitely one of those DACs that are less dynamic and less intrusive. It is what I would call a pretty good representation of an “honest” sound without adding or taking away too many things to change the overall response too much. Sometimes I found the X-Sabre to sound a little dull, but that’s because it’s neutral in a sense where it accentuates very little.
 
HE-500 w/ Concero + Mjolnir (compared to the X-Sabre)
Running IIR Filter as it sounds the most pleasant with the HE-500. Also, I’m limited on time with the Mjolnir, LCD-3 and X-Sabre so for simplicity I stuck with this filter mostly.
The X-Sabre seemed to match well with almost every headphone as it is a less intrusive and “universal” sounding product, but to my surprise the Concero and HE-500 matched just as well. The bass was definitely “better” with the Concero. It possesses a natural, slightly powerful attitude here. I wouldn’t call it forward, but it certainly sings more compared to the X-Sabre. Texture, impact and depth are other points where the Concero differs from the X-Sabre. It’s definitely a more engaging DAC, very different from the X-Sabre where it’s calmer. Midrange sounds more liquid and again, more engaging. Detail is, give or take, on the same level as the X-Sabre, but the X-Sabre seems to do things more effortlessly while the Concero seems a microstep behind in comparison. Even though I had a slight issue with the X-Sabre where some songs had a minor (most likely insignificant in most conditions) glare in the mid-ish treble, the Concero has the tendency to be a tad sibilant at times. Other than that, tone and detail is still up to and exceeding standards. A little more energy than the X-Sabre causing it to sound a bit brighter, but again, it’s all within reasonable limits where it’s not intrusive in anyway. But to be honest, it’s fairly easy to distinguish the difference in sibilance because the X-Sabre has almost no sibilance issues whereas the added energy in the Concero brings sibilance to more audible levels, which makes complete sense.
 
Conclusion with the Concero + HE-500
I found the Concero and HE-500 to match very well together, but I did find the Mjolnir to sometimes make the HE-500 a little too shouty due to the sound profile of the amp. With a different amp, the HE-500 and Concero sounds remarkable together, specifically my modded EF-5 amp. But we’re talking about key differences here right? Think of it as this, the Concero is the slightly warmer and musical DAC whereas the X-Sabre is the more linear and “neutral” (whatever neutral really means in today’s society) DAC. The Concero has the more weighty bass, more liquid and engaging mids, and the more energetic treble. With this characteristic in the mids, the X-Sabre does sound a little more open, but that is mostly because the X-Sabre is one of the most unstressed sounding DACs I’ve heard. Quality throughout the entire spectrum is remarkable, comparable to the X-Sabre, and manages to add some music elements here and there making the HE-500 truly sing. Very pleased with my purchase of the Concero, I can see myself keeping it for a long time.
 
 
 

 
 
 
DAY 2
 
HD800 (Anax mod) w/ X-Sabre + Mjolnir (Compared to Concero)
With the HD800, I expected to find some things I couldn’t find with the HE-500 or the LCD-3 as the HD800 is known to be a very revealing headphone, and up to expectations, I can add more with the HD800. Don’t get me wrong, the HE-500 is also a revealing and detailed headphone, but the HD800 is so much more detailed and punishes poor recordings. The main differences were in the soundstage and treble. With the soundstage, the X-Sabre sounded a touch wider and a touch more depth. The X-Sabre also retrieved micro-details and background sounds/cues better than the Concero, meaning the X-Sabre was the more detailed sounding DAC. This is interesting because with the HE-500, I thought they were pretty even, with the X-Sabre having a minimal edge over the Concero, but with the HD800 it became a little clearer on who was more detailed. To my surprise, the X-Sabre managed to sing better with the HD800 than with the HE-500, live Jazz recordings were very fun. Oh so smooth all around, and the treble was clearer as well.
 
Conclusion with the X-Sabre + HD800
More detailed and slightly better imaging and soundstage. Other than that, the X-Sabre can be seen as more “dead” sounding. Still has plenty of attack and definition, but just lacks some dynamic properties the Concero possesses.
 
HD800 (Anax mod) W/ Concero + Mjolnir (Compared to X-Sabre)
This is what I prefer. Right away, I love how the Concero (with the IIR filter) makes the HD800 smile more. At face value, Concero is more fun sounding than the X-Sabre. I primarily used Live Jazz when comparing the two with the HD800 and boy does the Concero bring musicality. Yes, the X-Sabre is slightly more detailed, but with that compromise, the Concero likes to sing more. It’s certainly a bit faster on its feet, and noticeably more energetic in almost every aspect. I truly enjoyed some Live in Paris with Diana Krall as it kept giving me positive vibes. Was the treble slightly more sibilant than the X-Sabre like with the HE-500? Yes, still the same story, but strangely it wasn’t as noticeable. The Concero possesses the livelier ambiance and just expresses itself better in a musical way. This can be confused with the Concero being coloured, but remember, this is a DIRECT comparison compared to the X-Sabre and can be seen as magnified and multiplied.
 
Conclusion with the Concero + HD800
Loses to the X-Sabre in quality, but in compensation, the Concero is more fun. This doesn’t mean the Concero is lacking quality, just not AS detailed as the X-Sabre. Yes, the X-Sabre is smoother, but the Concero is no slouch as well. From the sounds of it, both the Concero and the X-Sabre works well with the HD800, but I’m sure a better synergy can be acquired with a different choice of amp. It’s hard to choose between the two, they both do so many things right.
 
 
 

 
 
 
DAY 3
 
There is no day 3. I had to return the Mjolnir and returned everything else at once to the rightful owner.
Sorry for no LCD-3 impressions. However, I did try the LCD-3 with both, but not enough to give detailed answers. More or less the same as the above, but sounded fantastic as well.
 
 
 

 
 
 
CONCLUSION
 
I'll try to make this nice and simple. If you absolutely need Balanced, DSD playback, and a super articulate and smooth DAC, get the X-Sabre. If you desire a lower cost DAC, want kick-ass performance that competes with high-end DACs EASILY, and a slightly more energetic sound compared to the X-Sabre with plenty of detail, get the Concero. The Concero impressed me IMMENSELY with its small footprint (REALLY small footprint) and big sound. Also, for $600... Wow... A genuine product product that's DEFINITELY worth buying @ the current MSRP... The X-Sabre impressed me with its overall smooth signature and beautiful looks. It's not an absolute steal at the current MSRP like the Concero, but it definitely holds up to its own. I find the Concero to be something that performs far greater than its initial thoughts based on price and looks. As an overall DAC (every feature each DAC has to offer), the X-Sabre is the better product, but if it was my money, I would buy the Concero as I don't need Balanced and the Concero just sounds sweeter to me.
 

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