[nfandi]

Ah, that one probably needs to be addressed a bit. I think the latter point about measuring on any HATS or dummy head that has a pinna making it specific to the condition of that head and ears is a good thing to consider. However... you do always have to measure using some pinna because that's how it's actually used in practice. So there's an ear physically inside the space, and it's part of the system created by coupling the headphone to the side of the head - what gets created when actually wearing the headphone. This is also why industry standard measurement equipment is designed to be anthropometric - you're giving an indication of how a human could hear these products. Is it every human? no. Is it the average human? not necessarily. And there are valid questions about how great the variation is for pinna effects across a wide population. But at the very least it's humanlike. It wouldn't make sense to put any other ear in there, nor would it make sense to put no ear in there.

I love this. I’m thinking we need at least 2 measurements here. We need one totally neutral measurement that measures the headphone’s natural transfer function without any interactions with a head or ear transfer function. And then a second measure against a recognised standard clone/dummy that does include the transfer function. How this would then correlate to any individual’s actual hearing would have to be developed.

 

[BassicScience]

I love this. I’m thinking we need at least 2 measurements here. We need one totally neutral measurement that measures the headphone’s natural transfer function without any interactions with a head or ear transfer function. And then a second measure against a recognised standard clone/dummy that does include the transfer function. How this would then correlate to any individual’s actual hearing would have to be developed.

Sounds reasonable, and potentially interesting. In the meantime, one could also simply listen to the headphones.

 

[AxelCloris]

[mod comment]

Hey folks, quick reminder this thread is for the RAAL 1995 Immanis. We welcome folks who would like to debate measurements, transfer functions, and the like to start a new thread or take part in the myriad threads already going on those topics so everyone who want to share their subjective listening impressions for the Immanis here in the thread. Discussion not related to the Immanis is considered off-topic in this thread. Thanks everyone!

 

[chrisyak]

Well, I have decided to purchase a pair for my reviewing purposes. Maybe headphones.com can do the same, your site has a lot more budget than mine, so it should not be a problem? or you could personally just outright purchase for review purposes like I did? I didn't think anyone was going to send me a pair for review purpose's.

Attention everyone

The moderators of this site decided that I should no longer comment in this thread. They have decided to remove a majority of my posts from yesterday and banned me from this thread from any more communication with everyone. I find this laughable because we were calling out the headphones.com people for making what was called irresponsible impressions and this resulted in a healthy debate and conversation. However, the moderators decided they were going to be dictators of our conversations and decided that only the headphones.com people should have their posts published and they removed all of mine. They decided my freedom of speech and first amendment rights were not worthy.

Then later on had someone post about my article that was outside of this forum that I had written. I am not 100% Pulitzer prize winning writer so I write a rough draft and I use an AI tool to help me clean it up. Well somebody decided that that was all AI written. Let's just say AI must be amazing because of all the facts and information that was in there. I'm not even going to address that because it's rather silly.

What I am here to talk about is the heavy-handed approach that the moderators have taken with censoring the information on this forum. They decided everything I had written wasn't worthy of being posted. That or it did not align with the headphones.com partnership that they have and didn't want their partners to be upset. That or someone from their organization decided to report me and because of the weight that they carry they decided to remove my posts. I was not given any warning or even a message of why my posts were removed or why I was blocked from posting in this group.

Based on my research, this is not the first time this has happened and it won't be the last time. A lot of people end up disappearing if they post things that goes against what the moderators say. If that person's views or opinions do not align with the moderators, people tend to get banned and removed from head-fi forums all together.

My posts are not reinstated and my access to this forum, I will use my first amendment rights as I see fit in this Injustice. This is a place for people to come and share their opinions and express themselves. My comments were all in regards to the Raal Immanis and we're on topic 110%. I am sure they will find a way or an excuse to silence me and remove this post.

My constitutional right has been violated in this forum, This is censorship equivalent to what we see in China where if your message is not in line with what they believe is acceptable, it will be removed. Let this be a lesson to everyone in the forums that big brother is watching you and if they don't agree with what you've said, you will be censored.

 

[GoldenSound]

Well, I have decided to purchase a pair for my reviewing purposes. Maybe headphones.com can do the same, your site has a lot more budget than mine, so it should not be a problem? or you could personally just outright purchase for review purposes like I did? I didn't think anyone was going to send me a pair for review purpose's.

Spending nearly 10k on one review isn't really feasible unfortunately

 

[GoldenSound]

Im not saying that at all (though will refrain from going further on that topic since the mods have said that is indeed off topic)

Regarding the immanis, my impressions had nothing to do with measurements. They were listening impressions. And I've not 'refused' to make further comments. I've spoken further on the immanis several times in various places both after that and after hearing it more and on different chains at other times.

 

[fidgeraldo]

Unfortunately no one I know in the UK yet has a unit

Why don't you buy one...you have fonds (Headphones.com)?
Then, you can resell it with minimum loss...
I wouldn't call it a loss, I would call it an investment in what you do anyway...

Cheers!

 

[GoldenSound]

Why don't you buy one...you have fonds (Headphones.com)?
Then, you can resell it with minimum loss...
I wouldn't call it a loss, I would call it an investment in what you do anyway...

Cheers!

The used market is pretty rough at the moment.

It'd still likely be at least a couple thousand dollar loss, and there's no reason to do so when we will be able to borrow a unit from someone in future anyway.

There isn't a multi-thousand dollar reason to review the headphone right now rather than waiting.

I (and headphones.com) don't generally purchase things for review unless it's a product that there would be no way of getting ahold of otherwise, or it's something extremely time critical that we cannot get a review unit of without having to buy it. (often happens with more commercial products like samsung/apple stuff for instance)

Otherwise it'd just be constantly burning money.

 

[jlbrach]

Why is everyone required to like this headphone? The reviewers who don't like it have the right to their opinions just as they have on other headphones. They are professional reviewers who have respected names in our community and accusing them of rushed judgement is hard to believe. They are known to be very well thought out reviewers.

Why does everyone have to agree with those who love these headphones? For those who love it- enjoy your blessing. For those who don't, and who express their feelings in a proper way,- why do those who do like the headphone have a need to defend their likings by accusing the reviewers of doing their job wrong? Why not allow freedom of speech without having to be so defensive?

head-fi is a place for us to share our opinions. Perhaps trying to debunk highly respected reviewers because we disagree with them is a sign that the criticizers are insecure about their position. Adults can agree to disagree in a friendly, proper manner without discrediting others or getting into attack mode.

I am so happy for those who love this or any other piece of equipment and appreciate the expressions of what you love about your equipment, but I respect those who want to express their dislikes as well. Censoring the "dislikers" by discrediting them is unacceptable. This is how we learn and share and become more enabled to make purchasing decisions- by hearing many takes from differet perspectives.

as one who absolutely loves the Immanis I do not understand this controversy?...there have been tons of great reviews some people saying it is the best HP they ever heard..all sorts of respected people on here who love it...so a few people dont care for it?...why all the concern and histrionics?...who cares?

 

[jlbrach]

I do not want to come across as condescending but this threat has become truly boring....listen to the immanis,if you like it buy it..if you do not dont....all HP's have pluses and minuses and we all look for the headphone that works best for us...debating all this nonsense is tiresome...ok, I said it

 

[tjkohli]

I really just want to go back to a time when we were just talking about Immanis.
So here's a cool picture I took of @ApertureSilence's Immanis (with a cameo of my 1:1 Verité Open and T+A HA 200 in the background).

 

[Aleksandar R.]

What is flat?
I mean how you define what flat FR of headphone is.

This is more than flat enough, by any definition:

https://accuratesound.ca/product/raal-requisite-ca-1a-filterset/

By my definition, exploiting up to +/-2.5dB deviations (with my own measuring method) from a ruler-flat is OK.

As it was noted by Immanis users, it shows great differences between DACs, amps, recordings, so it's not overdone in a way that will make it sound genre specific.

Now, you will inevitably see measurements floating around that will go over that target number, but those measurement will not explain why it shows such great differences in components of the chain and why it doesn't really prefer any genre.

Anyhow, the demo unit for Warsaw AVS has been sent yesterday, so you have a chance to evaluate them yourself, at AVSor later.
Whatever I tell you, will not have anything to do with whether you will like them or not, but please let me know how they were for you, once you have a listen.

 

[alxw0w]

This is more than flat enough, by any definition:

https://accuratesound.ca/product/raal-requisite-ca-1a-filterset/

By my definition, exploiting up to +/-2.5dB deviations (with my own measuring method) from a ruler-flat is OK.

As it was noted by Immanis users, it shows great differences between DACs, amps, recordings, so it's not overdone in a way that will make it sound genre specific.

Now, you will inevitably see measurements floating around that will go over that target number, but those measurement will not explain why it shows such great differences in components of the chain and why it doesn't really prefer any genre.

Anyhow, the demo unit for Warsaw AVS has been sent yesterday, so you have a chance to evaluate them yourself, at AVSor later.
Whatever I tell you, will not have anything to do with whether you will like them or not, but please let me know how they were for you, once you have a listen.

Oh I see flat is flat to Mitch's target, ok.

 

[Aleksandar R.]

Oh I see flat is flat to Mitch's target, ok.

As far as I know, Mitch isn't using a target (like "Harman Curve"), if that's what you mean.

 

[alxw0w]

As far as I know, Mitch isn't using a target (like "Harman Curve"), if that's what you mean.

It doesn't mean what is he using.
My point is "there is no flat" as the famous saying from Matrix "there is no spoon"

ps. anyway I'm planing to visit AVS Warsaw on friday, hope to get my hand on Immanis.
ps2. I've tried some of the filters done by Mitch and I'm quite familiar with his approach.