Project Ember Tube Rolling
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Hello guys, would you mind telling your 'secret' of which 7193 tubes are giving such great performance (or is there only one brand of 7193)? Also anything more descriptive on how they sound would be excellent for us all to know, such as the high/mid/lows, clarity, impact, vocal presentation, etc.
Also @Amish great, after you get the 7193 please let us know your impression of how it compares to your other smaller tubes.
PS- sorry if my messages may sound a little 'off' sometimes - it's a little hard to make things come off as intended in written form.
Also @Amish great, after you get the 7193 please let us know your impression of how it compares to your other smaller tubes.
PS- sorry if my messages may sound a little 'off' sometimes - it's a little hard to make things come off as intended in written form.
richard51
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Kenrad is the best and national union second.... for 7193 tubes..... its simple, all is better across the range.. soundstage is better definite and all frequencies are more vivid... and that is the same on my speakers or on my hifiman he 400...if you read on the internet you will discover many favorable reviews of people who goes from 6sn7 good tubes toward 7193 better tubes...I had not discovered one negative review on the net,( hence i bought several tubes) here is a sample of reviews from different sources:
«National Union vs RCA vs Ken-Rad 7193 tubes.
Since I have converted my Chenin to 7193s, I have been evaluating the different brands of 7193s available (in addition to enjoying the great sound!). Let me say that they are all excellent tubes, but there are some subtle differences between them, both in sound and in construction. All have black, relatively flat plates, with small boxes in the center.
National Union: The NUs have the smallest bottle of the three 7193s, and the getter is not visible from the exterior of the tubes. They have a round top and bottom mica. These were the first 7193s I ever heard, and they sound very good indeed. These are silky smooth, with a rich midrange. They are a little rolled off on the extremes compared to the other two tubes, but it is a not a huge difference.
RCA: The RCAs have a larger bottle than the NUs, with a bottom getter and round top and bottom mica. They have more extended highs and lows than the NUs, with fuller bass and a little more detail on top. Not quite as smooth as the NUs, and not quite as warm in the midrange.
Ken-Rad: The biggest bottle of the three, slightly larger than the RCA, with bottom getter and non-round top and bottom mica (looks like a round mica with a section cut out in each quadrant). The best bass of the three - the impact of kick drums is sensational, and bass lines can be felt and heard in great detail. The highs are nice and airy, with very good detail, and the midrange is very sweet as well.
So overall, in my opinion, I would rank the 7193s as follows:
Ken-Rad: best overall - it has everything
National Union: smoothest and warmest sounding, but a little less top and bottom than the others
RCA: Similar to the Ken-Rad, but not quite as smooth in the highs.»
«The ultimate 6SN7 for me wasn't a 6SN7 at all. I replaced the 6SN7s in my Supratek Chenin preamp with CCS loaded 2C22 single triodes, biased to 3.4V using (4) Cree SiC Schottky Diodes on the cathode. To say they were MUCH MUCH better is an understatement. The 2C22 is roughly equivalent to 1/2 of a 6SN7, but the anode and grid are taken out via top caps.
Bass is clearer and more defined, mids are to die for, treble is sparkling without being grating. Using the CCS I am able to replace both sections of the 6SN7 with a single 2C22 and still have plenty of gain.
What is magic is the 2C22/7193, but that's 6.6k Rp and two top caps. Mind, that's where the magic is if that's what you want and you have a high input impedence on your amp. I thank my lucky stars i came across that tube.»
«I converted my 6SN7 preamp to 2C22 and there's no going back - better high, lows, spatial rendition, tone, etc. I run them at 14.6mA, 175V, CCS on plate, Cree SiC Shottky diodes for bias,
I couldn't believe my ears when I heard the 2C22 a few years ago - it made all 6SN7s sound boring».
«I know the 2C22 stage sounds excellent - almost DHT.»
«In my experience, the 7193 is sonically superior to any 6sn7 regardless of manufacture... nos or otherwise.
Comparatively speaking: the 7193's sonic signature is a combination of the best of the 6sn7 family.
Combine the bass power and depth of the Kenrad black, the 3 dimentional midrange of the old tungsol round plate,the bloom of the Rca grey glass with the treble extention of the best nos sylvania's.
Although a little more difficult to find these days, they generally sell for a fraction of the cost of the nos 6sn7's.»
«National Union vs RCA vs Ken-Rad 7193 tubes.
Since I have converted my Chenin to 7193s, I have been evaluating the different brands of 7193s available (in addition to enjoying the great sound!). Let me say that they are all excellent tubes, but there are some subtle differences between them, both in sound and in construction. All have black, relatively flat plates, with small boxes in the center.
National Union: The NUs have the smallest bottle of the three 7193s, and the getter is not visible from the exterior of the tubes. They have a round top and bottom mica. These were the first 7193s I ever heard, and they sound very good indeed. These are silky smooth, with a rich midrange. They are a little rolled off on the extremes compared to the other two tubes, but it is a not a huge difference.
RCA: The RCAs have a larger bottle than the NUs, with a bottom getter and round top and bottom mica. They have more extended highs and lows than the NUs, with fuller bass and a little more detail on top. Not quite as smooth as the NUs, and not quite as warm in the midrange.
Ken-Rad: The biggest bottle of the three, slightly larger than the RCA, with bottom getter and non-round top and bottom mica (looks like a round mica with a section cut out in each quadrant). The best bass of the three - the impact of kick drums is sensational, and bass lines can be felt and heard in great detail. The highs are nice and airy, with very good detail, and the midrange is very sweet as well.
So overall, in my opinion, I would rank the 7193s as follows:
Ken-Rad: best overall - it has everything
National Union: smoothest and warmest sounding, but a little less top and bottom than the others
RCA: Similar to the Ken-Rad, but not quite as smooth in the highs.»
«The ultimate 6SN7 for me wasn't a 6SN7 at all. I replaced the 6SN7s in my Supratek Chenin preamp with CCS loaded 2C22 single triodes, biased to 3.4V using (4) Cree SiC Schottky Diodes on the cathode. To say they were MUCH MUCH better is an understatement. The 2C22 is roughly equivalent to 1/2 of a 6SN7, but the anode and grid are taken out via top caps.
Bass is clearer and more defined, mids are to die for, treble is sparkling without being grating. Using the CCS I am able to replace both sections of the 6SN7 with a single 2C22 and still have plenty of gain.
What is magic is the 2C22/7193, but that's 6.6k Rp and two top caps. Mind, that's where the magic is if that's what you want and you have a high input impedence on your amp. I thank my lucky stars i came across that tube.»
«I converted my 6SN7 preamp to 2C22 and there's no going back - better high, lows, spatial rendition, tone, etc. I run them at 14.6mA, 175V, CCS on plate, Cree SiC Shottky diodes for bias,
I couldn't believe my ears when I heard the 2C22 a few years ago - it made all 6SN7s sound boring».
«I know the 2C22 stage sounds excellent - almost DHT.»
«In my experience, the 7193 is sonically superior to any 6sn7 regardless of manufacture... nos or otherwise.
Comparatively speaking: the 7193's sonic signature is a combination of the best of the 6sn7 family.
Combine the bass power and depth of the Kenrad black, the 3 dimentional midrange of the old tungsol round plate,the bloom of the Rca grey glass with the treble extention of the best nos sylvania's.
Although a little more difficult to find these days, they generally sell for a fraction of the cost of the nos 6sn7's.»
richard51
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i listen now to my transsubstantiate Hifiman He-400 with my FrankenEmber
connieflyer
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Hope you enjoy it as much as I have, good listening
richard51
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i listen now to my transsubstantiate Hifiman He-400 with my FrankenEmber
Looking at this picture I'm can't imagine not accidently not knocking them over
punkaroo
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I purchased a pair of Mad Dogs with Alpha Pads off a HF user a few months back. I just received my Ember 2.0, and my Amperex "Orange Globe" 12AT7 tube from eBay. I purchased a Tung Sol 12AT7 from Jeremy, but found it just "okay". It's not very engaging or fun.
I'm listening to the Orange Globe right now, and I'm VERY happy with it. It's fun, but clear, and there's great instrument separation in all types of music thus far. Highs are crisp without being fatiguing, and the bottom end is punchy and controlled. Mids are beautiful.
I'm eagerly trying to get my hands on a Telefunken 12AX7; heard one years ago in a MapleTree Audio amp and fell it love with it with my Grados. Also have my eye on a Harman Kardon branded, made by Telefunken 12AT7. Damn you eBay, LOL!
I'm very impressed with Jeremy's level of service. I had a million questions for him start to finish, and he's extremely patient and kind, and FAST!
I'm listening to the Orange Globe right now, and I'm VERY happy with it. It's fun, but clear, and there's great instrument separation in all types of music thus far. Highs are crisp without being fatiguing, and the bottom end is punchy and controlled. Mids are beautiful.
I'm eagerly trying to get my hands on a Telefunken 12AX7; heard one years ago in a MapleTree Audio amp and fell it love with it with my Grados. Also have my eye on a Harman Kardon branded, made by Telefunken 12AT7. Damn you eBay, LOL!
I'm very impressed with Jeremy's level of service. I had a million questions for him start to finish, and he's extremely patient and kind, and FAST!
Love the Telefunken 12AX7, been using one in Ember and BH Crack. If you want a warmer sound try a Mullard 12AX7.
punkaroo
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I'm finding this amp is similar to my DNA Sonett; it does its job and gets out of the way, allowing you to just enjoy your music.
David, do you find your Telefunken to be noisy in the Ember? I was also looking at a Mullard 12AX7 on eBay. DAMN YOU EBAY!
David, do you find your Telefunken to be noisy in the Ember? I was also looking at a Mullard 12AX7 on eBay. DAMN YOU EBAY!
Hi guys, I'm ordering the Ember now, with the 6S adapter. For now I'll just skip right to the top tubes you recommended, so can you tell me where I can buy the 7193 adapter (decent quality) and a set of Ken-Rad 7193 tubes? I'm also interested in the Sylvania 6SN7. Thanks
Haven't found a noisy tube yet. I always clean the pins with Deoxit (red color) and use the gold liquid one to preserve.
punkaroo
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I kept reading about the impedance switch...and I thought "WHERE is this thing?!"
Well, I finally found it. I take it that I remove the plastic piece and replace it where I want it? For low, or high? It's set to medium.
I need to pick up some Deoxit eventually. That stuff is expensive, man!
Well, I finally found it. I take it that I remove the plastic piece and replace it where I want it? For low, or high? It's set to medium.
I need to pick up some Deoxit eventually. That stuff is expensive, man!
richard51
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Decentlevi,This is the 7193 adapter...... I recommand to you this guy ( link at the end of my post )..... He is very honest and do not charge me anything for replacing a faulty adapter.....you must read the thread about the Ember for details about the 7193 tubes ( the 11 last pages) on : « DIY audio heaven»
http://www.ebay.com/itm/1pc-Dual-6C8P-2C22-7193-CV6-CV3601-TO-6SN7GT-B65-CV1988-tube-converter-adapter-/191551519526?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item2c995c3b26
http://www.ebay.com/itm/1pc-Dual-6C8P-2C22-7193-CV6-CV3601-TO-6SN7GT-B65-CV1988-tube-converter-adapter-/191551519526?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item2c995c3b26
richard51
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