[ToroFiestaSol]

So, resuming your arguments:
 
"I have no actual knowledge of the matter but I'm delusional enough to think I'm right so the beautiful, beautiful music will tell all"
 
That's okay, bye bye

 

[AppleheadMay]

No, you're right, beautiful sounding music doesn't matter, as long as the measurements are right ...  

 

[Lan647]

Measurements aren't there to tell you what you like and not like. But measurements can be very helpful, can serve as a somewhat objective complement to how we hear things and can provide a good understanding of why a headphone sounds the way it does. Due to natural limitations with measurements (all our ears being different to the measurement equipment, different equipment being used for measuring and for playback and many others) they will never be absolute. BUT they are no less valid than any person's opinion - which, for obvious reasons, is a terribly flawed and subjective point of reference. 

I said it before and I'll say it again. Normally, I wouldn't lean on measurements to state a fact, but in this case it's just stupid to deny what is measured because it's quite extreme. The "all ears are different" argument can't save this one. 
 
 ~5-10% (!) of low frequency distortion at 90dB isn't something that is debatable. It's god damn disastrous for a $2500 headphone and if you think you can't hear it, think again. Coupled with a 30hz square wave response which looks like the corners of the Nürburgring and a very strong emphasis centered at around 100hz (this was tuned by a professional studio?!), you can be sure as heck this headphone isn't giving you a good playback of low notes. You like the tuning? Sure, by all means. Bass emphasis is fun sometimes. But what about that distortion?  

And look at the severe ringing in the impulse response and 300hz square wave response! 

If you don't perceive these as flaws, fine. Either you don't want to or.... well what do I know. But with measured data like this, clearly as day indicating poor performance, it deserves to be discussed - especially as a much-needed contrast to the biased opinions of M1-owners... 

 

[up late]

But indeed, even measurements aren't objective as they can be performed in various ways as some people described on the previous pages of this thread. 
And inacurrate measuremtns happen as well after which they are revised, which happened on this site.
Anyway, the fact is measurements can't tell me and many others if I or we will like a pair of phones or not as these, and not only these, phones prove.

measurements are objective. can we at least agree on that?

 

[ToroFiestaSol]

  No, you're right, beautiful sounding music doesn't matter, as long as the measurements are right ...  

 
Beautiful music = 10db distortion at 100hz?
Yeah, I don't like "beautiful" music 

 

[AppleheadMay]

I thought you were gone?

Burifule sound, not music, there's a difference, is judged with one's ears, not by staring at a graph.

But you're gone now for me, bye bye!

 

[Duncan]

I'd rather have the SEM1 than the Grado PS1000e - which cost roughly the same in the UK... Ended up being a shoot out between these two, and I just couldn't get over the honky mids on the Grado...

No answer or debate is right, or wrong, it's just a matter of what we like.

If everyone was the same, there wouldn't be the diversity in design or manufacturers that there is...

Thank goodness for individuality!

 

[AppleheadMay]

I'd rather have the SEM1 than the Grado PS1000e - which cost roughly the same in the UK... Ended up being a shoot out between these two, and I just couldn't get over the honky mids on the Grado...

No answer or debate is right, or wrong, it's just a matter of what we like.

If everyone was the same, there wouldn't be the diversity in design or manufacturers that there is...

Thank goodness for individuality!

 
Definitely agree with that choice, I did audition the original PS1000 and just like with all the other Grado's I heard I wasn't a fan.
To me they had all the right ingredients but lacked coherence. They didn't sound musical to me or  couldn't draw me into the music, something the M1 definitely can.
 
Indeed, individual taste is a good thing. Without it diversity and choice wouldn't exist.

 

[up late]

i've not heard the ps1000e but the ps1000's mids didn't sound the least bit honky to me. and it remains one of the most engaging cans that i've heard. i've suspected that it might share some similarities with the se-master 1 for some reason. maybe that's because neither of them measure well.

 

[starblue]

I cant believe there is still a 'measurement' debate going on. But it doesn't bother me.

 
These days I have been listening to the SEM1 or Z1R every night, something that has not happened for a long time. Typically I would have enough things on my plate to keep me away from music on weekdays but these two headphones almost drag me back to listening every night. This is how I felt a long time back when listening to my crappy cassette deck, which technically was inferior but was all music to my ears. Its almost as if I am rediscovering my lost passion for music again. 

 
I was asked to provide comparison between these two headphones. Unfortunately I can only give a few high level remarks. This is primarily due  (i) I don't have enough time to do a proper side by side comparison as I am busy preparing for moving to another house in few weeks and (ii) I find it almost sinful to take out which ever headphone is on my head to swap with the another one. Both the headphones are very engaging and it comes down purely to the listening pleasure. whichever headphone goes on my head kills the urge to swap and stays on for the evening. 
- Both headphones are relatively on the darker side but resolves very very well. Between the two, SEM1 is the brighter one but overall its still on the dark side. Despite relatively darker, Z1R is also very transparent.
- Out of the box Z1R was quite bassy while SEM1 was slightly bright. Both headphones have settled now. SEM1 packs a lot of punch while Z1R's bass is now tighter and more accurate
- Physically comfort wise Z1R is way lighter but its ear pads has smaller opening. In comparision SEM1 pads have slightly bigger opening making it more 'roomier' and comfortable around the ears. SEM1 hides its weight quite well.
 
I have thrown quite a few genres at these two headphones (not to test but just picking up whatever I feel like listening) including stuff from 80s and 90s and I am yet to be disappointed.
 
Right now I am listening to the SEM1 via Audirvana and Sony PHA-3 connected to my iMac. This thing is just awesome. I consider my money well spent!
 
happy listening 

 

 

[starblue]

By the way - has anybody tried the SEM1 with a balanced cable? The standard stereo cable is quite good already. Of course depends on the amp/player as well but just wondering how much of a difference switching to balanced would/could make..

 

[up late]

I cant believe there is still a 'measurement' debate going on. But it doesn't bother me.

didn't think it was. glad you're enjoying your cans tho. enjoying the th900 as i type.

tho it's unlikely that i'll get to hear the sem1 anytime soon, i need to decide whether to audition the z1r or the sr009 and sr-l700 tomorrow. decisions.

 

[starblue]

I cant believe there is still a 'measurement' debate going on. But it doesn't bother me.

didn't think it was. glad you're enjoying your cans tho. enjoying the th900 as i type.

tho it's unlikely that i'll get to hear the sem1 anytime soon, i need to decide whether to audition the z1r or the sr009 and sr-l700 tomorrow. decisions.

TH900 is one of my favorites although I find it a bit too bright for my taste some times, typically with brighter recordings. But these are extremely rare occasions post burn in.

I havent heard SR009, or any stax for that matter. Curious to hear how you are bundling them with Z1R as auditioning options as I would assume them to be quite different than the Z1R.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[up late]

i can understand your experience with the th900.

i don't know what the staxen and z1r will be paired with but they're at two different stores anyways, so it won't be a comparison as such. i just need to make up my mind over which cans i'd prefer to try tomorrow. i can't do both on the same day unfortunately.

 

[blablablack]

  I cant believe there is still a 'measurement' debate going on. But it doesn't bother me.

 
These days I have been listening to the SEM1 or Z1R every night, something that has not happened for a long time. Typically I would have enough things on my plate to keep me away from music on weekdays but these two headphones almost drag me back to listening every night. This is how I felt a long time back when listening to my crappy cassette deck, which technically was inferior but was all music to my ears. Its almost as if I am rediscovering my lost passion for music again. 

 
I was asked to provide comparison between these two headphones. Unfortunately I can only give a few high level remarks. This is primarily due  (i) I don't have enough time to do a proper side by side comparison as I am busy preparing for moving to another house in few weeks and (ii) I find it almost sinful to take out which ever headphone is on my head to swap with the another one. Both the headphones are very engaging and it comes down purely to the listening pleasure. whichever headphone goes on my head kills the urge to swap and stays on for the evening. 
- Both headphones are relatively on the darker side but resolves very very well. Between the two, SEM1 is the brighter one but overall its still on the dark side. Despite relatively darker, Z1R is also very transparent.
- Out of the box Z1R was quite bassy while SEM1 was slightly bright. Both headphones have settled now. SEM1 packs a lot of punch while Z1R's bass is now tighter and more accurate
- Physically comfort wise Z1R is way lighter but its ear pads has smaller opening. In comparision SEM1 pads have slightly bigger opening making it more 'roomier' and comfortable around the ears. SEM1 hides its weight quite well.
 
I have thrown quite a few genres at these two headphones (not to test but just picking up whatever I feel like listening) including stuff from 80s and 90s and I am yet to be disappointed.
 
Right now I am listening to the SEM1 via Audirvana and Sony PHA-3 connected to my iMac. This thing is just awesome. I consider my money well spent!
 
happy listening 

 

 would you say both are of similar sound signatures? I've heard the z1r and it didn't impress me for the price and I'm wondering if the pioneer would be better...I do love the fostex sound signature but am looking to try out others after being so long with that line from d2k to th900, so looking at the pioneer and the elear, both which I've not heard