[mbevier]

I am considering upgrading to the UM3X from the PFE. To the best of my knowledge, it seems like the most logical step up from where I am now, given that I really enjoy the PFE.

I'm curious if anyone has thought of doing the same, or could comment on a direct comparison between them. It's roughly a $200 increase in price...so I wonder at what all that will be buying me (aside from two additional drivers, heh).

Any thoughts?

 

[Hsiu]

What do you found lacking in PFE ? that will tell if upgrade to UM3X is necessary

have you tried amp your PFE yet ? even a cheap FIIO E5 will give more bass and sound stage to PFE. Also different tip make significant different in sound signature and quality

personally I own FPE+ Fiio E5 and UM3X I found both as really good in terms of sound quality, UM3X has a little laid back mid and high, it is slightly warmer. PFE is more crisp and bright mid and high. so PFE is slightly more exciting to hear. UM3x is more comfortable to hear. although both are rather neutral.

 

[mbevier]

I use an E5 with them as well, and can't say I find anything terribly lacking. I am curious what one gets out of $200 more in this range. Looking for reasons to upgrade while at the same time wanting to define exactly what the terms of the upgrade might be. I've never heard the UM3X personally, but I hear it's of a similar neutral sound, yet also placed in a higher category so to speak.

If you own both of them, are you tempted to only use one or the other, or do they get pretty even use? What inspired you to pick up the UM3X in addition to the PFE?

 

[Zalithian]

I didn't have a good amp with the PFE's, but I would imagine the PFE's with a decent amp (higher than E5) are similar to the UM3X unamped with a good source.

The UM3X's will offer a little bit of a warmer sound. They have more bass quantity and quality imo.

They should have superior comfort, isolation, and sound compared to the PFE's. It seems like a better option to me than carrying the PFE+amp. There was no question I liked the UM3X better than the PFE's, but they do have a slightly different presentation. Details are less in the forefront (but they're still there)

Imagine the PFE's sounding warmer and smoother with the same detail and that's pretty much the UM3X. I'd suggest different tips than the Comply's though, and am also curious what your source is.

 

[mbevier]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zalithian /img/forum/go_quote.gif I didn't have a good amp with the PFE's, but I would imagine the PFE's with a decent amp (higher than E5) are similar to the UM3X unamped with a good source. The UM3X's will offer a little bit of a warmer sound. They have more bass quantity and quality imo. They should have superior comfort, isolation, and sound compared to the PFE's. It seems like a better option to me than carrying the PFE+amp. There was no question I liked the UM3X better than the PFE's, but they do have a slightly different presentation. Details are less in the forefront (but they're still there) Imagine the PFE's sounding warmer and smoother with the same detail and that's pretty much the UM3X. I'd suggest different tips than the Comply's though, and am also curious what your source is.

My source is a Zune 120, so I don't do any EQ. All music sampled at either 320 or lossless. Genre is mostly indie, classical, and jazz with some heavier rock (e.g. Tool). Zero rap.

I find the comfort of the PFEs great, but agree with you that the isolation isn't the best. I don't terribly mind the amp piggy backed on my zune, but certainly would be nice to not carry it around. Although I would be hard pressed to say that is a viable reason for the upgrade by itself.

The sound you describe does seem appealing. As for the comply's, I don't really use them much for several reasons (sound, comfort, maintenance).

I'm quite satisfied with the PFE, but chasing the dream of being even more satisfied...not something anyone here gets caught up in right? ;o)

 

[Zalithian]

Yep. I think you'd be satisfied with either one, just comes down to whether or not you wanna spend that extra money.

Doesn't help much, does it?

 

[charlie0904]

to me you have to amped phonaks lineout with a good amp to match up um3x spectrum.

um3x is abit laid back compared to PFEs.

 

[tstarn06]

There is one HFer, can't remember his tag, who bought both and sold the UM3X, cause he said that using an amp (with the PFE) he really found the UM3X not to be worth the $200 difference. You would have to search, but I am sure it's in either the UM3X or PFE appreciation threads. If I can find it, I will PM it to you.

I have a Zune80, and even though I sold me PFEs (and kept the Westone 3s), I really felt that with my iBasso T4, the PFEs sounded fantastic. I just didn't need both, and was happier having the non-amp option that the W3s brought to the mix. They W3s also improve with an amp.

And I am one who believes even using the HP out via mini to mini, the Zune can improve with an amp.

This probably cause more confusion than help.

 

[shubhangam]

It is my experience that the PFEs improve amazingly when upgrading your source.

Here are what I tried and how I perceived them -

iPod Touch 1g -> PFE (hp out) : sounds good, a bit thin and bass lacking
iPod Touch 1g -> E5 -> PFE (mini to mini cable to e5) : sounds slightly better, a bit fuller
iPod Touch 1g -LOD-> E5 -> PFE (cheap LOD to e5) : sounds best, sound fuller, detail more prominent, you can feel the bass create an 'atmosphere'.

But then, the iPod Touch 1g is understood to have a bad headphone out, the LOD really helped way more than the E5, the E5 just served as what it should have done, amplify the line out. Which led to me concluding that source is more important. (This was tested with 320 CBR and V0 VBR primarily)

This is what I experienced, YMMV

 

[bakhtiar]

I have both IEMs and both have their own strength, and I LOVED both of them. A good amp do boost the PFEs to another level, and better soundstage to UM3Xs. The major differeces between both of them are

1) Soundstage: UM3X > PFE. Ultrasone 3D/binaural sampler tracks sound sooo real with UM3X.

2) Treble : PFEs have more sparkle and clarity than UM3Xs, but UM3X's treble sound more natural and relaxing.

3) Mids/vocal : Yes, UM3Xs wins. PFEs also good with better clarity and speed.

4) Bass: No comparison... UM3Xs wins. But, PFEs offers very fast, deep and accurate bass, but little bit lack in quantity.

5) Efficiency : UM3Xs is a very sensitive IEMs, and works well on any DAPs I tried/used. You can get ear splitting and irritating loudness from Touch 2G, but with PFEs, it just sound LOUD. Now, with UM3X I can hear my D10 picking clicking noises, when it is silent or no sound signal. But, all that disappeared with AD8656/bypass opamp combo.

Ultimately, UM3Xs and PFEs can make NE-7Ms sound like cheap USD 50 or less IEMs

Wait, but someone prefers NE-7Ms over UM3Xs. At the end, everything is depends on the personal taste.
http://www.head-fi.org/forums/f103/w...-ne-7m-432058/


tstarn06
Quote:

There is one HFer, can't remember his tag, who bought both and sold the UM3X, cause he said that using an amp (with the PFE) he really found the UM3X not to be worth the $200 difference. You would have to search, but I am sure it's in either the UM3X or PFE appreciation threads. If I can find it,

Here you go

http://www.head-fi.org/forums/f103/p...ml#post5716886


Thank you.

 

[bixby]

I have owned the PFEs and The E5 and the T4 and heard the Westone 3. I think Bakhtiar post carries a lot of weight.

For me the Westone 3 trounces the PFE. No cheap amp like the e5 can make the PFE sound better, it just strips away some of the treble exaggeration with the gray filters. And the soundstage sucks IMHO ith the E5. Even the T4 alters the sound of the PFEs and not necessarily to the better. Trying different tips helps a lot. I used the PFEs most while active either hiking, walking, biking, etc. And the Complies worked best for me. But you do get much different sound with Sony hybrids and others rather than the PFE silicones.

But when you talk about a Westone 3 and the PFE, the Westone is just effortless in delivering clarity, detail, bass etc. To me the difference and money for the upgrade are almost obvious. Especially when you don't have to buy an amp for the Westone 3. I have not heard the Westone you are considering but if they are more balanced than the 3s then they should be great.

It all depends on your value system and where you feel the law of diminishing returns comes in. That is it really, you have to decide.

Cheers and let us know how things turn out.

 

[tstarn06]

I can second bixby's view in the the PFE v. W3 is not really a fair comparison (once I found the proper tips for the W3). Of course, I sold my PFEs because of the W3, so that says it all. However, I found the T4/PFE synergy to be much better than bixby. I was a black filter fan with the PFEs, not gray.

Anyway, this is about the WM3X, so just wanted to comment on the W3s as well.

 

[tstarn06]

Thanks, nice research job. Here is his specific post on it.

http://www.head-fi.org/forums/5765368-post9.html

Quote:

Originally Posted by bakhtiar /img/forum/go_quote.gif I have both IEMs and both have their own strength, and I LOVED both of them. A good amp do boost the PFEs to another level, and better soundstage to UM3Xs. The major differeces between both of them are 1) Soundstage: UM3X > PFE. Ultrasone 3D/binaural sampler tracks sound sooo real with UM3X. 2) Treble : PFEs have more sparkle and clarity than UM3Xs, but UM3X's treble sound more natural and relaxing. 3) Mids/vocal : Yes, UM3Xs wins. PFEs also good with better clarity and speed. 4) Bass: No comparison... UM3Xs wins. But, PFEs offers very fast, deep and accurate bass, but little bit lack in quantity. 5) Efficiency : UM3Xs is a very sensitive IEMs, and works well on any DAPs I tried/used. You can get ear splitting and irritating loudness from Touch 2G, but with PFEs, it just sound LOUD. Now, with UM3X I can hear my D10 picking clicking noises, when it is silent or no sound signal. But, all that disappeared with AD8656/bypass opamp combo. Ultimately, UM3Xs and PFEs can make NE-7Ms sound like cheap USD 50 or less IEMs Wait, but someone prefers NE-7Ms over UM3Xs. At the end, everything is depends on the personal taste. http://www.head-fi.org/forums/f103/w...-ne-7m-432058/ tstarn06 Here you go http://www.head-fi.org/forums/f103/p...ml#post5716886 Thank you.

 

[robm321]

Quote:

Originally Posted by bixby /img/forum/go_quote.gif the Westone 3 trounces the PFE.

Words like this greatly diminish credibility.

 

[bixby]

Quote:

Originally Posted by robm321 /img/forum/go_quote.gif Words like this greatly diminish credibility.

I am sorry you feel that way.

Next time you may want to put the entire quote in your post. You conveniently left out For me. For me the Westone 3 trounces the PFE.

Now you can read it again and still disagree but it is my opinion and I am sticking by it.

good day