[renanrischiotto]

I have the SHP9500 headphone. It's my first good stereo headphone. It's very good, I like it, but it has a FATAL issue. On games, some sounds (like the immediate right and left) looks like its inside my ears or even my brain (I basically have to use EqualizerAPO + HeSuVi to make the sound out of my brain, or any other surround virtualization, but HeSuVi works system-wide). I was told in Reddit that this might be related to "phase audio", but I have no idea what that means. So without going too deep, can I fix this issue with some EQ or something like that or I need new hardware?

I've found this website: https://www.audiocheck.net/audiotests_polaritycheck.php

And the audio examples there is exactly my problem, the out of phase examples is what it sounds by default on my headphone. So is there a way to fix this by software? If not, has anyone had this problem before with this headphone or any other and can give me some advice?

Best regards!

 

[71 dB]

This is related to spatial hearing. Let's assume there is a sound source on the left side of the your head. Your both ears receive sound from the this sound source, but differently:

1) Your head "blocks some of the sound from getting to your right ear. At the same time your head increases the pressure for the sound entering your left ear. Because of this your left ear receives louder sound. This is frequency dependant: The difference is small at low frequencies and increases to the high frequencies. This is because at high frequencies your hear is a "large" object compared to the wavelenght of the sound. The difference in level (at a given frequency) is called ILD and the differences in sound spectrums is called ISD.

2) The sound need sot travel longer (up to 9 inches) to reach your right ear. This creates delay in comparison to left ear. The right ear receives the sound up to 0.0007 seconds later. It is called ITD.

Sound also reflects from surfaces and our own body before entering ear so the whole thing is pretty complicated, but 1) & 2) are the main mechanics of spatial hearing. Our brain analysis ILD, ITD and ISD together with other spatial cues such as room reflection/reverberation to conclude the direction/distance of the sound.

Headphone listening "bypasses" a lot of the acoustic stuff that creates spatial cues so it can be difficult for spatial hearing to make sense of the sound. For example too much ILD makes the sound appear close to one hear, while smaller ILD can make the sound appear further away. This comes from distance attenuation.

I am not sure I understand your problem, but you could try crossfeeding. It may help if too high ILD was the problem.

 

[VNandor]

the audio examples there is exactly my problem, the out of phase examples is what it sounds by default on my headphone.

Both the in phase and the out of phase example sounds weird with your headphones? Or one of them sounds okay?

 

[Roseval]

out of phase

Normally this refers to a wiring problem.
In case of speakers; one is connected to the amp +>+ & ->- but the other speaker the inverse has been done +>- and as a consequence ->+
If you send a identical signal to both, one cone will move outward and at the other it will move inwards.
When wired correctly both wil move outwards.

 

[renanrischiotto]

Both the in phase and the out of phase example sounds weird with your headphones? Or one of them sounds okay?

The out of phase example is the default on my headphone, sounds terrible, sounds inside my brain, so bad. The in phase is what I'm after, sounds right and amazing. To get that sound I'm currently using HeSuVi to add a surround virtualization so I do not throw up with the default sound of my headphone. But I really want to hear the natural sound of my headphone fixed.

 

[renanrischiotto]

This is related to spatial hearing. Let's assume there is a sound source on the left side of the your head. Your both ears receive sound from the this sound source, but differently:

1) Your head "blocks some of the sound from getting to your right ear. At the same time your head increases the pressure for the sound entering your left ear. Because of this your left ear receives louder sound. This is frequency dependant: The difference is small at low frequencies and increases to the high frequencies. This is because at high frequencies your hear is a "large" object compared to the wavelenght of the sound. The difference in level (at a given frequency) is called ILD and the differences in sound spectrums is called ISD.

2) The sound need sot travel longer (up to 9 inches) to reach your right ear. This creates delay in comparison to left ear. The right ear receives the sound up to 0.0007 seconds later. It is called ITD.

Sound also reflects from surfaces and our own body before entering ear so the whole thing is pretty complicated, but 1) & 2) are the main mechanics of spatial hearing. Our brain analysis ILD, ITD and ISD together with other spatial cues such as room reflection/reverberation to conclude the direction/distance of the sound.

Headphone listening "bypasses" a lot of the acoustic stuff that creates spatial cues so it can be difficult for spatial hearing to make sense of the sound. For example too much ILD makes the sound appear close to one hear, while smaller ILD can make the sound appear further away. This comes from distance attenuation.

I am not sure I understand your problem, but you could try crossfeeding. It may help if too high ILD was the problem.

Thanks for answering! Although this look like rocket science to me xD
Anyway, one guy at reddit told me to try to change the cable first: https://www.reddit.com/r/headphones/comments/mg38zp/shp9500_vs_fidelio_x2hr/
If it's not the problem, I guess it can be the headphone or the motherboard audio that's messed up? Although I tested the headphone on my smartphone and the sound look garbage as well, so I guess its not the motherboard audio, or maybe this headphone needs a good DAC to work properly and both my motherboard and smartphone have a bad one?

 

[renanrischiotto]

Normally this refers to a wiring problem.
In case of speakers; one is connected to the amp +>+ & ->- but the other speaker the inverse has been done +>- and as a consequence ->+
If you send a identical signal to both, one cone will move outward and at the other it will move inwards.
When wired correctly both wil move outwards.

That's interesting because I have another headphone here (that I still need to send it back btw) and it sounds exactly the same, out of phase when I connect to my PC and smartphone. The only difference is that its closed back. It does have a crappy cable too, so I don't know.

 

[VNandor]

The out of phase example is the default on my headphone, sounds terrible. The in phase is what I'm after, sounds right and amazing.

If your headphones have a wiring problem, the in phase example should sound bad/weird but the out of phase examples should sound normal. If the out of phase example doesn't sound normal on your SHP9500, then I don't think your problem would be fixed by rewiring the headphones.

 

[renanrischiotto]

If your headphones have a wiring problem, the in phase example should sound bad/weird but the out of phase examples should sound normal. If the out of phase example doesn't sound normal on your SHP9500, then I don't think your problem would be fixed by rewiring the headphones.

So what's wrong?

By "rewiring" you mean open the headphone to try to fix it?

 

[renanrischiotto]

My conclusion until now based on what I'm reading is that it might be the cable or I need a good soundcard/DAC for the headphone to work properly. I'm looking the Sound Blaster X G6 and I like it. But since it's extremely expensive (at least here, its 4x more expensive than the headphone itself, I could buy it, but definitely not now), I might start with the cable. I don't want an expensive cable but a solid one. Any suggestions? (it must be available on AliExpress btw)

 

[VNandor]

So what's wrong?

That is hard to tell. If you really like virtual surround effects and the HeSuVi speaker virtualization stuff, you probably just don't like the way headphones normally sound. You certainly wouldn't be alone with that.

So what's wrong?

By "rewiring" you mean open the headphone to try to fix it?

Yes that's what I mean. I don't think there's anything wrong with the wiring. Bad wiring would invert the phase on one of the channels. As a result, in phase signals would almost always sound bad but phase inverted signals would almost always sound normal. If you listen with your headphones and both the in phase and out of phase examples sound bad, you must have some different problems with your headphones.
Of course it can't hurt to try it if you know what you are doing...

Although I still not fully understand what you are saying, you sometimes find the sound is coming inside your head (with games) but sometimes it's fine?

 

[renanrischiotto]

That is hard to tell. If you really like virtual surround effects and the HeSuVi speaker virtualization stuff, you probably just don't like the way headphones normally sound. You certainly wouldn't be alone with that.

You mean that all stereo headphones normally sounds out of phase? I don't think that's the case because in this website examples the in-phase looks good, it looks right, looks even surround comparing to what I have now (out-of-phase).

I did turned off the HeSuVi surround virtualization before running those examples of course. And the in-phase is what I want.

I just read the text on the website and says the same that you said lol (I didn't paid much attention before), that if it's working right in the in-phase examples the wiring is correct.

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From a central listening position, listen to the "in phase" and "out of phase" versions. If your speakers are correctly set up, the "in phase" versions will:

• produce more bass with the low rumble tone
• play louder with the 75 Hz sine tone
• render the guitar recording as if the guitar was playing in front of you - not "inside" your head - with a full body character.

If you experience the opposite, simply flip the connecting wires of one of your speakers — not both! — to correct the problem.

Relative polarity is important for headphones as well. Hopefully, headphones are correctly wired at the factory. If not - such as in cheap brands or wrong batches - your brain will have a hard time to correctly locate sounds in the stereophonic space. Play the test files above and check if the "In Phase" examples produce a clear, focused sound. "Out of phase" variations should leave your brain with the impression of a sound twisted inside your head (there won't be any frequency cancelling this time, because the two speakers are physically separated by your head).

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It even says "inside your head". Totally my experience. Says that it could be "cheap brand" (for my understanding Philips is not a cheap brand), or wrong batches, which could be the problem here, but since I have the same issue with my other headphone (the one that I need to send it back), that theory is not valid. OR I'm the most unlucky person of the world and my 2 headphones are indeed not wired properly. And there's this guy that said it maybe be the cable so I don't know.

 

[silent-circuit]

You just don't like your headphones. If the "out of phase" version sounds worse there is nothing wrong with your gear. Yes, the amp may be underpowered, but replacing it won't "fix" what you're describing.

 

[VNandor]

You mean that all stereo headphones normally sounds out of phase? I don't think that's the case because in this website examples the in-phase looks good, it looks right, looks even surround comparing to what I have now (out-of-phase).

If the in phase example sounds right but the out of phase example sounds wrong, then I don't think your headphones are inverting the phase. If your headphones had a problem with that, it should be the other way around. It is also unlikely your headphones would only work properly with this specific example, if it handles the phase properly in this example, it's always handling the phase properly. Because of that, I think the problem is something else.

 

[renanrischiotto]

You just don't like your headphones. If the "out of phase" version sounds worse there is nothing wrong with your gear. Yes, the amp may be underpowered, but replacing it won't "fix" what you're describing.

Sorry but I refuse to believe that this is the default stereo experience. If I ask my mother to say which is better, she will say the in-phase. Do you want me to ask her?

I don't think you understand what's going on. My headphones sounds out of phase by default, it sounds like the out of phase examples in the website (inside my soul) by default on music, games or what have you, all the time. But when I do these tests, the in-phase samples are what my headphone is supposed to sound like. So we have a big mistery here.