[Zenvota]

Hi, yeah, I recently got a DAVE and that sent me on a deep dive of getting it the best signal. This has meant assembling a whole chain from server to reclocker and master clock, and, sigh, multiple high quality power supplies. So, Uptone has been in the mix.

Oh very cool, do you have the whole chain typed out? :]

I'm still devoted to OOYH. As my chain has gotten better and better, OOYH has scaled right along.

absolutely 100% prir binaural rendering benefits from specific equipment to a greater degree than stereo music.

If you recall I was upscaling from 48KHz to DSD512–after OOYH processing. Now with Dave, I've switched to PCM and I'm upscaling from 48KHz to PCM768KHz. We discussed how we clearly heard an improvement to OOYH, but I saw a post calling for an end to such "ridiculous" assertions. I understand so much better now why this works.

Ya in the A16 thread... I just gave them some longwinded archimago blogs to waste their time and walked away. Not gonna learn anything from those types... I get alot that with projectors on AVS. Frequently people telling me that certain metrics are irrelevant. That their 3chip liquid crystal + broad spectrum uhp lamp is comparable in pixel response and color gradations to my single chip dmd + narrow band high yield led. /sigh

In my case real time dsd processing just took too much computing power so I hadn't been using it, but it's always been in the back of my mind as one of the few improvements I could make, and I thank you for sharing that information because no one else on the planet has tried that.

Back then I didn't know the difference between upsampling and upscaling. I thought they referred to the same thing. I've come to realize that upscaling, as done by MScaler and HQP, are not just multiplying the sample rate. It's not just about increasing the frequency but how you're filling all that additional data.They are using extremely computationally heavy algorithms to "tap" the base (44.1/48KHz) digital waveform up to a million+ times. They then take this information and–intelligently–interpolate missing information to reconstruct the original analog waveform. When this process is done post OOYH, it is not only attempting to reconstruct the original 2-channel data but OOYH's convolution of that source data. This is to say, it is not only digitally restoring the sounds and reverberations of the studio master but the sounds and reverberations of the system and room that OOYH captured. So, now I've added signal regeneration and reclocking downstream of the upscaling and each stage not only improves the audio data but OOYH's effect. The degradation of digital reproduction and digital convolution are being corrected simultaneously. Everything sounds more real, both the music and the effect of listening to it on speakers, while using headphones. So, the sonic artifacts that made me feel like OOYH is off from actual speaker listening have steadily vanished. There is still the physics problem as no waves are actuating pressure in the room, but aside from that, OOYH–upsampled, upscaled, regenerated, and reclocked–is spectacularly convincing. This again underscores the point that sometimes you know better to hear better, and other times you hear better to know better.

Ah fantastic thanks for sharing that. At some point I'm going to have to take a deep dive into upscaling.

I can relate with video though, in that using madVRs hardware accelerated 32 bit math 16 bit surface dithered to 10 bit video rendering with cutting edge upscaling/downscaling/sharpening algorithms can make ancient dvds look like 4k remasters.

What's been new with you?

It's been deep dive with projection for me. Looking at everything available I settled on a 10 year old used Sim2 Mico 40 and using madVRs dynamic tone mapping for HDR and will use a 3dlut for color correction.

The projector essentially has the widest native color gamut available at 90% bt2020, until the Chiq C8ut(rgb laser for $10k) which hits 100% bt2020. DLP dmds have a 0.01ms black to white impulse pixel response imparting crt-like motion, 95% uniformity superior to oled and d-ila, 3000:1 native contrast but 15,000:1 gamma corrected near-artifact free dynamic contrast with water cooled leds, and appears much brighter and with a higher perceived contrast due to the narrow band wavelength of the leds and color contrast/performance, so it looks more like 25,000:1 and 200nits, excellent black level(not pure black but black) and very defined highlights, with pixel perfect emissive display level sharpness and detail. The pixel performance and light source provide the best color performance I've ever seen. ever. Absolutely perfect instantaneous low level detail/color, shadow detail, gradations. Just astounding. All that with no bulbs, no filters, low power usage, and low heat output, perfect optical engine.

 

[edwardsean]

Oh very cool, do you have the whole chain typed out? :]



absolutely 100% prir binaural rendering benefits from specific equipment to a greater degree than stereo music.



Ya in the A16 thread... I just gave them some longwinded archimago blogs to waste their time and walked away. Not gonna learn anything from those types... I get alot that with projectors on AVS. Frequently people telling me that certain metrics are irrelevant. That their 3chip liquid crystal + broad spectrum uhp lamp is comparable in pixel response and color gradations to my single chip dmd + narrow band high yield led. /sigh

In my case real time dsd processing just took too much computing power so I hadn't been using it, but it's always been in the back of my mind as one of the few improvements I could make, and I thank you for sharing that information because no one else on the planet has tried that.


Ah fantastic thanks for sharing that. At some point I'm going to have to take a deep dive into upscaling.

I can relate with video though, in that using madVRs hardware accelerated 32 bit math 16 bit surface dithered to 10 bit video rendering with cutting edge upscaling/downscaling/sharpening algorithms can make ancient dvds look like 4k remasters.



It's been deep dive with projection for me. Looking at everything available I settled on a 10 year old used Sim2 Mico 40 and using madVRs dynamic tone mapping for HDR and will use a 3dlut for color correction.

The projector essentially has the widest native color gamut available at 90% bt2020, until the Chiq C8ut(rgb laser for $10k) which hits 100% bt2020. DLP dmds have a 0.01ms black to white impulse pixel response imparting crt-like motion, 95% uniformity superior to oled and d-ila, 3000:1 native contrast but 15,000:1 gamma corrected near-artifact free dynamic contrast with water cooled leds, and appears much brighter and with a higher perceived contrast due to the narrow band wavelength of the leds and color contrast/performance, so it looks more like 25,000:1 and 200nits, excellent black level(not pure black but black) and very defined highlights, with pixel perfect emissive display level sharpness and detail. The pixel performance and light source provide the best color performance I've ever seen. ever. Absolutely perfect instantaneous low level detail/color, shadow detail, gradations. Just astounding. All that with no bulbs, no filters, low power usage, and low heat output, perfect optical engine.

My chain has been rapidly in flux. There are things to which I said a week ago, "Why would I need that?" that I'm getting. I keep getting pulled upward even as something inside pushes me. I avoided going the full blown purpose built computer server route, but now I've gone all in. I have one coming in, and I'm charting my way though audiophile linux solutions and all their esoteric computer code flags. I just bought an Innuos Phoenix reclocker and the letters OCXO have me all excited.

It's fascinating though isn't it? All this science behind the sensory experience, which, ultimately, is about very unscientific things. Like yourself, I thoroughly enjoy the technical details, even as it often drives me crazy. Yet, I know, at the foundations, it's not being driven by a sheer love of bits and nits. We've felt the effects of these things on they way we take in music and movies. All these cold data points correlate to emotional impact and the insights we gain about the world, relationship, life. It is why we drive ourselves crazy about all this stuff, isn't it?

 

[Zenvota]

My chain has been rapidly in flux. There are things to which I said a week ago, "Why would I need that?" that I'm getting. I keep getting pulled upward even as something inside pushes me. I avoided going the full blown purpose built computer server route, but now I've gone all in. I have one coming in, and I'm charting my way though audiophile linux solutions and all their esoteric computer code flags. I just bought an Innuos Phoenix reclocker and the letters OCXO have me all excited. It's fascinating though isn't it? All this science behind the sensory experience, which, ultimately, is about very unscientific things. Like yourself, I thoroughly enjoy the technical details, even as it often drives me crazy. Yet, I know, at the foundations, it's not being driven by a sheer love of bits and nits. We've felt the effects of these things on they way we take in music and movies. All these cold data points correlate to emotional impact and the insights we gain about the world, relationship, life. It is why we drive ourselves crazy about all this stuff, isn't it?

Yes, when I first started experimenting with equipment I had 0 bias to different transducers and circuits, and really very little knowledge of the differences between them as well, and made ab comparisons spanning months to try to achieve the most objective results I could. Using specific components there were crystal clear differences in how natural the virtualization sounded and a lack of fatiguing qualities. I also wanted to keep things as inexpensive or simple as possible, to better be able to make suggestions to interested persons. I would've loved to have been satisfied using a pair of $30 jvc dynamics and the computers built-in headamp, but the differences were to astounding and elating to ignore.

To cover the main issues I came up with the following, everything can be bought used for under $500 total.

PC to an Uptone USB Regen powered by a linear supply(a $15 jameco supply worked, and preferably with a quadrapole dc cable)
into an XMOS USB to SPDIF converter with a linear supply and TCXO
optical out to a budget Audio-GD ESS combo with a TCXO, a quadrapole AC power cable, and a Topaz Line Noise Suppressor
using Hifiman HE-400i with Dekoni LCD Velour pads, custom rear grill with 5mm wire mesh and melamine, and sorbothane lined cups

the dac/amp is completely isolated, drastically reduced ac line noise, drastically reduced usb phy noise and jitter, drastically reduced ringing/resonance in the headphones. Resulted in extremely clear and natural binaural rendering. My absolute minimum for enjoyable prir virtualization now.

Really suprising were the improvements made on the digital transport side reclocking and noise reduction before the dac chip. Powering an iso regen and the amanero usb to i2s board with an ultracap lps was a big improvement, and running the planars balanced with the amplifiers upgraded power supplies were a big improvement as well. Everything got bigger, more externalized, and sounded more like actual loudspeakers, as more natural decay/reflections were more accurately rendered. I probably swapped out the dc power cable to the iso regen out 20 times, and every time imaging and non-fatiguing treble quality was readily apparent, for $2 of cable and connectors, and supported by scientific reasoning, as the varied current draw of digital devices causing a noise generating voltage to develop across the inductance of the cable, low inductance cable, low noise, and that type of noise passes through the voltage regulators.

It's re-assuring and enjoyable to know that people, like yourself, are observing improvements in quality from other methods as well.

 

[jincuteguy]

The OOYH software is a generic version of the Smyth Realiser. Most of the presets are copied from a file sharing system that Smyth setup for owners of the A8. It's clever that they've been made available through software, but they don't compare to the Realiser because the Realiser uses your own ears as a source rather than someone else's.

So you're saying if I have the A8, I can make those kind of Presets and save them?

 

[castleofargh]

So you're saying if I have the A8, I can make those kind of Presets and save them?

If your purpose is to record binaural impulses from a room+speakers on yourself, you might want to look at this instead:
https://www.head-fi.org/threads/recording-impulse-responses-for-speaker-virtualization.890719/

 

[Takeanidea]

So you're saying if I have the A8, I can make those kind of Presets and save them?

Yes, if you have an A8, they're no longer produced, but they fetch a lot of money 2ndhand

 

[W1ll1eTheP1mp]

Hey! Im pretty new to software virtualization. I love binaurally recorded albums but its really hard to find! Therefore i want to try a a software. Ive used DTS: 3D Side by side setting on my phone and its actually pretty good. I have a few questions for someone who has a lot of knownledge with this:

1. Is it possible to set up Out Of Your Head to work with streaming service's on PC? Almost all my music comes from streaming.
2. Do i need HeSuVi in addition?
3. Is there a good guide of how i can setup this software to emulate binaural recordings with using other people's HRTF?

Thanks in advance

 

[Zenvota]

Hey! Im pretty new to software virtualization. I love binaurally recorded albums but its really hard to find! Therefore i want to try a a software. Ive used DTS: 3D Side by side setting on my phone and its actually pretty good. I have a few questions for someone who has a lot of knownledge with this:

1. Is it possible to set up Out Of Your Head to work with streaming service's on PC? Almost all my music comes from streaming.
2. Do i need HeSuVi in addition?
3. Is there a good guide of how i can setup this software to emulate binaural recordings with using other people's HRTF?

Thanks in advance

1. yes all aufio can go through ooyh
2. nope no hesuvi
3. the softwares very straight forward and you can demo it for free.

the one advise id give is to use equalizer apo to flatten out your headphones frewuency response over 2khz

 

[phoenixdogfan]

Hey! Im pretty new to software virtualization. I love binaurally recorded albums but its really hard to find! Therefore i want to try a a software. Ive used DTS: 3D Side by side setting on my phone and its actually pretty good. I have a few questions for someone who has a lot of knownledge with this:

1. Is it possible to set up Out Of Your Head to work with streaming service's on PC? Almost all my music comes from streaming.
2. Do i need HeSuVi in addition?
3. Is there a good guide of how i can setup this software to emulate binaural recordings with using other people's HRTF?



Thanks in advance

In answer to your questions (I am a long time OOYH user--since 2015)
window
1.Yes. Pretty much all I listen to are streaming services (Netflix, Amazon Prime, Hulu, Qobuz). Just set up OOYH as the default speaker in Windows. Alternatively, many of the streaming services allow you to set up a WASAPI exclusive mode to OOYH. You will need a media player like JRiver if you opt for this alternative.
2. No. OOYH works as a standalone, although HeSu/vi can use OOYH presets, as I understand it
3. OOYH is binaural emulation software, and it has historically been used as a stand alone virtual sound card on Windows and Mac PCs, the OOYH manual provides a very good guide to get you started, this thread will answer some of your FAQs, as will the OOYH website, and Darin Fong is very available and promptly responsive in his support capacity.

Ditto to the previous post on EQ. I use Sonarworks, and I think it has made all the difference. After all, you want to hear the speakers, not your headphones.

 

[W1ll1eTheP1mp]

In answer to your questions (I am a long time OOYH user--since 2015)
window
1.Yes. Pretty much all I listen to are streaming services (Netflix, Amazon Prime, Hulu, Qobuz). Just set up OOYH as the default speaker in Windows. Alternatively, many of the streaming services allow you to set up a WASAPI exclusive mode to OOYH. You will need a media player like JRiver if you opt for this alternative.
2. No. OOYH works as a standalone, although HeSu/vi can use OOYH presets, as I understand it
3. OOYH is binaural emulation software, and it has historically been used as a stand alone virtual sound card on Windows and Mac PCs, the OOYH manual provides a very good guide to get you started, this thread will answer some of your FAQs, as will the OOYH website, and Darin Fong is very available and promptly responsive in his support capacity.

Ditto to the previous post on EQ. I use Sonarworks, and I think it has made all the difference. After all, you want to hear the speakers, not your headphones.

Thanks alot to both! What do u use sonarworks for? Flatten the EQ with their presets?

 

[phoenixdogfan]

Thanks alot to both! What do u use sonarworks for? Flatten the EQ with their presets?

Flatten the headphone so all you hear is the way the speakers in the presets sound, not the added effect of the headphone's frequency nonlinearities.

 

[Zenvota]

Additionally i find headphones that follow the harman target to be much to bright, something about a double hrtf with the measured impulse responses so i like the uncompensated frequency response to be much closer to flat

 

[W1ll1eTheP1mp]

Flatten the headphone so all you hear is the way the speakers in the presets sound, not the added effect of the headphone's frequency nonlinearities.

I should probably use PM3 since that is the flattest ive got. I also use IE800. Do i use equalizerAPO for that? Oratory has presets,but they arent flat, they are like harman curve i guess.

Gonna try the OOYH tonight.. Hope its worth the money.. Love binaural/spatial effects as long its not coloring the sound to much or sound very artificial(enhanched bass+reverb its pretty common in bad effects loke early sfi creative aurvana effects).

 

[Zenvota]

I should probably use PM3 since that is the flattest ive got. I also use IE800. Do i use equalizerAPO for that? Oratory has presets,but they arent flat, they are like harman curve i guess.

Gonna try the OOYH tonight.. Hope its worth the money.. Love binaural/spatial effects as long its not coloring the sound to much or sound very artificial(enhanched bass+reverb its pretty common in bad effects loke early sfi creative aurvana effects).

Its free to try all of the presets have a 2min timer and you just change to another preset, theres a base preset without the measured room that has a 1 week trial as well

Theyre measured rooms so theres no added effects

You're still going to have to reduce 1-5khz on the pm3. I like just using eq apo as is with the parametric filters

 

[W1ll1eTheP1mp]

Its free to try all of the presets have a 2min timer and you just change to another preset, theres a base preset without the measured room that has a 1 week trial as well

Theyre measured rooms so theres no added effects

You're still going to have to reduce 1-5khz on the pm3. I like just using eq apo as is with the parametric filters

do you now if i can find a graph to get it very flat or do i need to trust my ears?