opinons on power conditioners and regenerators ?
Jan 17, 2017 at 11:54 AM Post #16 of 208
Science starts by first learning what already exists.  120 AC volts is first filtered.  Then converted to high voltage DC.  Then filtered again.  Then converted to well over 300 volt radio frequency spikes.  
 
Does not matter how clean that AC power is.  Power is now 'dirtiest'.  Then superior regulators, filters, and galvanic isolation converts that 'dirtiest' power into rock stable, low DC voltage.  
 
Most who recommend power conditioners and other gobbelty gook have no idea what already exists.  Then assume some magic box might make sound cleaner or tinny.  Useful answer starts by learning what already exists - and numbers.
 
Tie a knot in a power cord.  That is also a power conditioner.  Then add numbers.  It does near zero power conditioning.  Many power conditioners are little more than wire knots selling for big bucks.  The scam works.
 
Does not matter if that conditioner eliminates high frequency noise.  Power supply first makes well over 300 volt radio frequency spikes - worst noise.  Worst high frequency noise is only solved by superior filters, regulators, and galvanic isolation that must already exist.
 
One says all UPSes have surge protection.  He is correct.  Destructive surges can be hundreds of thousands of joules.  UPS only contains hundreds of joules.  To be any smaller, it would be zero joules.  But since it has near zero joules, then most claim it does 100% protection.  Recommendations not tempered by numbers and other relevant facts (ie common mode, a low impedance connection to earth ground, etc) is best ignored as hearsay, wild speculation, or knowledge from advertising.  That is what so many 'experts' use - junk science reasoning and no spec numbers.
 
Jan 17, 2017 at 4:43 PM Post #17 of 208
  Science starts by first learning what already exists.  120 AC volts is first filtered.  Then converted to high voltage DC.  Then filtered again.  Then converted to well over 300 volt radio frequency spikes.  
I believe you're trying to describe a switching power supply. Not a great description, and doesn't matter anyway.  And that doesn't describe every power supply at all.
 
Does not matter how clean that AC power is.  Power is now 'dirtiest'.  Then superior regulators, filters, and galvanic isolation converts that 'dirtiest' power into rock stable, low DC voltage.  
 
I wouldn't agree that it "does not matter how clean the AC power is".  It does matter, it's just that typical power isn't "dirty" in the first place.  And, typical power supplies regulate out most of the "dirt".  But there are circumstances where really bad line noise causes issues beyond what a power supply can handle.  Rare, but not zero.
Most who recommend power conditioners and other gobbelty gook have no idea what already exists.  Then assume some magic box might make sound cleaner or tinny.  Useful answer starts by learning what already exists - and numbers.
Agreed that most that recommend power conditioners don't consider what's already built in.  And agreed that power conditioners don't improve sound or video.
 
Quote:
 
Tie a knot in a power cord.  That is also a power conditioner.  Then add numbers.  It does near zero power conditioning.  Many power conditioners are little more than wire knots selling for big bucks.  The scam works.
Not sure why anyone would say a knot in a power cord is a "power conditioner".  Clearly, it's not.  But also, there is much more than a knot in a power conditioner.  They actually do something, even if what they do is not typically necessary, or resulting in any improvement.  Open one up sometime. 
 
Quote:
 
Does not matter if that conditioner eliminates high frequency noise.  Power supply first makes well over 300 volt radio frequency spikes - worst noise.  Worst high frequency noise is only solved by superior filters, regulators, and galvanic isolation that must already exist.
There are situations where RF "noise" on an incoming power line can cause issues.  It does actually matter.  It's just that those situations are extremely rare.  However, in high RF situations, like you live less than a mile from a 50kW AM radio transmitter, it's also unlikely that a power conditioner will solve your problems either.  Yes, that RF would be filtered in the power supply, but probably not off the ground (because it isn't actually real ground).  The entire system rides on the incoming RF.  It is a problem.  Again, not solved with a conditioner, or a power supply. 
 
Quote:
 
One says all UPSes have surge protection.  He is correct.  Destructive surges can be hundreds of thousands of joules.  UPS only contains hundreds of joules.  To be any smaller, it would be zero joules.  But since it has near zero joules, then most claim it does 100% protection.  Recommendations not tempered by numbers and other relevant facts (ie common mode, a low impedance connection to earth ground, etc) is best ignored as hearsay, wild speculation, or knowledge from advertising.  That is what so many 'experts' use - junk science reasoning and no spec numbers.

The surge protection built into a UPS has vastly improved in recent years, from non-existent to reasonably good.  My point is, a surge protector at the device (or UPS) doesn't fully address all types of power line surges, particularly the lighting strike common mode ones.  That's where "whole house" protection, along with a certifiably low resistance ground system, is key.  And that type of protection comes in several different types and degrees of effectiveness, i.e. series filter, shunt/clamp, voltage sensing, etc.  Most of what's in the typical UPS is the shunt/clamp protector with possibly a noise filter, which is similar to what's in a decent surge protected outlet strip. Better than nothing, not the whole job, though.





 
Jan 18, 2017 at 2:46 AM Post #18 of 208
  Yes, but the surge protection in a UPS is fairly rudimentary, and frankly, in the wrong place to be very effective.  Good surge protection, particularly of common-mode surges, needs to have a really low impedance ground, and that's not something typically found at the location of a UPS, at least a smallish one in a home or office.  There are several classes of surge protectors too.  In areas prone to high voltage surges, like Florida, the lightning capital of the world, you need to get fairly serious about surge protection, at the premise level, and a good low resistance ground.  At devices, you'll want something that really does protect a surge, that actually senses the overvoltage and disconnect the device, not just a sacrificial MOV.  
 
None of that equates to the surge protection in a UPS. 
 
None of that improves audio or video performance either, unless you consider working gear as out performing smoking gear.  
 
And none of the above is "power conditioning".
 
I kinda hate the hype-ish presentation but the demo is pretty good:
https://youtu.be/4j8cH6l2YjE
 
I don't work for the company, and often actually recommend a competitor, but it shows the difference between the hardware store sacrificial MOV surge protector, and something with overvoltage sensing.  It doesn't demonstrate a common-mode surge, of course, but you get the idea.  


Over/under voltage protection is a pretty common feature on UPSs as well, similar to what's demonstrated in that video except that being a UPS, anything plugged in shouldn't lose power as long as the battery has charge.
 
I'm very suspicious of the power strip used in the demonstration, though. The conductors in any power strip should be more than capable of handling 200V at 1A, which should be about what you get running 200V through a 60W bulb (until it burns out, of course). Without surge protection, nothing should happen. If 200V exceeds the clamping voltage of the MOV and results in an effective short circuit (assuming I understand correctly how a MOV surge protector works), there should still be a fuse to prevent a prolonged over-current situation (which, I assume, is what caused the surge protector to catch fire). I'm guessing they intentionally bypassed the fuse for their demonstration.
 
Jan 18, 2017 at 12:02 PM Post #19 of 208
 I'm guessing they intentionally bypassed the fuse for their demonstration

 
A completely different anomaly (an overvoltage) is demonstrated.  That is not a surge - despite their spin.
 
Surge is a massive current of short duration - ie microseconds.  That is completely different from a demonstrated overvoltage.
 
Its fuse need not be removed.  Thermal fuse in plug-in protectors is typically one amp.  MOVs are connected to AC mains by a one amp fuse. They simply raised voltage just enough so that less than 1 amp passed through MOVs for so long (forever) as to cause catastrophic damage.  Plug-in protector parts (even in a best UPS design) will do same.
 
Had same voltage been applied to portable electronics, then nothing would be damaged.  Because its switching power supply makes such anomalies irrelevant.  Panamax protectors are just as ineffective as products from APC, Belkin, Tripplite, and Monster.
 
Due to such design problems, APC recently admitted some 15 million protectors must be removed immediately - to avert fires.
 
Effective protectors are provided by companies known by any guy for integrity including Intermatic, Square D, Ditek, Siemens, Polyphaser (an industry benchmark), Syscom, Leviton, ABB, Delta, Erico, General Electric, and Cutler-Hammer (Eaton).  Effective protectors shunt (are not series filters, etc).  Increasing 'whole house' protector quality (increasing its rated current) means it absorbs less energy, remains effective for more decades, and improves protection.
 
A properly earthed 'whole house' protector performs 99.5% to 99.9% of protection.  Spending more for a higher rated 'whole house' protector results in a number higher on that scale.  Power strip or UPS protector circuits might add another 0.2%. Do nothing (near zero) for other anomalies such as noise.
 
Power supply seriously addresses other anomalies. Line conditioners and other magic boxes are often inferior to what is done better in a power supply - as demonstrated by numbers.  Any recommendation without spec numbers is best suspect as a lie.
 
An adjacent series mode filter is sometimes used in professional audio facilities when a power supply in some equipment is found inferior.  To be effective, a series mode filter weighs tens of pounds.  It does nothing for noise that might exist due to bad grounding practices.
 
Jan 18, 2017 at 11:53 PM Post #20 of 208
Yes, the demonstration was clearly a sustained overvoltage not a surge. I didn't catch whether they tried to call it a surge, but that would have been a lie. Whether modified or not, though, you can't be claiming the surge protector behaved as expected when it quite literally caught on fire. Would a product that catches fire on it's own if, say, (somehow) accidentally attached to a 220V circuit pass any kind of certification, let alone the lawyers at the company who designed it?
 
You are indeed correct in saying that a lot of modern power supplies would work perfectly fine connected to 200V AC. I imagine this convenient design feature as well as their small size is largely responsible for the popularity of switching power supplies in modern electronics.
 
Jan 19, 2017 at 2:00 AM Post #21 of 208
Just to keep balance, yes, a lot of modern power supplies will operate on 200+ volts without an issue.  And a lot won't.  Let's not paint the picture that no overvoltage protection is ever needed, ok?
 
And I agree, the video is spun.  It's not a surge by the proper definition.  But I also think the cheapie "surge protected" outlet strips are completely worthless, even a hazard.
 
@westom:
 
What do you think of the products and concepts shown here:...?
https://zerosurge.com/
 
Jan 19, 2017 at 10:14 AM Post #22 of 208
 
What do you think of the products and concepts shown here:...?
https://zerosurge.com/

Zerosurge (like Brickwall and Surgex) are series mode filters as discussed earlier.  A series mode filter works by 'blocking' or 'absorbing' a surge.  Using its spec numbers, it may 'absorb' up to 600 joules.  Then its inductors saturate - act like a conductive wire.
 
A surge is a current source.  That means its voltage will increase as necessary to make sure that current flows.   When a series mode filter tries to 'block' a surge, then voltage increases as necessary to blow through that series mode filter.
 
Series mode filters are for low energy transients such as noise.  Electronics may convert and routinely consume a 600 joule surge as electricity to safely power its semiconductors.  An expensive series mode filter is only for surges already made irrelevant by what already exists.
 
A series mode filter can enhance 'whole house' protection.  But does little if not part of that 'whole house' solution.
 
Jan 19, 2017 at 1:05 PM Post #23 of 208
  Zerosurge (like Brickwall and Surgex) are series mode filters as discussed earlier.  A series mode filter works by 'blocking' or 'absorbing' a surge.  Using its spec numbers, it may 'absorb' up to 600 joules.  Then its inductors saturate - act like a conductive wire.
 
A surge is a current source.  That means its voltage will increase as necessary to make sure that current flows.   When a series mode filter tries to 'block' a surge, then voltage increases as necessary to blow through that series mode filter.
 
Series mode filters are for low energy transients such as noise.  Electronics may convert and routinely consume a 600 joule surge as electricity to safely power its semiconductors.  An expensive series mode filter is only for surges already made irrelevant by what already exists.
 
A series mode filter can enhance 'whole house' protection.  But does little if not part of that 'whole house' solution.

I looked up the specs on the Zerosurge "point of use" line, they list them in a chart found here.
 
Highlights seem to be these:
 
Max Surge Voltage Let-through: 130V above peak line voltage @ 6,000V/3,000A for ANSI C62.41 Category B3/C1 Combination Wave
Max. Applied Pulse Voltage: 6,000V (1.2 x 50 µs—AMSI C62.41 Combination Wave)
Max. Applied Pulse Current: >100,000A applied (unlimited due to internal current limiting), 8 x 20 µs
Joule Rating: No metal oxide varistors to wear out; therefore, not applicable to this technology.
Endurance Rating: 1,000 worst case pulses: ANSI C62.41, Category B3/C1 pulses (6,000V/3,000A); >10,000 pulses @ 4,000V; >100,000 pulses @ 2,000V
 
Now, we can debate the need all day, and I'll be one of the first to agree, the actual need for any of this is likely minimal.  Sort of like insurance, the win of the gable is on the vendor/insurance company side, always.  But holding a 6kV/3000A surge to 130V above peak line voltage doesn't sound completely irrelevant, nor does it sound like it's working only on low energy transients.  Being a filter, I would expect shorter duration pulses to be attenuated further than longer ones, and the resulting let-through to be a function of time and voltage.  
 
Their white paper on MOVs is interesting.
 
But please continue to educate, it's very helpful. 
 
Jan 19, 2017 at 4:44 PM Post #24 of 208
  I looked up the specs on the Zerosurge "point of use" line, they list them in a chart found here.
 
Highlights seem to be these:
 
Max Surge Voltage Let-through: 130V above peak line voltage @ 6,000V/3,000A for ANSI C62.41 Category B3/C1 Combination Wave
Max. Applied Pulse Voltage: 6,000V (1.2 x 50 µs—AMSI C62.41 Combination Wave)
Max. Applied Pulse Current: >100,000A applied (unlimited due to internal current limiting), 8 x 20 µs
 

My numbers are taken from those specifications.
 
Reread a sentence that discusses "saturation".  A "Max. Applied Pulse Current" number defines that sentence quantitatively.
 
Their spin on MOVs is based in myths generated because plug-in protectors are often grossly undersized.  Others are encouraged to view what happens when MOVs are inside protectors in violation of Absolute Maximum Parameters in MOV datasheets.  For example, some 15 million APC protectors must be removed immediately because a potentially destructive surge created so many APC protector fires.  A problem, too common in grossly undersized plug-in protectors, is not limited only to  APC products.  Also is why a cruise ship may confiscate that protector:
 
See scary pictures (and ignore text that is intentionally deceptive) in:
http://zerosurge.com/truth-about-movs/
 
From AN9311.pdf from Littelfuse:  "The ABCs of MOVs":
Q. How does an MOV fail?
A. When subjected to stresses above its ratings, an MOV can fail as a short circuit. If applied conditions significantly exceed the energy rating of the device, and current is not limited, the MOV may be completely destroyed. For this reason, the use of current-limiting fuses is suggested.
Q. How do you select a fuse to prevent failure of an MOV?
A. Fuses should be chosen to limit current below the level where damage to the MOV package could occur.  ... Generally, the fuse should be placed in series with either the varistor or the source ahead of the varistor.
That thermal fuse to only disconnect undersized MOVs is typically 1 amp.
 
When a protector is undersized (has too few joules - ie hundreds or a thousand), then a fuse blows to disconnect protector parts.  Leaving that surge still connected to attached appliances.  Why is that protection?  Because protection already inside appliances makes irrelevant a surge that can also destroy undersized and expensive protectors.  That is also what so many mistakenly call "sacrificial protection"
 
Above is why informed consumers instead spend about $1 per protected appliance to earth a 'whole house' protector.  Is for one potentially destructive anomaly - a surge.  Other anomalies require other solutions.  Each anomaly and solution is discussed with perspective - that means spec numbers.
 
Jan 19, 2017 at 7:48 PM Post #25 of 208
   
If you're going to decide this is a problem that you should address, don't go half way -- get disconnected from the grid entirely and use only batteries.

Also, install a Faraday Cage over the listening room.
 
Jan 19, 2017 at 7:53 PM Post #26 of 208
Jan 19, 2017 at 11:46 PM Post #27 of 208
 
When a protector is undersized (has too few joules - ie hundreds or a thousand), then a fuse blows to disconnect protector parts.  Leaving that surge still connected to attached appliances.  Why is that protection?  Because protection already inside appliances makes irrelevant a surge that can also destroy undersized and expensive protectors.  

I'm having a bit of a problem with the above.  You've stated several times that devices and equipment already have the ability to deal with surges and over voltages, and have inferred that capability is because of their switch-mode design.
 
So I took a look at one example, a Denon AVR-4100, for which I have the service manual and complete schematics.  I examined the power supply from the "inlet" connector.  There are two main power supply sections, one is a switch-mode supply/regulator, which operates directly from the power line via a bridge rectifier.  Other than the regulator itself, and a very rudimentary noise filter, there are no surge protection devices, no MOVs present.  The same main power connector then feeds a transformer and a group of bridge rectifiers, and a group of very average and typical low voltage regulators, the 3-terminal 78XX and 79XX variety.  There is no over-voltage protection, and no surge protection, or MOVs there either.  In fact, not a bit of transient/surge protection in the entire device apart from whatever the switch-mode supply is capable of.  It can handle both standard line voltages without any change except for the value of a caps and series inductors, part of the noise filter.
 
Looking at data presented in the Littlefuse paper, "An Overview of Electromagnetic and Lightning Induced Voltage Transients",  I see several interesting points.  First, there isn't a lot of statistical data available about power line anomalies.  The paper references that lack of data several times.  But there is a chart on page 10-112 that graphs magnitude against frequency of occurrence.  Looking at the composite US curve, it seems most transients are between 400 and 600V, but 10% or so are at 1kV and above.  Unfortunately the graphs don't specifically show overhead power grids and single-family residential data, which would be relevant if presented relative to geographic location.  But regardless, with 10% of transients above 1kV, and the Denon having zero transient protection, certainly for the many analog power supplies, I wonder how it would fare in a world without even an undersized MOV ahead of it.
 
I don't think the AVR-4100 is atypical.  It was a mid-line product, there are units above and below, as well as many other products in their line.  If the power supply design is a company-wide philosophy, that may tell us something about the general vulnerability to transients of consumer AV gear.  
 
While I definitely agree the whole-house/premise solution is key, there are many situations that inhibit or prevent it's installation.  
 
Jan 22, 2017 at 4:51 AM Post #28 of 208
   Other than the regulator itself, and a very rudimentary noise filter, there are no surge protection devices, no MOVs present.  ...
  

 
Why assume protector components must exist to have protection?  Many make that mistake when datasheets are unread.   Internal protection exists in how parts work together.  For example, some line drivers are rated to withstand 2,000 or 15,000 volts without damage.  But only when that part is in a system.  That IC by itself can be destroyed by a tiny static electronics discharge when not part of a system. So if a tiny static electric current can destroy that part, then why is it also able to withstand 15,000 volts without damage?  
 
International design standards for 120 electronics (that existed long before PCs existed) defined up to 600 volt transients without damage.  That existed without any protector parts.  What kind of voltage?  Longitudinal or metallic?  These and other electrical concepts apply.  Summarized were only well proven engineering concepts simplified to a layman's level with relevant specification numbers included.  Enough to learn what is necessary.  Insufficient to deny well proven concepts did not work even 100 years ago.
 
That 78xx or 79xx power supply cannot exist as stated.  Other components must exist - otherwise it cannot even be UL listed.  Describe all parts - so as to understand how all those parts combined meet international design standards - ie withstand 600+ volts without damage.
 
That Littelfuse citation defines what with numbers?  Almost nothing.  It is primer - only a subjective discussion - to introduce many concepts to beginners.  It does not include relevant spec numbers.  Many transients, totally irrelevant here, are discussed (ie automotive protection that must withstand up to 240 volt transients on the 12 volts system - did they also forget to include those numbers?).
 
So what is the question?
 
Plug-in protectors may be destroyed by transients made irrelevant by protection routinely found in appliances - ie some appliance today must withstand approaching 1000 volts.  Rare transients that might overwhelm that protection (ie once every seven years) are made irrelevant by a properly installed 'whole house' solution.
 
What situation prohibits installation of 'whole house' protection?  If true, then also stated are the whens, wheres, any whys?   Anyone can make blanket and subjective statements.  One who did this stuff for many decades has never seen a 'it cannot be done' situation.  Rather than make a generalized, subjective, and vague statement, instead, provide specific example that also says why (with numbers).
 
Surge is a current source; not a voltage source as assumed.  That mean a same surge might create 5,000 volts or near zero volts.  Same 10% transients that create 1000 volts also creates tiny volts when a 'whole house' solution is properly installed - properly earthed.  Littelfuse paper is only a primer; only introduces and subjectively discusses different topics called surge protection.  Including why unpowered semiconductors might be easily damaged.  Topics irrelevant to this thread.
 
So again, what is the question?
 
Jan 22, 2017 at 5:48 AM Post #29 of 208
 
 
That 78xx or 79xx power supply cannot exist as stated.  Other components must exist - otherwise it cannot even be UL listed.  Describe all parts - so as to understand how all those parts combined meet international design standards - ie withstand 600+ volts without damage.
I did describe all of the components. And it's nothing unusual, found in most AVRs. Read my post again if you didn't get it the first time.  Transformer, bridge rectifier, filter, 78xx or 79xx.  Pretty standard.  What about that wouldn't pass UL? (It did, BTW).
 
So what is the question?
 
Plug-in protectors may be destroyed by transients made irrelevant by protection routinely found in appliances - ie some appliance today must withstand approaching 1000 volts.
You have provided nothing but a statement to substantiate this. I see no evidence of protection in the Denon AVR, or frankly, a number of other products. It may survive a 600V surge (with accompanying current), but I doubt it would survive a 6kV surge (with accompanying current) without external help. You keep referring to the protection built into appliances. I found a relatively current device without any.
 
Quote:
 Rare transients that might overwhelm that protection (ie once every seven years) are made irrelevant by a properly installed 'whole house' solution.  
You do understand that whole-house protection is not the norm, right? You do get it that most houses don't have it? So yes, the high voltage/current surges MIGHT be made irrelevant IF the whole-house system exists and is properly installed. That's a lot of mights and ifs. Now, back to the real world where that stuff doesn't exist...do you still think no other protection is necessary?
 
What situation prohibits installation of 'whole house' protection?
The lack of:
1. Home-owner awareness that its desirable
2. Home-owner willing to invest in the device and installation
 
Look, I sell them, and install them. They aren't a difficult thing to sell, but they also are not on anyone's radar either. I've never had a customer actually ask for whole-house protection, or ask if his is working. Every time I've brought it up it's been covering all new ground. I can't visit everyone. Most homes don't have it and never will.
 If true, then also stated are the whens, wheres, any whys?
Just stated.
  Anyone can make blanket and subjective statements.  One who did this stuff for many decades has never seen a 'it cannot be done' situation.  Rather than make a generalized, subjective, and vague statement, instead, provide specific example that also says why (with numbers).  
Found at least one situation where the typical whole-house protector could not be installed without a breaker box upgrade, and that was a $2000 project, so it didn't happen. It's not that it cannot be done at all, but cost and customer desire and interest are the limiters. Is that so surprising?
 
Surge is a current source; not a voltage source as assumed.  That mean a same surge might create 5,000 volts or near zero volts.  Same 10% transients that create 1000 volts also creates tiny volts when a 'whole house' solution is properly installed - properly earthed.
It's a voltage and current source.  You can't have current without voltage too.  And technically, the damage is caused by dissipated power, the product of voltage and current.
 
Yeah, and again, back to the real world: whole house protectors aren't generally installed. I haven't started officially testing ground resistance yet, but I have found old ground rods that barely did their job. That's a cheap/easy fix, but the homeowner who self-installs a protection system won't even think to test it. You're looking at the fully protected home, the ideal situation. That's a very small percentage of the total homes with electronics. I easily found an example of equipment without internal protection, I'm sure there are examples of equipment with internal protection. That's really not the point, because I had to dig through a service manual's schematics to see what was done, and nobody else is going to do that. So what would you assume? Protected or not? If you're going to say external protection is unnecessary because ALL equipment has adequate internal protection (obviously not true) and homes have functional whole-house protection (also not true), then I'd avance that the whole concept of ignoring protection because it's already done is at least partly false.
So again, what is the question?

Frankly, I don't know. How about: if there is no whole-house protection, and we are using gear like the Denon without internal protection, should there or should there not be an external stand-alone protection device? If so, what kind? If not, I'll let my customers with gear destroyed by surges call you. Yes, I've had more than a few. Gear damaged by a surge is not covered by warranty, usually a total loss. What do you suggest for that situation?  Tell them surge protection is irrelevant?






 
Jan 22, 2017 at 11:26 PM Post #30 of 208
Look, I sell them, and install them. They aren't a difficult thing to sell, but they also are not on anyone's radar either. I've never had a customer actually ask for whole-house protection, or ask if his is working. Every time I've brought it up it's been covering all new ground. I can't visit everyone. Most homes don't have it and never will.

Ignorance justifies ineffective protection?  'Whole house' protection is routinely installed on incoming TV cable, satellite dish, OTA antenna,and phone line.  Only AC electric is not required to have this effective protection.
 
Yes, a majority do not have it. But are not trooping weekly or monthly to stores to replace surge damaged dishwasher, clocks, refrigerator, dimmer switches, furnace, GFCIs, and central  air conditioner.  Because best protection at each is already inside each.  Concern is for rare transients that can overwhelm existing and superior protection.
 
A telco CO will suffer about 100 surges with each storm.  Why does a town have uninterrupted phone service?  Even COs use this proven solution.  Not plug-in (point of use) protectors.  Problem is that most consumers do not even know of superior protection proven by over 100 years of science and experience.  Since few know, that is proof that nobody will want it?
 
Nonsense. We are discussing solutions.  Ignorance does not justify ignorance.   'Whole house' solution is provided by companies known by any guy for integrity including Keison, Intermatic, Square D, Ditek, Siemens, Clipsal, Polyphaser (an industry benchmark), Syscom, Leviton, ABB, Delta, Erico, General Electric, and Cutler-Hammer (Eaton).  These are available in any electrical supply house.  Even available in Lowes and Home Depot.  A protector is only as effective as its earth ground.  Why would anyone continue using ineffective solutions that have no earth ground?  Why would anyone not market a superior and much less expensive solution?
 
Even a UPS needs 'whole house' protection from a transient that can overwhelm existing superior protection.
 
Correctly noted is that 'whole house' protection is not required by codes.  But if anyone must protect appliances, then it is the only proven and effective solution.  As previous noted, it provides necessary common mode protection.  That is relevant to everyone following this thread.
 

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