[stanalexis]

Is it ok to use the pre-amp output with an unbalanced amp? Basically balanced to unbalanced conversion.

Hi all,
A friend of mine just asked Burson if he could use the C3X with an unbalanced amp using a homemade XLR to RCA cable WITHOUT shortening pin 1 & 3 (= leaving pin 3 litteraly unconnected).
Alex from Burson (very nice guy) clearly answered that only the transformer solution would work. I know this is strange and impractical, because it has always worked for me, but I wanted to let you know (I quote : « To connect the XLR outputs of the C3X to another power amp with RCA inputs you will need the transformer. »).

Apparently it works with the “special” cable, making music, but it damages the op amps...

One has to think that as the manufacturer, Burson knows the subject very well, and I am afraid that if we want to use an unbalanced amp with the C3X, we’ll have to go for the (costly) transformer solution...

Shortening pin 1&3 would work fine only when using as an input, going from an unbalanced source to the C3X.

Have a nice day.

 

[John Buchanan]

Burson Audio Conductor 3X review.



This brand new Burson Audio Conductor 3X replaced a Mytek Digital Stereo 192 DAC and is being used to drive a Beyerdynamic T1 Gen. 2, a Neumann NDH-20 or my wife’s AKG K701. Sources are from a Pioneer Blu-ray drive via a Surface Pro 3 and Surface dock.

Physically, the Conductor 3X is a beautiful piece of high quality, superbly constructed and magic sounding premium gear. May there be more Australian gear produced at this level, rather than the old “it might look as though it was made with tin snips, but it sounds great” excuses for sub-optimal presentation. The only complaint I’ve heard so far (from a few user comments) is that the included USB-A to USA-C input cable isn’t enabling consistent connections. Spend $40 and get yourself a high quality replacement before your Burson set arrives. I’d suggest Burson invest in a run of ultra high quality cables and send one each out to all purchasers of the Conductor 3/3X free of charge, IMHO. That’s it for flies in the ointment!

The software provided is easy to install and works faultlessly on the Surface Pro 3, enabling CDs, DVDs and Blu-rays to play without the occasional manual fiddling that was necessary for the older Mytek. The Burson simply works as it should – automatically adjusting to the supplied sample rates without fuss

The sound of this unit has really surprised me in comparison to the Mytek. Whereas the Mytek could sound a little thin and strident and appeared to overload at higher volumes leading to distortion on John Farnham’s vocals on “Full House”, the sound is transformed on the Burson Conductor 3X. It’s far smoother, with a much better bottom end and there is absolutely no distortion on Farnesy’s vocals now – the vocals are smooth as silk without the previous “bubbly” vocal distortion. The dynamics appear to be limitless (as they should, given the enormous power of the amplifier section), yet there is no audible residual noise when music isn’t playing. No doubt, this is due to the external digital MCPS power supply. I haven’t tried the 4 pin XLR output as yet – just the 6.35mm single ended output, which appears to be more than adequate for both the Beyerdynamic and the Neumann. The Beyerdynamic T1 Gen. 2 sounds like it has been transformed into a different headphone now – seamless left to right, loud to soft with a rather pleasing reduction of the accentuation of the lower treble/upper midrange peak that was far more apparent with the Mytek. I’m not good at hearing headphone depth in the sound-field, so I don’t feel qualified to say anything there. The only time I’ve ever been fooled into hearing a 3D sound-field was through my Stax SRM-Monitor (an electrostatic headphone amplifier and diffuse field equalizer in one beautiful package) and Lambda Nova Signature combination listening to the Stax’ Space Sound Binaural CD, anyway.

With better recordings than “Full House”, it’s like walking through the door of the Apollo Command module, sitting down and launching into space.

For example, Miles Davis’ “Kind Of Blue” – the string bass sounds deep and natural, the drum dynamic - strikes appear instantaneously and disappear just as fast as the sound decays naturally. It sounds a step closer to the fabled Columbia master tape, without the amp “hanging on” to anything that shouldn’t be hung on to.

Chick Corea’s “Super Trio”, now sadly out of print, captures the dynamics of Steve Gadd’s drums effortlessly – cymbals to bass drum, the deep bass and finger plucking of Christian McBride's double bass naturally and the singing and sobbing of Chick Corea’s grand piano with dynamic ease and tonal accuracy. You’ll want to play this sonic and performance treat again and again.



As Molly Meldrum said, and I’ll repeat his words with sincere meaning here, “Do yourself a favour” and buy the Conductor 3 (for a single ended system) or the Conductor 3X for a balanced system. I’m not one for superlatives, but here I am, laying the “best I’ve ever heard” challenge down.



Congratulations Alex and Burson Audio – you’re right up there.

 

[raoultrifan]

One has to think that as the manufacturer, Burson knows the subject very well, and I am afraid that if we want to use an unbalanced amp with the C3X, we’ll have to go for the (costly) transformer solution...

Thanks for letting us know!

 

[raoultrifan]

Streaming via BlueTooth - tests

iPhone 6 white noise test - notice the sharp roll-off after cursor at 19Khz due to the phone's codec or older Apple iOS inside the phone

iPhone 8 starts rolling off visible the trebles after cursor at 20KHz (probably due to the fact that input signal was 44Khz)

Streaming from Lenovo T440 - Blue is the original music played from the USB, while White is BT playback (https://deltaw.org/)
Notice the energy from the trebles starting to fade out gently after getting over 17-17.5KHz (explained why here)

Streaming from iPhone 6 - Blue is the original music played from the USB, while White is BT playback (https://deltaw.org/)
Now the energy from the trebles start to fade-out after passing 16KHz and drops hard after 20KHz.
​

Seems that finding the best streaming device (smartphone, laptop etc.) could be a bit tricky, although I find it really hard to identify with my ears which one is the sound coming from the USB and which one the BT-streaming, at least while listening to regular 2019 pop-dance-trance music. More tests and in-depth reviews and details about the BlueTooth streaming could be read here: https://habr.com/en/post/456182/.

I personally find C3X's BT implementation as top-notch, connection being done almost instantly with all devices tested and the sound quality was very good. So...meanwhile, I enjoy listening to C3X tonight on LCD-2F, HE-560 and T50RP-mk3...not at the same time, of course.

 

[Marutks]

just the 6.35mm single ended output

Does SE output change sound quality in comparison to XLR?

 

[raoultrifan]

Does SE output change sound quality in comparison to XLR?

Placement of the 4 amplifiers from inside C3X
​

As you can see, all four amplifiers inside C3X are identical and their sound should be identical as well, so theoretically the sound coming out from the Jack plug should be identical with the sound coming from the XLR plug.

However, given the way inverted and non-inverted signals are carrier inside a fully balanced design, a lower THD+N and much higher power output will be achieved when listening from the XLR plug. Worth mentioning that most headphones have a cable with an over 1 Ohms resistance per wire (even for the GND wire) and in unbalanced operation this may change the sound, especially on the low-impedance headphones.

Going balanced from head to tail will ensure the lowest EMI/RFI interferences from the outside, a better cross-talk between channels, but also a better damping factor (even is using the same 1 Ohms wires, signal is not references to the GND, so it will matter less).

For more theory about how unbalanced and balanced can influence the signals into headphones wires (especially with longer and high resistive cables) you could read here: http://www.meier-audio.homepage.t-online.de/grounds.htm.

L.E.: Photo was re-edited to properly reflect the V+ and V- balanced amplifiers.

 

[selvakumar]

Placement of the 4 amplifiers from inside C3X
​

As you can see, all four amplifiers inside C3X are identical and their sound should be identical as well, so theoretically the sound coming out from the Jack plug should be identical with the sound coming from the XLR plug.

However, given the way inverted and non-inverted signals are carrier inside a fully balanced design, a lower THD+N and much higher power output will be achieved when listening from the XLR plug. Worth mentioning that most headphones have a cable with an over 1 Ohms resistance per wire (even for the GND wire) and in unbalanced operation this may change the sound, especially on the low-impedance headphones.

Going balanced from head to tail will ensure the lowest EMI/RFI interferences from the outside, a better cross-talk between channels, but also a better damping factor (even is using the same 1 Ohms wires, signal is not references to the GND, so it will matter less).

For more theory about how unbalanced and balanced can influence the signals into headphones wires (especially with longer and high resistive cables) you could read here: http://www.meier-audio.homepage.t-online.de/grounds.htm.

nice work

raoultrifan​

 

[selvakumar]

Placement of the 4 amplifiers from inside C3X
​

As you can see, all four amplifiers inside C3X are identical and their sound should be identical as well, so theoretically the sound coming out from the Jack plug should be identical with the sound coming from the XLR plug.

However, given the way inverted and non-inverted signals are carrier inside a fully balanced design, a lower THD+N and much higher power output will be achieved when listening from the XLR plug. Worth mentioning that most headphones have a cable with an over 1 Ohms resistance per wire (even for the GND wire) and in unbalanced operation this may change the sound, especially on the low-impedance headphones.

Going balanced from head to tail will ensure the lowest EMI/RFI interferences from the outside, a better cross-talk between channels, but also a better damping factor (even is using the same 1 Ohms wires, signal is not references to the GND, so it will matter less).

For more theory about how unbalanced and balanced can influence the signals into headphones wires (especially with longer and high resistive cables) you could read here: http://www.meier-audio.homepage.t-online.de/grounds.htm.

please post the from headphone balanced neutrik xlr jack and part number

 

[raoultrifan]

Hi Selva, I don't know how to see P/N of jack and XLR sockets fromC3X, sorry.

 

[selvakumar]

Hi Selva, I don't know how to see P/N of jack and XLR sockets fromC3X, sorry.

 

[Marutks]

I can hear background noise with ZMF Verite headphones (open and closed). A bit more with Closed Verite. Not when using SE output though.

 

[selvakumar]

I can hear background noise with ZMF Verite headphones (open and closed). A bit more with Closed Verite. Not when using SE output though.

You will hear background noise in balanced since XLR is used for high impedence headphones and SE is for low sensitive headphones and IEMS please check and confirm again

 

[Marutks]

These are 300 ohm cans. I tried both Open and Closed Verites.

 

[selvakumar]

These are 300 ohm cans. I tried both Open and Closed Verites.

impossible need help mate raoultrifan

 

[raoultrifan]

I can hear background noise with ZMF Verite headphones (open and closed). A bit more with Closed Verite. Not when using SE output though.

The closed one are 104dB/V SPL, so it's kinda odd that you have background noise. You might want to test C3X with more cans and post back here.