[Nomax]

@Spawn300Z

Bass cannons in the high price segment also do not really have their justification for me
Just as models that bring too little in the high frequency range with them
(When i look expensive Dacs with dark sounding headphones...for what?😅)
This also applies to the student-like designs...we are in the year 2023❗️

Nomax

PS. and yes and I will be even stricter 😉
(The manufacturers want a lot of money...then they have to convince me)
But with most it fails already at the construct 🙈
Check out Meze👍...a new player that does what Audeze/Abyss etc etc have failed to do in the last 10 years

 

[Exekuhtor]

Well, there's a difference in punch / slam and bass.

Utopia is #2 in punch and slam (that i've heard) but has a flat bass.
1266 is #1 in punch and slam and has a big boosted bass, no midbass bloat.
Susvara has "okish" punch and slam and has a flat bass -> mediocre bass satisfaction (people can't accept that and chase that 3% minimal bass upgrade with 10k+ € amps)
Stellia has also VERY good punch and slam and a big boosted bass but also boosted midbass -> bloat, but some people like that.

The real question for the Nutopia stays the same: When you can get the old model for 2,2k-2,5k€ and the new one is 5k€, how (in)significant is the upgrade? I really like the Utopia and would love to hear the new one, but that will have to wait until Highend Munich. Some people write about bigger soundstage (Hu? Soundstage is never a trait in Focals), more details (but still not Susvara? How many "in betweens" are there?) and more bass (?), but that's not consistent over the majority of the reviews. The graph is slightly shifted down (especially in the treble, and i have zero problem with the treble of the old one). There is not "more bass". Of course when people want to imagine something, and pay 5 grand, and they don't want to accept the fact that it's maybe only a marginally different sidegrade. Maybe they also change cables / amps with the up- (or side)grade to the new one. The best thing that the new model did for me was drastically reduce the price of the original Utopia. Is its sound worth 5k as a TOTL allrounder? Maybe. But is it worth double the price of the old one? Ehhh...

 

[Spawn300Z]

@Spawn300Z

Bass cannons in the high price segment also do not really have their justification for me
Just as models that bring too little in the high frequency range with them
(When i look expensive Dacs with dark sounding headphones...for what?😅)
This also applies to the student-like designs...we are in the year 2023❗️

Nomax

PS. and yes and I will be even stricter 😉
(The manufacturers want a lot of money...then they have to convince me)
But with most it fails already at the construct 🙈
Check out Meze👍...a new player that does what Audeze/Abyss etc etc have failed to do in the last 10 years

I like Meze I have a couple of their headphones. Just was saying they aren’t bass heavy, but have great bass when properly driven.

 

[Nomax]

Well, there's a difference in punch / slam and bass.

Utopia is #2 in punch and slam (that i've heard) but has a flat bass.
1266 is #1 in punch and slam and has a big boosted bass, no midbass bloat.
Susvara has "okish" punch and slam and has a flat bass -> mediocre bass satisfaction (people can't accept that and chase that 3% minimal bass upgrade with 10k+ € amps)
Stellia has also VERY good punch and slam and a big boosted bass but also boosted midbass -> bloat, but some people like that.

The real question for the Nutopia stays the same: When you can get the old model for 2,2k-2,5k€ and the new one is 5k€, how (in)significant is the upgrade? I really like the Utopia and would love to hear the new one, but that will have to wait until Highend Munich. Some people write about bigger soundstage (Hu? Soundstage is never a trait in Focals), more details (but still not Susvara? How many "in betweens" are there?) and more bass (?), but that's not consistent over the majority of the reviews. The graph is slightly shifted down (especially in the treble, and i have zero problem with the treble of the old one). There is not "more bass". Of course when people want to imagine something, and pay 5 grand, and they don't want to accept the fact that it's maybe only a marginally different sidegrade. Maybe they also change cables / amps with the up- (or side)grade to the new one. The best thing that the new model did for me was drastically reduce the price of the original Utopia. Is its sound worth 5k as a TOTL allrounder? Maybe. But is it worth double the price of the old one? Ehhh...

The difference is so significant that you can't achieve this with the best dac, cable or amp 😎

https://www.head-fi.org/threads/focal-utopia-2022-review-measurements.964903/page-46#post-17341488

NOMAX

PS.And honestly...you also have to look at it from the other side...what do we get from the other manufacturers for 5K Euros?😉
The only thing I personally would have liked would be a Pentacon instead of the 6.3mm cable still for the other new owners
(I have my Crystal already 4 years)

 

[number1sixerfan]

Have been paying attention to this thread for a while as a former OG Utopia owner, but the sheer amount of insane hyperbole, marketing and obvious shilling is quite annoying lol. I'm sorry, I've tried for so long not to say it lol. I mention it because I'm pretty sure I'm not the only one to pick up on it (hence the post a few above). Just does quite the disservice unfortunately.

I hope to try it one day, and it's been in consideration, but this thread alone is enough to prevent me from ever paying the obscene price jump for it without hearing it first.

 

[up late]

^ you're not. i haven't got around to giving the nutopia an audition yet so i'll reserve my judgement until then.

 

[Exekuhtor]

Have been paying attention to this thread for a while as a former OG Utopia owner, but the sheer amount of insane hyperbole, marketing and obvious shilling is quite annoying lol. I'm sorry, I've tried for so long not to say it lol. I mention it because I'm pretty sure I'm not the only one to pick up on it (hence the post a few above). Just does quite the disservice unfortunately.

I hope to try it one day, and it's been in consideration, but this thread alone is enough to prevent me from ever paying the obscene price jump for it without hearing it first.

Yup.
People don't get money if you buy the used old model. The industry doesn't move forward if you buy the used old model. It doesn't generate clicks if you title the headline "Utopia 2022 - a minor sidegrade".
Always chase the newest thing. Abyss did the same with their 1266, they kept releasing newer and newer models (now ceramic coated!) and increased the price every time (the TC is 7495€ in germany LOL).
I especially dislike the reviews where they don't even mention the OG model. They just compare the Nutopia to the LCD-5 and other flagships. Really?
Also i'm mad that Focal kept the Lemo connector (Hifiman did a sneaky revision of the Susvara from 2.5mm -> 3.5mm without telling the whole world, it just... happened...).

Strangely, it also does work the other way around, ZMF released the Caldera, not at 5k but at 3,5k. Now they have 4 flasgships close to each other in terms of price, great!

 

[up late]

^ i guess i could change the title of the thread a third time

 

[helljudgement]

Have been paying attention to this thread for a while as a former OG Utopia owner, but the sheer amount of insane hyperbole, marketing and obvious shilling is quite annoying lol. I'm sorry, I've tried for so long not to say it lol. I mention it because I'm pretty sure I'm not the only one to pick up on it (hence the post a few above). Just does quite the disservice unfortunately.

I hope to try it one day, and it's been in consideration, but this thread alone is enough to prevent me from ever paying the obscene price jump for it without hearing it first.

I have heard it. Sonically it certainly doesn't justify the price increase. To my ears it isn't better than the original. The tonal shift between the New Utopia and OG is very obvious with a noticeably warmer tone and a slight bit more emphasis in the mid bass on the newer model and a more energetic, airier treble and cooler more neutral tone on the OG. I can understand the appeal and why there are many who prefer the newer model but sonically I see little reason for most existing owners to shell out the extra to get the newer model. The differences to my ears are not unlike the hd600 and 650 but with 2022 pricing.

I especially dislike the reviews where they don't even mention the OG model. They just compare the Nutopia to the LCD-5 and other flagships. Really?

Personally I see them as one and the same. As far as I can tell the differences in all technical aspects are negligible if not identical but I can certainly understand your frustration.

 

[Nomax]

I like Meze I have a couple of their headphones. Just was saying they aren’t bass heavy, but have great bass when properly driven.

Now one wonders why Audeze&Abyss do not create such constructs as Empy&Liric?
They have been on the market much longer than Anto&Mircea and their prices are much higher

NOMAX

PS.only Dan Clark from the Usa has at the first go created a construct that does justice to the high price segment for me with the stealth 👍
(Yes the tonal performance of Diana PHi 👍in a Meze contstruct by Joe and his sons.....but that will probably never happen😅)

 

[Nomax]

Yup.
People don't get money if you buy the used old model. The industry doesn't move forward if you buy the used old model. It doesn't generate clicks if you title the headline "Utopia 2022 - a minor sidegrade".
Always chase the newest thing. Abyss did the same with their 1266, they kept releasing newer and newer models (now ceramic coated!) and increased the price every time (the TC is 7495€ in germany LOL).
I especially dislike the reviews where they don't even mention the OG model. They just compare the Nutopia to the LCD-5 and other flagships. Really?
Also i'm mad that Focal kept the Lemo connector (Hifiman did a sneaky revision of the Susvara from 2.5mm -> 3.5mm without telling the whole world, it just... happened...).

Strangely, it also does work the other way around, ZMF released the Caldera, not at 5k but at 3,5k. Now they have 4 flasgships close to each other in terms of price, great!

Every Clear MG plays over the Zmf´s....and indeed over all models 😆

NOMAX

PS.I mean 2500 -3500 Euro....for what?🙈
I was almost struck by the blow and was really shocked by Atrium/Verite etc 😂
(Even though I don't like the Hifimans...but the Arya Stealth doesn't do a bad job for 1500 Euros...a bit sharp in the highs...but costs a lot less than ZMF)

 

[bfreedma]

Have been paying attention to this thread for a while as a former OG Utopia owner, but the sheer amount of insane hyperbole, marketing and obvious shilling is quite annoying lol. I'm sorry, I've tried for so long not to say it lol. I mention it because I'm pretty sure I'm not the only one to pick up on it (hence the post a few above). Just does quite the disservice unfortunately.

I hope to try it one day, and it's been in consideration, but this thread alone is enough to prevent me from ever paying the obscene price jump for it without hearing it first.

You are certainly not alone. At least one poster here should be identified as a MOT based on having alleged "inside info" and constant shilling.

 

[mtoc]

Have been paying attention to this thread for a while as a former OG Utopia owner, but the sheer amount of insane hyperbole, marketing and obvious shilling is quite annoying lol. I'm sorry, I've tried for so long not to say it lol.

of course the new one is day and night much better, so many users to prove it, buy and don't doubt (rule 101)

 

[xxx1313]

I do not really understand the whining about the increased price of the Nutopias, so many years after the Utopias came to the market. The price increase is more or less only equal to the headline inflation, even though its driver was improved significantly.

There are headphones more expensive than the Nutopias, which are a freak show in terms of tonality and/or design, imo. In these cases there is ample reason for critizism, but many reviewers do not have the guts to share their true opinion. I am glad that some people like @Nomax speak their mind clearly, even though not everyone needs to think accordingly of course.

The price of masterpiece headphones such as Nutopia, Utopia and DCA Stealth is well justified, whereas the price for some other freaky high end niche headphones is definitely not imho. I appreciate my Nutopias and really enjoy their prowess, but I would not touch many other high end headphones for half or even a third of their prices. Everyone is free to come to another conclusion though and have fun with something I would call a weird, anachronistic or even sh.tty headphones.

Cheers,
Bernie

 

[Nomax]

There are headphones more expensive than the Nutopias, which are a freak show in terms of tonality and/or design, imo.

Cheers,
Bernie

Very good for hollywood 😅
(Now I need a cognac 🤣)

NOMAX

PS.or as Freddie used to say...the show must go on 🙈
Nice evening to everyone 👍