New Esoteric P-05/D-05
Oct 31, 2007 at 6:30 PM Post #61 of 91

spritzer

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I'm looking for a 230v UX-1 to stash away until later though a 100v fitted with an internal step down transformer would work. There isn't an Esoteric dealer here anymore so it would be hard to get new transformers as I assume there is only one set of primaries on the stock units.

I'm not sure how much "worse" the P-03 transport really is...
 
Oct 31, 2007 at 7:42 PM Post #62 of 91

Icarium

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Exactly is it even "worse"? Very debatable and imo not measurable.

Me? I bought Mikeg's R10/SDS combo in 7 1k payment installments. Finally paid it off earlier this month. It's a mint condition bass heavy version with all the packaging in great condition (One of the last sold by the online retailers).
 
Oct 31, 2007 at 8:15 PM Post #63 of 91

spritzer

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I'm sure they could measure some difference but I guess Esoteric figured that they had gone into complete overkill mode when they designed the original VRDS-NEO. I'd still like the original as I like overkill...

The APL owner on the 'Gon doesn't answer my email so I guess I'm back to browsing mode.
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Nov 4, 2007 at 3:20 AM Post #64 of 91

jarnauga

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Only for your information. A local magazine (from Spain) reviewed the Spectral SDR-4000S last december. They ever use good and big photos from the outside and from the inside, last case only if the local dealer lets to do it. And this was the case. The transport is the old "P3" and looks very similar to the "P2s". The reviewer said that is built with plastic (the photos revealed this truth) and a full metal version is offered with the extension "Pro" in the name of the model (and it has balanced outputs). The "normal" version has only single ended outputs and nothing more.

All the money (an absurd amount of bucks) go to a very very good PS system, fully discrete, five sections, etc, and, of course, to the analog output, quite impressive. They don't added neither digital nor analog preamp volume output stage nor upsampling nor digital inputs. They don't use any opamp in the entire system! From power supply, through DAC boards , DAC amp and finally the output stage, the whole system is fully discrete.

A week ago I had a conversation with a dealer of several hi-end brands, including Esoteric. When I ask for his opinion about X-03SE he told me that the transport is excellent but the maker save money with the output stage to fit the bill that they expected. And this decision affects the final sound more than to choose a cheaper mechanicals and improve the boards. He explained that, in his opinion, a player like GamuT CD-3 has better sound and this is the case because they choose a reliable transport and better output stage (better than the esoteric, that is).

Some time ago I believed that Esoteric was a panacea, the top realization of my dreams (using solid state components, of course). But the new Krell Evo 505 (SACD/CD player) and the Audio Research CD7, two expensive examples, choose good transports (400$ for a phillips Pro-2 -the election for the most part of the highend makers- instead of 3000$ for a VRDS-NEO, in the last example) and reliable suppliers (a very big problem with the cheaper Krell SACD Standard). The rest of the money goes to the output stages (discrete and spectacular in the Krell, the best of the valves circuitry in the ARC and without upsampling too, like Spectral) AND max sized power supplies (the Krell way).

I don't know how they sound. But they don't choose that way if they think a better transport and poorer boards improve the sound, IMHO. Maybe if you want the best of both worlds and have the money...
 
Nov 5, 2007 at 8:33 PM Post #65 of 91

Icarium

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Oh no doubt Esoteric skimps when it comes to output stages. I still like the sound signature they go for, but it certainly can be improved upon...

Which is what makes APL's services so appealing. They completely tear out the old output stage and put in a fully discrete/tubed solution amongst the other things their redesign/mod entails.

The esoteric players have 1. Great transport mechanism 2. Great power supply 3. Great chassis (Debatable and less important). The mod shores up the weaknesses.

But even without the mods, I do like the Esoteric sound.
 
Dec 29, 2007 at 6:07 PM Post #66 of 91

Elephas

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I think the P-05/D-05 is better than the Accuphase DP-500 or Chord DAC64, playing Redbook CDs. The gap is even greater with SACDs.

I guess I should post a photo here.

Aristaeus_SR-OmegaHE90.jpg
 
Dec 29, 2007 at 9:08 PM Post #67 of 91

vcoheda

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omg!

awesome setup.
 
Dec 30, 2007 at 1:11 AM Post #68 of 91

howiebrou

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Quote:

Originally Posted by Elephas /img/forum/go_quote.gif
I think the P-05/D-05 is better than the Accuphase DP-500 or Chord DAC64, playing Redbook CDs. The gap is even greater with SACDs.



Over here (Hong Kong) P-05/ D-05 is almost 3 times more expensive than the DP500 and 3.5 times more expensive than the Chord Dac64! So if it was outdone by that I would be shocked. If you add in the blu transport with the Dac 64 then it is still more! (little bit). The proper competitor for the P-05/D-05 is the Accuphase DP 700 due out any minute
wink.gif


Other players in the P-05/D-05 price range include Metronome CD5 signature, Audio Aero Prestige SACD.
redface.gif
 
Jan 13, 2008 at 2:49 AM Post #69 of 91

pompon

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Quote:

Originally Posted by HiWire /img/forum/go_quote.gif
To me, it sounds like Esoteric is implicitly favoring a single-ended design. The balanced output is purely an afterthought to satisfy marketing. I'm glad to know about this, though, since I'd be pretty disappointed if I were a fan of fully-balanced designs. Too much complexity, in my opinion.

Captain Obvious
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I have audition the D-03 Esoteric today.
I was using single end connexion ...

I will upgrade my source before going balanced ...

This DAC is a MAJOR step up to my situation (5000$ cd player is pretty bad in comparaison ...).
 
Jan 13, 2008 at 3:48 AM Post #71 of 91

pompon

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Any one with a very good DAC like D-05 or D-03 have tried to feed dac with a PC (using WAV or lossless format ) ?

How good compare to high end transport like P-03/P-05 playing a CD ?

If I buy a high end DAC, I want to be sure my PC (optical with Kernel streming) will be as good as seperate transport (very good quality) playing the original CD.

I have tried a copy CD vs original CD playing through transport Linn Unidisk to D-03 ... was incredible to see how bad are copy CD to original. Not even close ...
 
Jan 13, 2008 at 5:09 AM Post #72 of 91

vcoheda

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Quote:

Originally Posted by pompon /img/forum/go_quote.gif
I have tried a copy CD vs original CD playing through transport Linn Unidisk to D-03 ... was incredible to see how bad are copy CD to original. Not even close ...


wav copy versus original, a big difference. i find that hard to believe.
 
Jan 13, 2008 at 7:26 AM Post #75 of 91

IPodPJ

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Quote:

Originally Posted by pompon /img/forum/go_quote.gif
Any one with a very good DAC like D-05 or D-03 have tried to feed dac with a PC (using WAV or lossless format ) ?

How good compare to high end transport like P-03/P-05 playing a CD ?

If I buy a high end DAC, I want to be sure my PC (optical with Kernel streming) will be as good as seperate transport (very good quality) playing the original CD.

I have tried a copy CD vs original CD playing through transport Linn Unidisk to D-03 ... was incredible to see how bad are copy CD to original. Not even close ...



If you're concerned about quality, there are several things you can do to help:

1) Go coax instead of optical, and use a good coax cable. Optical has more jitter potential.
2) Use a balanced digital signal (AES/EBU). For those who don't know what that stands for: Audio Engineering Society/European Broadcasting Union
3) Make sure you rip your CD with a program like Exact Audio Copy and verify that all the bits are the same.

The only reason the CD player sounds better is because the transport has higher quality components thus providing a cleaner signal and better filtering than your computer is capable of outputting. If your computer had top quality components and a very high end sound card, there would be no difference at all. A computer is a very noisy component and thus will yield a digital signal that is not as pure and jitter free as the CD player. But this has nothing at all to do with the WAV file having worse quality than the data on the CD. Bits are bits and if the checksum matches, they are identical files.

And I'm assuming that you made a digital copy. Obviously if you record the analog output from your CD player, the quality will be worse.
 

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